To be worried that the Brexiteers might be wrong and an economic disaster is waiting if we leave?

[Girlwithnotattoos]

What if we wake up on Friday out of the EU, probably nothing immediately other than some soul searching by the remainders. But what about in the months to come? What if all the economists and world leaders were right? We could be heading down the swanny big time, companies moving to the EU proper, jobs going left right and centre, deficit increasing because of lost revenues (taxes, vat etc).

I've listened to the fervent Brexiteers who have dismissed everything put to them as propaganda and yet they still haven't come up with a plan to counter the 'what if' scenarios. Am I the only one to be worried that nobody has a plan B if the economy does slow down to tune of 1.4%to 6% as predicted bearing in mind that a reduction of just 0.4% would counteract any saving to be made on what we contribute to the EU?

So because there might be violence from angry people we should vote to leave ?
Even if it affects everybody for the worse?

mama And that is wrong how? How does anyone get radicalised?
How do you know it has nothing to do with Brexit? do you have access to the trial?
Anyways, we should be careful of contempt so I'll go no further.

nations survive outside the EU I think you need to ask yourself why you think we can't? Is this true? Or do you think its EU propaganda?

Of course we can survive outside the EU ... as long as we don't mind being much less influential in the world, both politically and economically.

this is also the sort of attitude I feel is in Brussels, they know whats best for us.

They? Do you mean the people we voted for to represent us during the last European elections?

Leave campaigners point to Norway and Switzerland to show how being outside the EU can work but they rarely remember that the price of accessing the single market for these countries has been massive contributions to the union's running costs and signing up to free movement of people. The agreements facilitating such arrangements for the UK would massively compromise our ability to do exactly as we wish.

The EU simply cannot be seen to allow us to enjoy the benefits of the EU minus the obligations.

Voters also need to consider how much of their dissatisfaction with Britain is connected to factors not resulting from the EU - austerity measures, the recession, even immigration will still be a huge issue.

It's all very well to want to get out but there has to be a viable alternative to vote for. At present, there is no viable alternative and it's not going to appear out of the ether next week. What we do have are experts of all kinds explaining that life outside the EU may well be a great deal harder and while we might have a little more power, we would also have a great deal less influence and may well be a great deal worse off.

It depresses me to think that groundbreaking British scientific research is currently funded by EU money (many times more than what Britain pays in to that pot) and that simply won't be available anymore if Brexit happens. We wouldn't be appointed to lead European research again, or even be able to carry out those research projects. And that's just one discipline. When Brexit talks about the amount of money leaving the country to go to the EU, they fail to mention that some areas of British life receive back many times what we give, and this would simply cease.

Whilst I don't doubt the UK would be fine outside EU economically if it had never joined. I think leaving the EU will lead to huge economic upheaval and that the majority of the economic impact will be felt by the people who are being promised gold paved streets if we leave.

Global competition isn't going to disappear if we leave the EU. Immigration will probably decrease but only as a result of there being fewer jobs rather than the raising of a drawbridge across the channel.

If a country wants to fair well in a global economy the best way to do that is not to be isolationist but to equip the citizens working in that economy with the education and skills we need to do well.

The UK benefits from an independent monetary policy, a flexible exchange rate and a central bank that takes decisions specifically for our own economy's needs. Surely we will also benefit from being able to make national decisions about trade and regulation.

Surely we will also benefit from being able to make national decisions about trade and regulation.

No, we will still have to negotiate because the people we're trading with will continue to make most of the rules. We will still be playing the EU game as Norway and Switzerland do, but whilst negotiating a very difficult and probably austere period during which our poorest will suffer most. For which Boris has already indicated he is planning to apologist (which won't give us the jobs back or buy anyone's tea or school uniform).

Many businesses will be making arrangements to leave next week if Brexit goes ahead. Don't leave it until that point to ask Boris how he plans to look after the hardworking people who will be made redundant. He has no plans. No idea. He doesn't have the moral character to care, either. This is what the majority of business leaders are trying to tell us.

Although we're an island, we rely on the rest of the world to buy our goods and our success depends not only on what we do but what we can get them to do. On the whole, the rest of the world ranges from thinking Brexit is a dreadful idea to having a significant personal interest in making sure this won't work out well for us.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/21/boris-johnson-will-make-tv-apology-if-brexit-triggers-recession

Well Boris doesn't think so.

I think he should just go the whole hog and say he'll apologise whilst being gunged if there is a recession after Brexit, simply because the whole idea of a tv apology in the event of a Brexit Recession is so utterly laughable in the first place. Its politics goes all Reality TV.

Couldn't we just have stuck them all in the Big Brother House from the outset and decided things that way? It'd have been much more civilised.

Couldn't we just have stuck them all in the Big Brother House from the outset and decided things that way?

would have been TV gold With sturgoen, Farage, Izzard and Geldoff etc.

No, we will still have to negotiate because the people we're trading with will continue to make most of the rules

and....we can make rules too cant we

business makes business not politics. They want to sell cars, we want to buy them,simple.

