Brexit rage

[holeinyourhead]

What's happened in the last 10 days has really affected me. It's all I think about tbh and I feel so enraged at seeing the politicians lie to us so lavishly then bail on us so swiftly, yet I'm completely powerless to do anything. I marched, I wrote to my MP, I've signed petitions. I'm obviously one of the 48% who wanted to remain. I can't find fault with the 52% who voted to leave, it's not their fault. It's a democratic process, I understand that of course. Everyone's entitled to their view and it's not that I'm a sore loser. But the catastrophic fallout isn't what even the most hardline leave voter would have wished for, there's no Brexit plan, and the future looks very bleak. I was at a conference today and a Conservative MP and a Brussels Eurocrats both agreed a recession in the medium term is now inevitable. People around me seem to be getting on with things - I wish I could too - but I've been very tearful and sleepless and worried sick. I run a European business just out of start up phase, employing a handful of people who by chance are not British born and who are now very nervous themselves about the future. The more I read the more hopeless I feel with each passing resignation. AIBU to feel like this? Does anyone else feel the same? Am I going nuts?!! I feel very alone.

I also get angrier for coming on threads like this, and anticipating that someone who supported Brexit will come along and explain in a coherent, substantiated way why they think supporting Brexit was correct in the circumstances, but instead we have poster after poster spouting the same BS (weeks?) that is dragging this country into a hole. Madness.

Wrt the emergency budget, well that went out the window when Cameron resigned and article 50 wasn't triggered. The treasury have been fairly clear that there will be a new budget needed sooner rather than later now, regardless of when or if the article 50 process starts.

I'm pretty clued up on economic models but even I couldn't say we'd definitely make long term gains if we had stayed where we were let alone willingly dumped our economy. Statements like that give me the rage.

All of us exiters knew it would be a rocky few weeks for long term gain

I see Project Baseless Optimism/Lying Through Our Teeth has confined post-referendum.

Yabba, you seem confused about the difference between 'predictions you disagree with but no one knows yet whether they were correct yet' and 'lies the Leave campaign have owned up to remarkably quickly'.

indy100.independent.co.uk/article/theres-a-conspiracy-theory-that-mark-carney-is-deliberately-tanking-the-pound--Z1gzDmFIUrb

Don't worry folks.
The economy tanking is just a conspiracy by the BoE Canadian sabotager Carney.

gallows humour will get you through

YANBU - I am still reeling and worried for my kids future. I am fuming at the politicians who have lied and now run away. Disgusting.

A downturn certainly seems likely, but that can be triggered by many things. It is not, in itself, something to worry about.

My organisation is looking at an immediate loss of income from the EU running into millions and consequently hundreds of jobs losses. Strangely enough we do feel the "downturn" is something to worry about.

Around a third of our staff (highly skilled, higher and additional rate taxpayers) are non-British EU citizens. Many have been in the UK for 10, 20 or even 30 years. Now they face an uncertain future: they will almost certainly be allowed to remain, but the conditions are unclear: will they have to pay several thousand for "indefinite leave to remain" stamps in their passports? If they retire to their home countries, will they have rights to healthcare? Will their state pensions (following decades of contributions) be frozen if they move abroad? Their lives and futures are in turmoil.

How is the pound being its lowest since 1985, a plummeting FTSE 250 and wide spread panic about UK property investment anything other than a disaster?

It's not being reported everywhere and people remain in a state of denial.

YANBU OP, I have felt awful since the referendum as well. Have been on 2 marches, signed a million petitions, have felt shocked and bereft. Still need to write to my MP and join the LibDems.

I think leaving this decision up to us was a big big mistake and I cannot believe that the fate of the country has been decided by Cameron's wanting to appease half of his party and Boris' desire to be PM . Not to mention the propaganda, dog whistling and misinformation.

Your business needs to be part of making things better, you need to channel the feelings

WTF does this even mean?! I'll have some of what you're smoking

But really, it's completely fucked. It's like falling down a rabbit hole.

And I really really feel for the people dealing with the fall-out. Including the Brits living and working in the EU who also don't have a clue what the future will hold. Mixed marriages, jobs, kids. Can't plan nothing cos it's all up in the air.

Yep. The lunatics took over the asylum.

Absolutely nothing to worry about here.

EU provides peace ( ask Ukraine about that? )

Ukraine isn't in the EU. Its former president refused to sign an association agreement with the EU, and that triggered the conflict between pro-EU and pro-Russian factions, I think.....

The EU itself was not responsible for the problems in Ukraine though. No agreement was ever signed.

The Leave vote was just shy of 52% of the people who voted. But 9 million people didn't vote. I think it's reasonable to assume they weren't bothered and do accepted the status quo, which makes the Leave vote far less sure.

It isn't reasonable to assume anything about the vote other than that the majority of those who voted chose Leave.

There is absolutely no guarantee that the outcome would have been the other way, and Remainers happily appropriating the non voters to their side do themselves no favours, only stoke their own sense of righteous anger.

