To think breastmilk is not more important than the mother's wellbeing?

[Throughautomaticdoors]

I have expressed for dd exclusively for 27 weeks. It has been horrific but ultimately my choice. It's left me extremely tired and run down as I'm expressing 7 times a day, twice in the night, plus dd is also awake in the night so I'm getting maybe two hours sleep in any one block. I have pnd and also I'm taking painkiller every day as I've started getting awful headaches, I think because I'm so tired. I have an older dc too.

I saw my hv who said that whilst she wasn't allowed to tell me to stop she did think I should seriously consider winding it down and said she would ask infant feeding to speak to me about a plan of how to stop or reduce the expressing.

Infant feeding rang me yesterday and frankly they are ridiculous. The lady I spoke to (who I've encountered before and last time advised me to express every two hours) told me that six months breast milk is a minimum and actually it's better to carry on for two years to get any real benefit. I told her I had pnd and how basically the last six months had been dreadful, how tired I was and how I can't go anywhere because I have to be home to express and she suggested that I go five hours in the day but express more in the night. She said not to introduce formula as it's not suitable for babies digestive systems?! This woman isn't medically qualified by the way, she is a 'normal mum' who breastfed her four children. She told me breastmilk halves the length of any illness they might get and used that aggregating phrase 'liquid gold.'

Aibu to think at some point the health of the mother has to matter more than the supposed benefits of breast milk. I'm quite annoyed about it.

This always breaks my heart.

I had a similar experience. I was practically wild from it by about 22 weeks. I even ended up getting involved with this study of breastfeeding and having my latch and feeding viewed on ultrasound, I was desperate to keep going and giving it literally EVERY THING I had. Every thing.

Next pregnancy, I suffered extreme anxiety about breastfeeding and went to extreme lengths with colostrum expressing overnight and eating all sorts of weird foods and becoming absolutely OBSESSED (literally) with weighing my baby (OCD) which led to PND and though ds2 seemed to be feeding beautifully and contentedly, he never thrived... he dropped way off the scales and I literally had a breakdown. A breakdown.

It is now nearly seven years on from all of it and it just horrifies me that no one ever took a step back and looked at how very unreasonable and obsessive I had become about breastfeeding, and used that information to support me better rather than shaming, shaming, shaming.

In reality I was a child sexual abuse and later rape survivor who was living hundreds of miles from my family with no friends with babies who had had a very traumatic birth and was suffering extremely physically... and all anyone gave one shiny shit about was statistics about the "benefits" of breastfeeding.

Maternal mental distress is a major cause of maternal mortality in the perinatal period. It is not to be fucking trifled with because of public health policy and advice should be tailored to individuals on case by case bases, not in a context-insensitive paint-by-numbers sort of way.

I'm so sorry you've been through this too .

Well mini when I realised she was the mad woman who'd told me to express 12 times a day in the beginning I didn't really bother to engage with her much more. I pulled 'omg' faces at dh and got her off the phone as quickly as possible. I knew she would be of no help.

That's awful fusion

I have seen a perinatal psychiatrist recently and she said it makes her angry when they say breastfeeding reduces risk of pnd. She says part of can what cause pnd depression is guilt over not being able to feed and all the pressure put on you so therefore the reason you are less likely to suffer pnd if you are feeding is because you don't feel guilty.

"it makes her angry when they say breastfeeding reduces risk of pnd. She says part of can what cause pnd depression is guilt over not being able to feed and all the pressure put on you so therefore the reason you are less likely to suffer pnd if you are feeding is because you don't feel guilty."

Erm, that seems a bit simplistic. I had RAGING PND while breastfeeding (like, seriously going lala screaming about to throw myself into the sea PND, hoorah for getting all the drugs) and while I didn't feel guilty about breastfeeding I felt bloody terrible about everything else. I know quite a few BF mums with PND who felt the same. And breastfeeding personally did actually help me in that it was one thing I felt vaguely in control of and I do think the hormones during feeding were calming. Before I saw the proper mental health team in my hospital I kept being told by well-meaning people that I should "give myself permission to stop so I could get some rest" and "stop martyring myself" and I kept trying to explain that actually I felt fine about it. Went on to feed DS1 til he was two.

All not saying that anyone should breastfeed to avoid PND as that's clearly absolute rubbish, and BF statistics are obviously not more important than women's mental health (I'm so sorry you had that awful experience, fusion), but I dislike the way some people (not previous posters here) brandish "BF GUILT GIVES WOMEN PND" as a way to rubbish any BF promotion at all. BF women get PND too, and plenty of women don't BF and feel not a jot guilty about it, and rightly so.

Ahem. Rant over.

That's not what she meant... I think she was just saying it because I was telling her how guilty I felt at failing.
Of course it isn't the only reason. Or even any part of the reason for lots of women

Sorry you had such a tough time

"Sorry you had such a tough time"

Thanks! Yeah, it was pretty horrible but I'm all better now. Thank goodness for modern medicine.

Oh OP I feel so sorry for you - PND really sucks whatever else may or may not be going on. My milk never came in with DD2 and I recall the guilt I felt whenever someone scowled at me for buying formula. The world really does seem set against women who don't breast feed.

As far as PND is concerned every mother is different and for some feeding can help and for others - and you sound as if you are one of them - stopping is likely to help if only so that you can get some sleep.Look after yourself as the most important thing for your child is a well mother and pester the PND team for all the support you can to get you over this - it does get better eventually.

I would make a complain about the women for a start and then start reducing the amount (or just stop if you want to) you are expressing.
You have done amazingly and should be proud of yourself!!