Leave campaigners point to Norway and Switzerland to show how being outside the EU can work but they rarely remember that the price of accessing the single market for these countries has been massive contributions to the union's running costs and signing up to free movement of people

Disagree.

Leave say we can look to those countries as guidance for some areas.

Remain keep doggley trotting these two out as forgone conclusions as to what UK will have to have.

As Andrea Leadsom said " 50 countries trade outside EU only 2/3 have free movement"

The UK is smaller than the EU it really isn't far fetched to suggest our bargaining power in securing new trade deals with the rest of the world will reduce.

The amount of time, effort and money put into securing those trade deals should not be under estimated.

Looking at what the FTSE was doing last week when Leave seemed to be gathering momentum it's clear to me that the leave vote would result in a serious stock market crash (and subsequent recession) featuring major bank collapses and various trauma.

It's certain to happen whether we stay or go - the economy is rotten. But on a Leave vote it'll happen instantaneously. Literally on the day. Enough people with enough vested interests will make sure of it.

For me the key issue is the economy we've been talking in work about this and someone pointed out that Gove et al have accepted that Brexit will mean job losses . However it won't be him as an MP out of work it will be the ordinary people suddenly realising that their employers are closing up and moving to Germany, France, Spain etc. And when the economy slows down there's less money so public services will get hit again. Not convincing me of the value of a leave vote.

Vote for bridges and cooperation
or vote for walls and isolationism

take your pick

but remember Yerp WILL punish if there is an exit vote.

have you ever spoken to people who have been affected by immigration?

I'm an immigrant and so are many of my coworkers.
We all pay higher rate tax.
You're welcome.

TalkinPeace and Yerp will punish us if we vote to stay because then they will feel that they have us over a barrel. All this crap about what Cameron has negotiated is just that - utter crap. he has no written agreements just understandings. these will all go out of the window when we vote to stay. Europe will bring in treaty after treaty - all waiting in the wings on hold until after our vote.

55% of our laws are made in Europe. can you name your MEP?

How can you trust an organisation with your money when it has never passed an audit? it never has and it never will.

10% of doctors in the NHS are EU migrants .....

immigrants in the NHS are more likely to be pushing the trolley than on it

care home staff are mostly immigrants, because the native born are getting old and do not want to do the work.

food pickers are immigrants - as they have been for 100 years - because native born do not want to do the work

unemployment in the UK is lower than anywhere else in Yerp because immigrants come here to work
and there are lots of jobs that need doing

I'm more worried about staying. The Eurozone is heading for further banking crisis and austerity. That will mean even more people moving around the contient and more suffering. The EU need to look at their policies and change - it isn't working.

I am worried about being linked to a failing economic zone with its failing Banks (which is being deliberately kept back until after referendum - I also object to this manipulation of facts).

I agree with Mervyn King's summary - that the best solution would be for us and Germany to exit - enabling the rest of the countries to find an achievabe economic level.

It will fail ultimately, it would be better to start the process whilst the EU countries still have some democracy intact to enable them to restore lost soverienty.

www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/05/11/italy-must-chose-between-the-euro-and-its-own-economic-survival/
www.reuters.com/article/spain-debt-idUSL5N18F1P9

I agree with Mervyn King's summary - that the best solution would be for us and Germany to exit - enabling the rest of the countries to find an achievabe economic level

perhaps we will have a situation where a few of the richest countries leave and they form some kind of new alliance

Talkinpeace - I'm in healthcare so see/hear plenty from coalface.

How it is working out - is that yes younger people come here to work, find their way round system - and then the older generation find it less scary to move over for healthcare; the cost of prescriptions etc is prohibitive in some countries.

No one blames them - why not? It's just if from the UK point of view if we genuinely wish a continuing free healthcare system - we need to look at the reality that it does (rightly) attract people here.

Not right or wrong. Just is.

We can only vote based on our own experiences and common sense.

So yes, I expect you'll have some research that says entirely the opposite - but 25 years plus of my own experience, and that of colleagues, is what I will base my opinion on.

Glass - the possiblilites are multiple.

I'm sure for Greece it is time for new thinking.

The thought of staying linked to an ever expanding policitcal experiment does worry me.

20 years ago part time workers didn't have rights as they do now, cars weren't as safe, beaches dirtier, employers didn't have to give paid holidays and it was ok for an employer to expect staff to work 60 hours a week. The EU has helped change things for the better as far as I can see.

Leavethe
How it is working out - is that yes younger people come here to work, find their way round system - and then the older generation find it less scary to move over for healthcare; the cost of prescriptions etc is prohibitive in some countries.
and non EU migrants never do that ?

remember that if the EU migrants are stopped, a great deal more Non EU people will be needed to do the jobs they did .....

and British kids never ever get drunk on holiday in the med and end up calling on the health services of Greece, Spain, France, Italy, Portugal, Croatia,
that is why there aren't several telly programmes about it on minor channels