to be sick of people on FB comparing Syrian refugees to the Jewish refugees

[paintandbrush]

Please stop bandying about the terms 'Kindertransport', 'Operation Pied Piper' and so on because I've studied the Holocaust extensively, and it's not actually the same, ok?

This article says it all better than I can, please read: www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/12130175/The-plight-of-Syrian-refugees-is-not-on-a-par-with-Jews-fleeing-the-Nazis.html

For the record, I really don't believe we should be bombing them to hell in the first place: in this day and age, wars are not won in the towns and fields of North Africa. Wars are won round a conference table somewhere in Switzerland.

The whole attitude of Cameron's government at the minute seems to be "Let's make their homeland hell on earth, then pat ourselves on the back for letting, say, 10% of them into the UK". What a bloody mess.

The last Syrian man I spoke to outwardly looks like a fit young man. The emotional scars from seeing his wife murdered infront of him or his much loved books being burnt can't be seen.

Oh yes shall we play refugee bingo?

Have we had they wear designer brands yet?

What about Iphone posession?

See the same people ranting about refugees here would have been the same people saying the same stuff in the 1930s.

"How come the Jews have money to come here if they are so persecuted? Why should we support them? They are only coming because life is better here, why can't they stay in the next country over? What about our unemployed, charity begins at home you know. "

The Sunnis that have been beheaded are ex-military men and police, which to ISIS is tantamount to 'working for the man'.

So that's alright then? I guess their deaths don't count. P.S they aren't the only Sunnis slaughtered by ISIS either. Nice bit of minimising though.

Some of the contortions being made here to justify leaving people to die is sickening, frankly.

You do realise that regime recently bombed a refugee camp in Syria? That people trying to escape Syria have also been attacked?

Sorry but does it really matter? People are suffering in large numbers. Does it matter whether the numbers are larger/smaller or the suffering greater/lesser?

Yet again a thread disintegrates.

"Turkmen and Shabaks
These are ethnic groups, not religious ones and are generally Sunni. You really need to stop relying on Google."

Turkmen are predominantly Sunni, but Shabaks definitely Shia - and the language they speak is from Iran. What is the point you are trying to make?

If you are talking about Kasabeh the Jordanian pilot his allegiance was to his King, and therefore would never cooperate with ISIS.

'Yet again a thread disintegrates'.

Not at all. Some very dubious views have been contested and rightly so.

What is the point you are trying to make?

My post at 16:26 is pretty clear. The idea that Sunnis not suffering in Syria, whether under Assad or ISIS is laughable.

Why are you so keen to suggest otherwise?

Why have you got nothing to say about the Syrians being slaughtered by Assad?

Do you defend barrel bombs being dropped on homes, schools and hospitals?

Are you denying that these are civilian targets and therefore constitute crimes against humanity?

What is the point you are trying to make?

Nice bit of minimising though.

Minimising!? I am trying to explain something to you, but your teenage brain is on tramlines.

Ah, so you don't have any answers to my questions?

Pontipines You are so full of bile and your hate for the West shines through. I am trying to explain to you the hierarchy of enemies from ISIS's perspective.

Very few Syrians came to Europe last year - that is the pity of it; they had already moved to various refugee camps, and some had flown out to relatives in Lebanon and Canada. The deliverance by Merkel was supposed to be of Syrians and Iraqis, but only 20 percent were from a war zone. She let them down badly.

You talk as if you know something, but it's all recycled invective. I had relatives near Damascus and I was last there in 2006, I know the people quite well.

Still waiting to hear from LURKED.

Lurked said:
“You want a number? Ok, maybe we can't match Germany (although I don't see why not) So why don't we just go a little bit better than the French and take 80,000. That might get past all of those who would start quaking in their boots at actually helping someone. I'd go for the EU average my self and per 100,000 of the population that would give us 169,000 refugees, not many, not too costly.”

