to be sick of people on FB comparing Syrian refugees to the Jewish refugees

[paintandbrush]

Please stop bandying about the terms 'Kindertransport', 'Operation Pied Piper' and so on because I've studied the Holocaust extensively, and it's not actually the same, ok?

This article says it all better than I can, please read: www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/12130175/The-plight-of-Syrian-refugees-is-not-on-a-par-with-Jews-fleeing-the-Nazis.html

For the record, I really don't believe we should be bombing them to hell in the first place: in this day and age, wars are not won in the towns and fields of North Africa. Wars are won round a conference table somewhere in Switzerland.

The whole attitude of Cameron's government at the minute seems to be "Let's make their homeland hell on earth, then pat ourselves on the back for letting, say, 10% of them into the UK". What a bloody mess.

[MorrisZapp]

To clarify. You claim that pull factors are illogical when it comes to leaving a war zone. Sure, we'd all leave the war zone.

But after that, there may be pull factors bringing them to Calais. And yes, if we take in every single Calais refugee the camp will very quickly fill up again, ad infinitum.

[BillSykesDog]

It's odd though that if the situations are so very similar - then why haven't I heard people calling Assad Hitler?

Because Assad ruled over a country which for all it's faults provided a decent degree of protection to minorities. Something his Islamist opponents don't do. But of course the Islamist apologists will conveniently ignore that and deflect from it. Because as far as they're concerned persecution only really matters when it happens to a Muslim.

[Alisvolatpropiis]

The parallels between the two are clear but I think the two situations are really quite different.

[grannytomine]

Yes you are being unreasonable. Hope that helps.

[Helmetbymidnight]

Perhaps the situation is also similar to the Vietnamese boat people?

[IPityThePontipines]

So pointing out the Assad regime has engaged in brutal mass slaughter is being an "Islamist apologist"?

Really? This is starting to get into through the looking glass territory.

Do you not realise the the mass aerial bombardment of major cities kills Christians and Druze too?

Did you not know that the regime recently executed one of the major Druze sheikhs in Damascus?

I note you haven't managed to back up your previous accusations against me either, BillSykes. Funny that.

[IPityThePontipines]

Also, the Syrian Opposition have themselves compared Assad to Hitler:

www.ibtimes.co.uk/syria-opposition-compares-vladimir-putin-bashar-al-assad-adolf-hitler-geneva-peace-talks-1541451

[emilybohemia]

Well, there's no degree of protection now Bill. The regime bombs, starves, tortures, gases and rapes and bombs the people of Syria. The blinded child my other half met certainly didn't feel protected by Assad. We have to judge him on what he is doing now.

Do stop inferring IPity is an apologist for Islamic extremism because she has sympathy for refugees. It is abhorrent.

[albertcampionscat]

Well, in 1938 the Daily Mail ran the headline 'German Jews flood country' so there are some parallels.

[Helmetbymidnight]

www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1979/05/30/boat-people-pose-risky-political-issue-for-thatcher/bfd3410e-b9fb-4f86-88d5-99ae08e6d074/

And parallels here too.

Assad IS the scum of the earth. I haven't heard people in this country calling him Hitler though. I guess because ISIS are even worse than Assad.

[emilybohemia]

I'm not sure Isis are worse than Assad. I think Assad is just as bad. His regime rapes women and children, tortures people, gases them, bombs them etc.

[ThisCakeFilledIsle]

You keep it all in perspective for us em.

[lurked101]

Funny to see that this thread has been taken over by the same sort of people who would have been saying in 1939: "but when the jews leave germany they are out of danger, they have a choice about where to go."

"But we have 3 million unemployed we can't possibly take any refugees."

" There are a lot of theives coming with the Jews leaving Germany how do we know which ones are which?"

The comparrisons are accurate and far too many of you here lack humanity or any sort of intellectual capability to hold this argument properly, lots of racism and xenephobia being displayed. You realise we only got 39,000 applications for asylum here last year? ( ONS data)

To those stating "pull factors" and all the other points, your opinions are iniquitous, and intellectually flawed.

[OneWingWonder]

I see the virtue-signallers are out in force. So how many of these desperate people will you be housing in your own homes - the answer's still zero, right?

[MintJulip]

IMO there is a big difference between taking members of a minority group who are explicitly being targeted for persecution (in this case, Christians, Yazidi, some Shia; in the case of Germany, Jews, Gypsies, gays etc) and taking large numbers of the majority group doing the oppressing without actually bothering to ask hard questions about who they are and what they believe


^^ This. Excellent post as ever Bill Sykes.

