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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think there are size double standards on mumsnet?

239 replies

Tobeavsangel · 11/05/2016 23:25

So I read a thread and a model is being ripped apart for her looks and size.

There was even a comment about how the company should pay her to eat .... Could you imagine the outrage if it was a plus size model and I said the company should have her cut down on her portion sizes?

I'm not even skinny (size 10) but I just hate this double standard on mumsnet.

OP posts:
oliviaclottedcream · 12/05/2016 18:50

What a mental bastard !!!

oliviaclottedcream · 12/05/2016 18:51

Sorry, I meant her and not you bumble.

Slarti · 12/05/2016 18:57

real women have curves

That drives me mad, along with anything else which proclaims to be the arbiter of what a real woman/man/person looks like.

AerithEarling · 12/05/2016 20:06

yanbu and this is everywhere

hollinhurst84 · 12/05/2016 20:26

For me it's about health. I'm a plus size model (part time)
Tess can't get up off the floor so to me that equals unhealthy. Thin so that you have no muscle tone, look gaunt and ill, same thing
My friend is a size 4, eats load and exercises and she glows with health
You can't really tell if someone is that unhealthy from looking at them but i think not being able to get up from off the floor isn't great

Baconyum · 12/05/2016 23:23

“The reason people are obese is not because they don't know that chips are bad for you.” exactly and I get fed up seeing people assuming the overweight are stupid/ignorant purely based on their weight! I am 3st overweight, I was very very slim for many years (but did eat), but I was MUCH more active then. Motherhood, disability, illness have affected that. Plus I still think like a ‘thin person’ I posted on another thread that I went to a slimming club for 3 years with little success. I don't think that's their responsibility, but it's really not as easy as many who've never been overweight seem to think! Particularly where reduced mobility is concerned.

But equally until I was mid 30’s and started gaining the weight I had experienced as a ‘skinny’ person the other side of things, people whispering behind my back that I must have an eating disorder, that I looked ill, couldn't possibly be healthy etc etc.

I do stand by my belief it's patriarchal/misogyny based. That doesn't mean men/boys don't get shit too, that is also based in patriarchal concepts of what a ‘real man’ should look like. Something my ex struggled with being also very slim and short in very macho (military) environment.

As a mother to a very very slim daughter it's worrying, especially when as a pp rightly pointed out the only time we see other than a very slim (and tall) PERSON (male or female) advertising a product is for “plus size” products! (With the possible exception of ‘mumsy’ roles eg Ruth Jones on the current tesco ads). We need people of ALL shapes, sizes, colours...all varieties of appearance in advertising. ‘Normal’ is a fallacy.

Regarding the banning of models being very low on the bmi scale. While I hate the shaming of ‘naturally’ very slim people as much as the shaming of the overweight, this was brought in mainly not to attack the models but to stop the agencies and designers putting pressure on the models to be unhealthily thin, to take extreme measures to achieve those sizes.

And yyy the faux health concern pisses me off, I've been healthy and unhealthy at all the sizes I've been (both physically and mentally). I'm overweight but my BP, pulse, cholesterol and other health indicators are well within healthy ranges. Being overweight can contribute to certain health issues but so can being underweight and being neither also doesn't mean you are in perfect health. My ex Mil has been roughly the same weight her entire adult life, always within what medics consider a healthy range,with the only exception being pregnancy. Yet her health is very poor, including conditions associated with being overweight. My mother has been overweight most of her life, yet is still in pretty good health, and certainly has more stamina than many 20 years younger! Weight/size is only one factor.

Gwenhwyfar · 12/05/2016 23:31

"firstly the insistence that if you are (say) a size 14, you aren't really you know hmm"

I really don't accept that talking about size inflation is 'fat shaming'. I've even seen people accused of size-shaming on here. A size can't be shamed!

Gwenhwyfar · 12/05/2016 23:40

"every piece of designer clothing is fitted onto a body that looks like theirs"

How many people is this relevant for?

charliethebear · 12/05/2016 23:54

I think there's more fat shaming in general than skinny shaming on MN.
Society is geared towards thin people. Skinny shaming comes from a very different place to fat shaming I think. Skinny shaming comes from a place of jealousy, as thin is the ideal, whilst fat shaming is related to a general hatred in society of fat people.
The banning of models of low BMIs was to protect models from the constant pressure of the industry to be very skinny. Which lead to them becoming dangerously underweight, in some cases dying, there is no pressure in the industry to be very overweight.
The 'real women have curves' is in retaliation ti the fact that the ideal body type in every magazine, newspaper, advert etc. Is very thin. Its women who weren't the ideal body shape saying hey we are attractive too. It annoys me when people bring this up as a skinny shaming comment as its a comment in retaliation to years and years of fat shaming.
There was a period of my life where i was pretty thin (BMI 17ish), whilst i did receive some remarks, comments etc about my weight, these were no where near the comments that fat people get, theres not the same undertone of hatred. I didn't get laughed at when i got my body out, men didn't snigger at me, no one looked at me with disgust which is things that happen to my overweight friends.

