Stop Moaning! You had your chance to change things and now you've Blown It.

[iwuddarryl]

If Remain wins, for years to come, whenever something goes wrong, be it lack of housing, overcrowding, not enough school places, cuts in social benefits, lack of work, etc etc etc,
People will get told:

You had your chance, a once in a lifetime chance to change things and gain back control. So don't go complaining now that things have eventually gone tits up.

That's going to happen. Isn't it?

you read it here first

We can always have another referendum a few years down the line if things don't work out, either way.

Do you really think Britain can just jump in and out when it suits them? Yes, it's the hokey-pokey union.

"Keep dragging your knuckles"

Just why is that necessary?

Off to vote Remain now. Toodle pip

I'm sorry. Got carried away , I'm more than normal grumpy as I've given up smoking cold turkey and its driving me crazy.

if you find yourself agreeing with Gove, Farage and Boris then you probably need to check yourself into an institution.

Enjoy the thrill of democracy!

Cold turkey is brave. Well done.

Just why is that necessary?

I think that she got the wrong phrase there. She meant to say "bigoted how dare you have a different opinion to me woman."

Might also explain why I've become addicted to posting on mumsnet

By refusing to lead and make a decision, by offering a vote winning referendum, Dave has ensured we blame each other and carry on bickering and blaming each other regardless of outcome.

Excellent point ShowOfHands.

It's unusual to have such a consensus on any issue as there has been against leaving the EU at this time. I seem to remember there was a consensus of experts that we should join the euro.........

if you find yourself agreeing with Gove, Farage and Boris then you probably need to check yourself into an institution. I raise you Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and Gerry Adams.

I am feeling so despondent. My guess is that remain will win by a small margin and that in the following days, weeks and months I and others who either speak with an accent or have the wrong ethnic look will be subjected to causal micro aggression by Brexiters who bought into the whole foreigners are leeches hype. I am not looking forward to this experience.

And in the more unlikely scenario of a brexit, those voices will become more confident and less stealth whilst the economy takes a hit and the country is in limbo for the next few years whilst the divorce proceedings are carried out.

I need to tidy and clean the house and shop for a playdate tea but can't bring myself to get up and go.

I expect that REMAIN will win by about 10% points.

We can always have another referendum a few years down the line if things don't work out, either way.
Well the SNP seem to think that's possible if you don't get the result you wanted ....

Sorry top line was a quote from pp.

Its going to be so close almost half the population are going to be unhappy which ever way it goes. It going to be a bumpy time

they have to pander to the electorate to a degree or else they don't get voted in.

You'll find that politicians quite like to listen to their unelected technical advisors as well as influential business lobby groups and that the ordinary man and woman on the street is not their first priority even when we are not in the EU any longer.

Vote with your heart

OMG. Seriously? In response to voting based on feeling rather than rational arguments:

Why Hitler was loved:

"he also brought order to the collective German psyche, that had been reeling from a breakdown in social values and national cohesion."

"He projected an aura of strength, after a period of weakness and uncertainty; his regime created full employment; he seemed to fulfill a German self-concept of superiority. He gave people hope and promised easy victory."

"He was a fervent nationalist. Many of his fellow German countrymen believed Germany had been unfairly punished for its role in World War I, and his promises to restore the glory of Germany gave him lots of support."

"At the time he began his rise, the German people were demoralized. Germany's government was in gigantic debt having to pay war reparations to the Allies for WWI. The government solution was to print more money triggering enormous inflation.

Hitler began his rise claiming the Germans were a superior race and that all of their problems were caused by a certain people originally from Jerusalem. The entire "you're strong and the problems aren't your fault" was quite popular."

The myth of the cohesive Brtish English psyche, British values and renewed self-concept based on nationalist ideas...... Very, very worrying times.

My guess is that remain will win by a small margin and that in the following days, weeks and months I and others who either speak with an accent or have the wrong ethnic look will be subjected to causal micro aggression by Brexiters who bought into the whole foreigners are leeches hype. I am not looking forward to this experience.

Where do you get that from bacimamma? Brexiters don't look on immigrants as leeches. We are a densely-populated country, we don't need to be any more densely populated because we haven't got the infrastructure. That's the long and the short of it. It's nothing to do with individuals.
I'm not trying to negate any hate-crime that you have faced but, similarly, please don't stereotype all Brexiters as racists.

bacimamma wins the Godwin's Law prize.

I've only read the first page, I live in Germany, of course not everyone supports Merkel. It's not as if the support for Cameron is shit hot is it?

But, I see that has already been covered. Scwabish, I think I know who you are, hello!

bacimamma Thanks for that link, that's an excellent article. I've been really struggling with this - all the people I align myself with politically in RL are voting Remain. My heart was kind of veering towards Leave but that article has genuinely made me think that voting Remain is the right thing to do whereas I would have ended up voting Remain reluctantly because of the influence of people I generally agree with.

"That's the long and the short of it. It's nothing to do with individuals."

That's easy for you to say if you have never been at the receiving end of racism or xenophobia. It kind of feels personal.

"Brexiters don't look on immigrants as leeches."
Maybe not all Brexiters but the Brexit campaign was all about immigrants taking away school places, housing, using the NHS etc.

"I'm not trying to negate any hate-crime that you have faced"

If I had experienced hate crime I would have reported it to the police. If you read my post I am talking about microagression although I wouldn't be surprise if actual hate crimes would increase too but that is not what I refereed to.

The Brexit campaign wasn't all about that ..

Does seem ridiculous that everything wrong with the country is now being blamed on being in the EU and not the govt in power.

purit poor attempt to shoot down my reply to the naive 'vote with your heart' statement. I stand by what I posted: romantic notions of 'voting with your heart to protect your fatherland' are dangerous.