If you give asylum to those who are doing the oppressing, and they continue with their oppressive behaviour in a new country, then you haven't actually given anyone asylum. You've just let the violence spread and put greater numbers of people at risk

christiandaily.com/article/persecution-in-sweden-christian-migrants-and-minorities-harassed-and-threatened-in-asylum-centers/51766.htm


"Christians and other religious minorities are reportedly being harassed and threatened by Muslims in Swedish asylum centers, and campaigners are now calling for protection for the persecuted refugees"

"The Swedish Evangelical Alliance revealed that a Christian refugee in Kalmar, southeastern Sweden, said one man claiming to have fought with jihadists in Syria threatened to slit the refugee's throat and slaughter him. The group also says some of the refugees are forced to move out because of the harassment, like a Pakistani Christian couple who sought shelter in a church after the husband received a death threat, Christian Today relays"

[MintJulip]

www.christianconcern.com/our-concerns/international-persecution/christian-refugees-face-routine-oppression-by-muslims-at-germ

Discrimination and violence against Christian refugees in refugee centers happens far more frequently than this testimony."

It went on to say that although many recognise the "increasing number" of documented assaults, "policymakers have generally not taken sufficient measures to protect the Christian minority."

It found that the majority of perpetrators were fellow refugees, who viewed those who had recently converted to Christianity apostates.

In one incident, a German pastor in Berlin reported that Christian refugees were threatened after they refused to take part in Islamic prayers at their camp.

Perhaps even more concerning is that over half of those surveyed said that they had received abuse from Muslim security guards – whilst in the capital Berlin, this number rose to two thirds.

'Tip of the iceberg'

A member of Open Doors, Markus Rode, said that this study is only the “tip of the iceberg”, while Berlin-based pastor Gottfried Martens said he has heard of hundreds of cases in the Berlin and Brandenburg area alone.

[MintJulip]

Growing number of Christian converts

There are growing reports of refugees coming to faith after encountering the gospel in Germany. Last Thursday, over 80 Muslim refugees embraced the gospel and were baptised in Hamburg. Pastor Albert Babajan, who conducted the baptisms, has baptised 196 former Muslims in 2016, and expects this number to grow to 500 by the end of this year.

Speaking to German magazine Stern, he said that the "the motive for the change of faith is the same for many: they are disappointed with Islam.”

Solmaz, one of the Iranian refugees, said: "In Islam, we always lived in fear. Fear God, fear of sin, fear of punishment. However, Christ is a God of love

[lurked101]

I see those who would have turned the Jews away in 1939 are out in force

Love the comment about "how many do you have in your house", tbh I would, but lets be honest its best dealt with by the government who have the resources to cater to needs rather than amateurs.

[lurked101]

Oh and tu quoutue is a flawed argument too.

[user1463231665]

Jews leaving Germany as otherwise would be killed who landed in say Switzerland - safe. Syrians leaving Syria who land in Turkey - safe. Any onward movement after that is economic or social (and indeed some Jews did pay to go to Switzerland and on to the USA just before WWII but that was very different from sponsored Kindertransport children taken directly from Germany.

[OneWingWonder]

lurked

"Love the comment about "how many do you have in your house", tbh I would, but lets be honest its best dealt with by the government who have the resources to cater to needs rather than amateurs."

So zero then! "I would" is the world's most pathetic cop-out - if your heart bleeds so much, then just do it instead of forcing everyone else to pay for your conscience.

What a surprise that massive virtue-signalling always co-exists with no refugees in the house!

[lurked101]

Syrians leaving Syria who land in Turkey - safe. Any onward movement after that is economic or social (and indeed some Jews did pay to go to Switzerland and on to the USA just before WWII but that was very different from sponsored Kindertransport children taken directly from Germany."

Really Kurdish Syrians are safe in Turkey? So all the Jews should have just moved one country down and hang the concequences? Your economic point? Oh they want to come here and claim benefits don't they, that it is what you are implying, utter drivel. The same kind of points that were made about the Jews in the 1930s again, hage you read the daily mail reports from that time?

People can make choices, imagine the desperation, just one more move, one more push and it might be safe.

The lack of empathy here is soul crushing, and your right wing bigotry laughable.

[OneWingWonder]

lurked

"Your economic point? Oh they want to come here and claim benefits don't they, that it is what you are implying, utter drivel."

I'm afraid you're talking rubbish, since the economic costs of taking refugees/migrants is immense: the German government plans to spend 93.6 billion euros on refugees by end 2020

www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-germany-costs-idUSKCN0Y50DY

"They expected 55 percent of recognized refugees to have a job after five years"

You want them, you bloody well pay for them.

[AugustaFinkNottle]

I see the virtue-signallers are out in force. So how many of these desperate people will you be housing in your own homes - the answer's still zero, right?

This is the standard mindless response we see coming only too often from brain-dead Mail commenters. Why not try addressing the points at issue? Face it, people who make this response definitely wouldn't stop grumbling for one moment even if every single immigrant is given a home with residents already here.

[AugustaFinkNottle]

Let's have a look at the costs or otherwise of immigration to the UK rather than Germany, shall we?

www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-articles/1114/051114-economic-impact-EU-immigration