Gwenhwyfar · 13/05/2016 00:30

"Show me a catwalk model with even medium sized breasts"

The other poster was talking about flat-chested though. Are you saying anyone with less than medium sized breasts is flat chested. If so, isn't that small breast shaming?
I agree with those who say that page 3 or glamour models aren't really seen as the ideal for most women, but what about Hollywood actresses?

herecomethepotatoes · 13/05/2016 01:27

This reply has been deleted

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Baconyum · 13/05/2016 03:12

Wtf!!! herecomethepotatoes

How is understanding/considering/discussing how patriarchy/misogyny affects how people judge others based on body shape (which has been discussed by others too on the thread) mean I'm not taking responsibility or passing the buck?!

PlumPurple · 13/05/2016 06:01

I don't know about on here because I've only just joined (swapped from a different website that I had been on for a week and found to be really chavvy and cliquey) but society is very critical of both larger and slimmer women. It's awful. There's so much more to a woman that what size we are!

bumbleymummy · 13/05/2016 07:06

"The 'real women have curves' is in retaliation ti the fact that the ideal body type in every magazine, newspaper, advert etc. Is very thin. Its women who weren't the ideal body shape saying hey we are attractive too. It annoys me when people bring this up as a skinny shaming comment as its a comment in retaliation to years and years of fat shaming."

Retaliating by insulting those who don't have curves and saying that they aren't 'real women'? I'm not sure why that makes it ok.

TaraCarter · 13/05/2016 07:36

She didn't say it was okay, she was trying to explain the difference in social force.

If ten kids gang up on an eleventh to call him or her names day after day after day, are you really going to say "oh it's six of one and half-a-dozen of the other" when that eleventh kid starts referring to them insultingly?

bumbleymummy · 13/05/2016 07:42

I don't think it's 'six of one'. I think it's wrong to insult people's appearance - regardless of their size.

tobysmum77 · 13/05/2016 07:51

Well I dont have curves and am definitely real. I must admit I think some people are overly sensitive, it suits me to not be 'sexy' as it avoids awful blokes slathering. Average looks work for me tbh Grin

Of course the thinner women are the smaller their breasts tend to be so that is a problem for anyone who wants to conform to the ideal. Some like me don't care and others have (or want but cant afford) breast enlargements I suppose.

FamousSeamus · 13/05/2016 09:40

"every piece of designer clothing is fitted onto a body that looks like theirs"

It's relevant, surely, because that then means that the models who advertise the clothes are the same size, and their images are everywhere, from billboards to magazines. It means we see a lot of that body type publicly in ways that make it plain that it's considered prestigious, whereas fat bodies appear in the media mostly to illustrate the evils of obesity or to peddle diets.

Of course it's wrong to insult people's appearance, fat or thin, but the people who are claiming that 'thin-shaming' is in any way equivalent to fat-shaming are not considering the entire set of social forces which bolster the idea that thin=good, fat= bad.

Not to mention the correlation between income, social class and body type, particularly for women:

Obesity in women rises steadily with falling household income, and there is a significant difference in prevalence between the highest and lowest income groups

The Index of Multiple Deprivation 2007 (IMD) shows that women living in more deprived areas have higher levels of obesity than those in less deprived areas. There is no clear pattern for men

There is also a strong relationship between obesity prevalence and occupation-based social class for women. The prevalence of obesity for women in unskilled occupations is almost twice that of those in professional occupations.

www.noo.org.uk/uploads/doc/vid_16966_AdultSocioeconSep2012.pdf

TaraCarter · 13/05/2016 11:26

but the people who are claiming that 'thin-shaming' is in any way equivalent to fat-shaming are not considering the entire set of social forces which bolster the idea that thin=good, fat= bad.

This.

I would also add that discovering, in this thread, that some posters think an industry ban on employing women at a hospitalisation-level-of-malnutrition equates to thin-shaming does not give credence to their claims the forces are equal.

I honestly feel a bit sick that people are co-opting a measure introduced to stop young women being pressured to starve themselves to death in order to get modelling work as discrimination against slim women because plus-size women model.

Get. A. Grip.

And go back to school science lessons. Being two points under the BMI range for your height is not the same, health-wise, as being two points over.

MorrisZapp · 13/05/2016 11:41

I agree Tara. It's like men saying that sexism no longer exists because of the Diet Coke advert.

bumbleymummy · 13/05/2016 13:02

tobysmum - surely sexy is in the eye of the beholder? :) Some people find curves sexy and others don't.

StrangeLookingParasite · 13/05/2016 22:23

Just a bit more ammunition about life as a non-thin person. Yes, in that thread it's happening to everyone because people are arseholes, but it happens to us bigger people a whole lot more.

SoupDragon · 14/05/2016 09:20

I think this thread proves the OPs point rather nicely.

StrangeLookingParasite · 14/05/2016 15:50

I don't think it does in the slightest.

JingsAndCrivens · 14/05/2016 15:53

Agreed, I don't see that it does at all.

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