Is that a one-off, Lurked, or annually? You do realise how vast a country both Germany and France are, don’t you? How can the island of UK match Germany, FGS!? Keeping in mind my simple calculation above, 169k tripled would become 507,000 or 676,000 incl the original refugee – and that’s not even mentioning sibs and children that will be born.

Take that this year then see what happens next, I think the height of last year won't be replicated anyway.

No, I don't hate the West. How on earth have you got that from my posts? Where?

How on Earth is condemning the actions of a Syrian dictator being hateful towards the West? That doesn't make any sense.

You seem to be more adept at flinging around insults then actually responding to what I have asked you. I see you still fail to condemn Assad.

I do know something because I have relatives still there, as well as those who have fled. I was last there at the end of 2010. I've spoken about it on previous threads, so it's not some new revelation either.

*Take that this year then see what happens next, I think the height of last year won't be replicated anyway."

Really, lurked? What is Yemen blows, and much closer to us - Tunisia?

I didn't see any hate for the West in Pont's post, just a completely justifiable rebuttal of the notion that Sunnis are not suffering on a large scale in Syria. Accusations of bile and hate are needlessly personal and do not constitute a constructive point, Shake.

I'm not sure why you are only pinpointing Isis's 'hierarchy of enemies.' Assad has killed a lot more people than Isis so he presents just as grave a threat.

Some very dubious views have been contested and rightly so.

Dubious in your opinion. People are allowed to have differing views. Not everything is clear cut.

Accusations of bile and hate are needlessly personal and do not constitute a constructive point, Shake.

Hahaha, says she with more deletions for personal attacks than the all the other posters put together.

Excellent post BillSykes, probably wasted on these deniers though.

What do you think of what Assad is doing, Bill? Is that not another holocaust or horror?

Take that this year then see what happens next, I think the height of last year won't be replicated anyway

But this is part of the problem. There are not just refugees from Syria on the move. Men are flooding into EU from Tunisia, Morocco, as well as other countries where there is war like Etria etc.
If we accept far larger no of refugees which - its debatable as to whether as a country we could do that, we encourage more people to come to the EU. Why would anyone want to do that? Its clear there is no, coherent plan to help them, and even huge countries like Germany are rapidly back tracking and revising everything to do with refugees/migrants.

Why encourage more people to make the perilous journey?
You do realise people trackers are pushing people our way, selling a false dream to them? Your feeding into a nasty cycle and ISIS are also known to be behind much people trafficking, which makes them alot of money and helps to fund MORE pain and misery.

I think Assad is probably a necessary evil. I think the alternative is worse. I think the idea that anywhere in the Islamic world is going to become a progressive democracy when a secular dictatorship is toppled has been roundly discredited and it's become clear they're likely to become lawless Islamist hellholes. None of them have been replaced by something better. At least under Assad there was some semblance of peace and stability and minorities were protected.

I don't think anyone could defend Assad, at all. We could call him every name under the sun, wicked, cruel, despicable and so on.

But its ISIS that have got stuck in and confused the whole situation and made it a million times worse. And ISIS are Islamic and they do follow Islam. Until this can be addressed head on, we are not ever going to climb out of this mess. Until Saudi can be tackled - we have even less chance.

Yes. Look at Libya and Tunisia and Egypt and Iraq after their nasty dictators got toppled. Total breakdown of law and order, Islamist nutjobs oppressing women and minorities and sectarian warfare. Bad as he is, Assad is the lesser of two evils. My hairdresser is Kurdish and even she believes Iraq was better under Saddam Hussein, which tells you something about how dire it is now.

Bill said At least under Assad there was some semblance of peace and stability and minorities were protected.

There is never going to be a touchy-feely type of president in any of the ME countries. Hussein held it together and minorities were protected, so did Tito in S. Europe. Like the placards of the caliphatist demonstrators in central London say: "Death to Democracy", ""Freedom Go To Hell".

Syria was basically socialist with a secular ideology and an authoritarian political system. The constitution guaranteed religious freedom for every recognised religious community. This is precisely what is anathema to ISIS and they want to expunge it.