There are strong feelings from those who wanted to remain, but there were strong feelings too from those who wanted to leave. I voted remain, but I'm not dismissing the leavers or their concerns.

The result was leave, and that's what we have to work with.

I lived for 19 years in the UK and never applied for a passport, it seemed pointless as I am a European! I am in shock over the vote and even worse people's denial of the evident catastrophe this is for the country. The rise in far right nationalism, the emboldening of racists, the economic meltdown...it's not going to happen, it's here.

I was reading a detailed article of trade treaties. It suggested that legally the UK (or parts of it) cannot negotiate anything other than exit terms for two years once Article 50 is invoked. Then there will be the mammoth task of renegotiating with everyone, starting with entry into the WTO. Lithuania recently took 7 years to negotiate its entry into the WTO, while Russia's negotiations took 20 years. The Canadian trade treaty with the EU took 7 years plus another two to ratify. What is the UK going to do without trade treaties for 10 years plus? This is end of days stuff.

Oh and to the poster who said the UK is 'still the fifth biggest economy in the world": uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-france-idUKKCN0ZM1SK - oops.

Yabba the IMF is not an EU remit. Parent organisation is The UN.

Bookmarking to come back to in a year.

This obviously is just a thread for remainders to hey hysterical with each other and only want to hear from people that agree.

Worried for my children's future

The resesion was due either way, house prices would of eventually tanked if we remained.

What's particularly pissing me off at the moment is the DM all those who are accusing Remainers of "talking down" the economy.

Seriously? The fuckwits 'Leavers' have voted to completely ruin us, and we're expected to pretend everything's just peachy?

OP I felt really sad the first week and didn't get to sleep well. The politics fiasco from all parties didnt make me feel better. Worst was I thought I should have forseen it and prepared better financially. I still think that, and feel a bit unreal as if events are running faster than I can plan for.
This week I am feeling a bit better and everyday life and work carries on.

But the Brexit vote and the MP's responses and the Chilcott inquiry confirm my feelings that this is not Britain's finest hour and I am ashamed.

I can only engage with the whole thing because i'm not upset. Unhappy but not upset.
If I were furious I'd have to tune out completely to keep my sanity.

Lies by remain:
Emergency budget

Or did Osborne change his mind, or just not done it yet? BoE has done emergency measures.

4300 pounds worse off
It's a long term thing, we don't know if it's true or not yet; anyway, it was a modelling estimate not a promise. It was badly presented though, fair enough; it's an opportunity cost not a cost out of pocket.

Ww3
Another long term one...

EU provides peace
Within EU it definitely promotes peace. But can't promise it, fair enough.

Trade wars
Long term, we haven't even invoked A50 yet. .. and trade wars were presented as opinion not fact.

Obama and all he said (lame duck president)
The IMF and whatever they say
Long term.. and it was presented as (expert) opinion not fact.

Saying that the EU never got its accounts signed off in recent years was a bald-faced untruth, though. Nothing compares to that for sheer mendacity.

I am European, married to a British man, two children. I am going through a process very much like grieving that started with the shock result in the early hours of that Thursday: tears, sadness, anger, then I pull myself up but the process starts again. Two close relatives of my husband voted Leave, their reasons: "it's only a little island, can't let everyone in; we were fine before the EU and we'll be fine again; we need our democracy back; it's going to be great when we open up the world market to us". They know that I am scared to speak my language in public with my children and that I'm upset about the surge in xenophobic incidents, but apparently racism is everywhere anyway and I'm being dramatic. I have told my husband that I don't want to see them for a while. So, so upset, considering all possible options but don't want to leave London as it's now my home and have many wonderful British friends who are also appalled.

This obviously is just a thread for remainders to hey hysterical with each other and only want to hear from people that agree.

Well spotted....what gave it away?

People are allowed to be upset and start threads about this

There is huge public anxiety in Britain. That is the mark of a fundamentally decent society. All of us, whatever our views, whatever our parties, know that the kind of people contacting us are very different from many of those with whom we deal regularly. They are the kind of people who say, 'I have never contacted a Member of Parliament before,' or 'I’ve never been politically active before.' They are the kind of people who have never gone on a march or attended a vigil before."

This kind of feels right to post here. Its a quote from Charles Kennedy about the Iraq War in a speech to the House of Commons.

...and all for a bunch of lies told by some psychopathic politicians who've now fucked off to make loads more money in the after dinner speech circuit... and there's no stopping it now. This is the democracy they voted for!

I also feel the same OP. And get slightly enraged by clueless comments like 'a rocky few weeks' and recession being a strong word. FFS. It will take us two years minimum to negotiate an exit deal and meanwhile doubt about the outcome will stop companies investing. Then thousands of supply chains must be remade, and we will probably have to comply with everything we did before to access the single market. And yet you think it will only be a matter of weeks and that recession is a strong word. Think again.

Another thing that depresses me is that if Scotland leaves the UK we will be stuck in Tory hell forever.

That's before we even approach the issues facing Northern Ireland.

Yanbu, disaster doesn't even cover it