DD's refusing to wear a bra, her Head of Year is saying she isn't allowed at school.

[EmmelineW]

DD is 14 (Yr 9) she tried a bra at 12, hated it and has refused to wear one since. She did try a sports bra, which she wore a couple of times in the day but now refuses and would only wear for PE. She's very confident and popular, so it hasn't ever caused any teasing (she normally makes a joke and is very vocal about not wearing one, she says that if she wasn't, she would be bullied because of it).

She had PE today, which was the first lesson she refused to wear her sports bra, she was told to not take part by her PE teacher - her PE teacher is very 'down with the kids' and mentioned it to her privately.

I would just like to say, previously to this, I was called in to make sure that she had a female role model to talk to about periods/bras as it had come to their attention, that was all cleared up.

Head of Year sent her home today because of it and said she isn't allowed back until she wears one, as it's put under the same category as having a short skirt. Where do we stand with this? Does it come under uniform issues? I'm not really sure what they're saying she can't come back for rule wise.

I'd be furious about this.

Some women like to wear bras. Fine.

Some don't like to wear bras. Also fine.

Regardless of whether boobs should be sexualised or not, they are. So if she was wearing a see-through chiffon top or just walking around topless, the school has a point.

But she isn't. She's wearing a cotton shirt. I guess I'd be making sure it wasn't a cheap thin one. That's as far as I'd go.

They cannot MAKE her wear a bra. Fuck that.

I just think it's appropriate. I wouldn't like my dd to go bra less to school , it's not fair I know but in this day and age I feel it would draw unwanted attention . Teenage boys will look and possibly comment. I'd be embarrassed for her, I'm all for feminism btw. It's just how it is with teens unfortunately .

I have taught teenagers for over 20 years and never ever noticed a girl wearing/not wearing a bra (don't teach PE mind.) The uniform in my school is black polo shirt so no one would know, notice or care. I have also taught with a woman teacher who was told to wear a bra but still never did.

School is a learning platform - not somewhere I'd expect my children to either cause unwanted distraction or be distracted by anything as they're there to learn.

It's possible from the OP last comment that perhaps the school immediately thought the child wasn't cared for properly - out of context situation as they (and we) don't know that child's home life or any issues that may be found at that child's home - perhaps sometimes small things are signals for bigger home problems!? Not saying this is the case with OP but it might be something school should follow up on to ensure she's cared for properly - possibly?!

A beach is completely different not even going to invent on that

I am completely shocked by this thread! It's outrageous that so many (assuming) women think this girl should be forced to wear a bra, when she isn't comfortable wearing one, or miss out on education. Just shocking

Some teenage boys (and men) will look and comment no matter what a girl or woman is wearing. It's not the girls' job to package their breasts in a way which will prevent that.

I cannot believe some of the posts on here!

I was bullied in school. They taunted me about my religion and the fact I wore glasses. But I wasnt bullied because i was catholic and wore glasses, i was bullied because there were bullies in my school. My glasses and religion werent the issue.

A girl who's flat chested will get unwanted comments from boys. So will one who develops early, or more obviously than others. And one who's very pretty, or not so pretty.

It is not the girl's responsibility to take on the impossible task of preventing boys from looking at her and commenting on here.

She's braless, anyway, not shirtless ffs!

primitivemom But the OP's DD isn't feeling embarrassed. Do you think she should be? If so, why?

flumpybear please could you show me how the logical chain of reasoning leading from:

female body part X is attractive > gives man an erection > woman needs to cover X body part does not conclude that women should wear burqas?

not somewhere I'd expect my children to either cause unwanted distraction or be distracted by anything as they're there to learn.

So raise your children not to cause distractions by making comments about other people's bodies or to engage with anyone else making those comments.

She's refusing to wear a bra this time, what if the next thing is a skirt that's uncomfy a top that she doesn't like. What if she wanted to be a teacher, doctor etc, not being funny but you'd probably get fired for indecency eventually if you continues refusing and showing your nipples

She isn't showing her nipples.
If she has a skirt that isn't comfortable, she can choose a new one, same with a top.
There is nothing to suggest that she is likely to show her self off when/if she is a teacher, or a dr.

What about the poor boys and their ranging hormones?! Whether you like it or not there are s lot of boys, and men, who are turned on by breasts So women have to wear bras to save men from getting turned on...hey guess what....but fucking hard to hide the fact that woman has breasts!!! And how about men contain themselves? Why is it up to women/girls to protect boys/men & their raging fucking hormones.