Seriously, I am in absolute awe of anyone who does exclusive expressing because it seems like So. Much. Work. 27 weeks is AMAZING.

OP I really don't know how you have managed that long. DS2 started refusing the breast 3 days ago and I'm on my knees with the expressing and feeding. Bf was a struggle before that so it's been 5 weeks of no sleep how have you managed 27? I'm already having to give formula because I seem to be getting less and less each time I express.

Please complain because if I got similar advice at this point I think I would just sit in the corner and cry. I feel guilty enough already.

You have done so fantastically well to express for as long as you have.

Ignore that muppet of a woman, wind down your expressing (as you probably know you shouldn't just stop as it can cause engorged sore boobs etc) and start introducing bottles.

You need sleep! And if you don't have to worry about expressing all the time you should be able to rest a little more.

I expressed for 8 weeks with DC1 and it was utterly miserable. He was actually an OK sleeper and would go down for 2-4h periods almost from birth. I had to set alarms night and day to express and I found sitting there are 4am with my breast pump whilst the baby slept quite soul destroying.

Moving to formula was when I finally began to enjoy my baby.

No PND for me so I can only imagine how you feel expressing with PND!

With DC2 I mad the vow that it was BF or FF and no faffing with expressing.... as it happens DC2 was a bottle refuser and a boob fiend (I am still breast feeding at 17m)

You need to do what is best for yourself OP, baby will be fine!

Oh and definitely complain about thst absolute idiot of a woman. That's not breastfeeding support its bullying and based on incorrect info. (And I say that as a breastfeeding supporter with 2 breastfed babies)

Ignore the infant feeding woman, she is talking crap, any breastmilk however little it is, is beneficial. Your baby will be fine if you stop, formula is designed for babies and it is safe, use it and don't look back. Your health and well being are important. I would make a complaint against that woman. You have done fantastically well, I expressed for 9 months until supply stopped, it is very hard work. You need to not express in the night, night time is for sleep, and resting, which is what you need to do.

Please stop now, this sounds twee but the happier you are the happier your baby will be. I'm in no way trained or knowledgable so feel free to ignore me but I would assume getting more sleep would help your pnd also. You've done this for 6 months now, move on to the next thing as this isn't working anymore and forcing yourself will only taint your memories of this time.

I was made to express after every feed while in hospital with DS after he (allegedly) suffered too much weight loss. It was horrible even for a couple of days, particularly at night so you are amazing to have done it for this long.

I did express again when I went back to work at 7 months but that was only twice a day, so manageable - and more to the point completely my choice with nobody pushing me either way.

Make a complaint about the woman and ignore what she said. Using the two year thing as a reason to guilt trip you is ridiculous anyway - I'd have happily carried on until then, but DS stopped at 14 months, no point anyone lecturing me about it, it wasn't my decision!!

My daughter was taken to a large cardiac ward straight after birth and was nil by mouth for the first week of her life. The nurses were adamant I should express and sent me to a small box room with bottles and an expressing machine. I hadn't had any skin to skin with her and she was lying in a hospital cot surrounded by machines. I didn't want to leave her for a second but the nurses were adamant and frowned when I came back an hour later with nothing, hoarse from crying and feeling like I was failing my sick child. She ended up needing special prescription milk through an ng tube anyway and as soon as I accepted that my baby being fed was the important thing I felt like a huge weight had lifted.
I would complain about that lady on the phone.

Well done, OP, for expressing for so long. Perhaps I have it wrong, but at 27 weeks, your baby is just over the 6 month mark so you are (probably) thinking about introducing food to him or her anyway. By using formula, you get the chance to relax and enjoy your baby and the next stage of feeding them.

Not that you need a reason. :-) If it works for you, do it.

You have done amazingly well I managed to express for 10 weeks and wanted to shoot myself by the end of it.

As a NICU Nurse I've worked with several different infant feeding teams and some of them are just awful. I've had words with them on occasion because they've been upsetting mums who are already stressed and exhausted from having a baby on NICU.

We do encourage expressing if the babies are premature or have risk factors for gut infections/malformations. If there is a medical indication for breast milk and mum can't or doesn't want to express then we get donor breast milk otherwise we give formula.

If you feel up to it I would complain about the person you spoke to. It won't be long before they upset someone who isn't able to think rationally and who will make themselves ill persisting with breast feeding/expressing when it just isn't right for them.

hadenough that's horrible, I'm sorry that happened to you. Sometimes I wonder where the humanity and empathy is in people

OP you do not need anyone's permission or approval to stop breastfeeding. Please do not even entertain what the infant feeding woman was saying (remember she has an agenda to push) if you feel you are ready to stop. Its 100% down to you, you dont need to consult with anyone. Do what is best for you.

OP, don't beat yourself up, there's nothing wring with formula.

That woman needs a very firm one-sided conversation with someone who knows what they are talking about.

Like I have said before these WHO recommendations also have to encompass countries where fresh water for formula is not available, and where formula may be watered down. And where breastfeeding is encouraged for 2 years in order to delay periods so mothers in under-developed countries do not get pregnant again - because frankly they have no choice in the matter, no access to contraceptives. Their only chance to not have a baby every single year is to breastfeed the child for longer.

HadEnough that's utterly disgraceful love.

Op If you were my dd I would have told you to stop ages ago. You don't actually need permission off anyone though it's your baby and your body.

My dil had extreme pressure put on her by a yoga teacher to continue BF when she wanted to stop. Silly bitch. I told her to ignore anyone abs do what she thought best.

Please get someone to report that infant feeding lunatic idiot.

Sadie y y although you can get pregnant while bf. But your points are spot on.