Maybe her first go at wearing a bra was uncomfortable. M&S do really soft ones that still give the support a C cup needs. Let her try different sizes and cup sizes till she finds one that's right for her. The tape measure is only a rough guide! I'm sure your DD doesn't want to have droopy saggy breasts as an adult so I think you should have another look at bras.
Hope the school issue gets sorted.

differentnameforthis I am a doctor. Does not wearing a bra somehow invalidate my qualifications?

I do think the uniform policy should be reviewed. In my school it is very practical. Dark polo shirts, trainers and trousers for girls. In a school near where I live, I notice girls in teeny tiny skirts, white shirts, ties and blazers. There is also a fashion for long straightened swishy hair. I think there must be a lot of pressure on girls to conform to a certain look from an early age in some areas.

Sorry, meant littlerabbitface not differentnameforthis.

Stressed I would be embarrassed for her if boys were staring at her, breasts are a private part of the body and I think the girl should protect her modesty. Girls and boys should be smartly and appropriately dressed for school. I don't think the girl is dressing appropriately and I wouldn't advise my dd to go out like that . I don't think her dad would be happy either.

Presumably women survived for around 200,000 years without bras. I'm assuming the men still managed to work and carry on as normal. I'm assuming the women could also hunt, run, swim etc without one?

differentnameforthis I am a doctor. Does not wearing a bra somehow invalidate my qualifications? Not it doesn't, but I never said it did.

I was replying to another poster who suggested she could be fired for not wearing a bra if she were a teacher/dr. Perhaps I didn't make the point very clearly though...I was suggesting that just because she is braless now, doesn't mean she will be always.

I didn't add anything about being braless invalidating qualifications, because I didn't even think that far forward.

Unless I've missed something, we still don't know if it's a case of shirt is see through? When I was at school, shirts were thin enough to see a white pattern on a white bra, in which case nipples would be pretty obvious. If she had the thicker shirts, like the 100% cotton ones, they might provide more coverage? Does she/would she wear a vest? If the school is worried because her nipples are really on show, I do understand this, whether or not nipples should or should not be sexualised. If it's just a case of they don't like the way they hang, then that's ridiculous/non of their damn business!

Sorry, meant littlerabbitface not differentnameforthis. All good.

She has the ones from John Lewis, as that's where they have to get them from (the only shop that has the style).

I don't really see how the nipple thing is a problem, boys have nipples, but DD's aren't noticeable at all, IMO. When I was a teen, mine were basically flat, she's probably inherited that from me. I wouldn't know though, as I don't stare at hers...

I can't be the only one with an overwhelming urge to whip my bra off and go without in response to some of the frankly appalling attitudes on this thread?

If my dd grows up and decides to do the same I will fully support her choice. I can't believe we are even having to discuss it. It is 2016 ffs.

To me it's not being bra less that is the issue but the fact she is vocal about it and the fact that school have raised issues previously that could be seen as safeguarding. For a school to contact home and ask about female role models suggests a much bigger picture. Something has happened that has triggered concerns - prior to bra less PE lesson ... OP has not expanded much on these.
As a teacher I would be concerned that there was something more - this is clearly not just a bra less problem.
Yes I am a feminist and everyone has a right to wear what the want sadly my melonesque f cups mean I need a bra but there is a need for decorum in certain situations. We have a dress code as teachers in my school where we have to look professional and basically have no low cut tops etc. No clothes that may lead to safeguarding issues with pupils (we had a couple of student teachers recently one who dressed like she was in Geordie Shore with very low cut tops and short skirts and one who wore extremely tight trousers that displayed the fact he dressed to the left). Both were spoken to about standards and how to dress around children and professionally.
There is much more to this than an argument with a pe teacher ...

I would be embarrassed for her if boys were staring at her, breasts are a private part of the body and I think the girl should protect her modesty

The girl isn't embarrassed though. And perhaps boys need to be taught not to stare at a girls chest?

She is protecting her modesty, she is wearing a shirt. Bras are not a compulsory item of clothing. You go out with out a top & bra on, you are likely to be arrested if seen by a police officer. They aren't going to arrest you for going braless.

Me too catthief! Coincidently I'm not wearing one today otherwise I would have been tempted.