To feel totally ignorant about racism

[IcingandSlicing]

In that topic the other day I've learned that I am totally ignorant about racism. I had no idea that comments about hair for example that could be totally not ill meant could strike such a deep chord among other people
Or is it the comment itself or the way it was made - by the tone of voice etc nonverbal information you get from people - that makes it racist?
Or just some comments people make regarding kids like cheeky monkey for epinstance (there are tees with this) could be seen as racist?
I'm at a lost to be honest.
I've probably offended many people without even knowing about it.
I'd assume that in 2016 people would feel equal no matter how they look and not take offense from random comments.
Aibu to think that I'd better keep away from black people in case I'd say something that would offend them? (I mean I can say whatever negative thing I want about blond haired people, red haired people, black haired people, people who colour their hair, people who don't colour their hair, people who have thin hair, people who have thick hair, etc, but I feel like with black people it's likely to strike a deeper chord than ever intended and I am ignorant enough not to understand the history behid that makes it worse.)
And sorry about that I really don't mean to offend. Just to understand.

Ok. I'll rephrase. I know it isn't racism. I stated that I knew it wasn't racism in my comment. I never claimed it was racism. However, just because it isn't racism doesn't make it acceptable. No you didn't state you found it was acceptable, but you didn't say you thought it was bad either. You just stated it wasn't racism. Which I already mentioned in my earlier comment. When was the last time you were disadvantaged because you were deemed too 'fiery' based the colour of your hair, at a job interview, and therefore considered a worrying choice, even though your experience and credentials were spot on?

This ted talks might clear out a few things. Don't ask me where am from but where am local.

Don't ask where I'm from, ask where I'm a local
https://www.ted.com/talks/taiyeselasiidonttaskwhereeimmfromaskkwhereiimaa_local

I'm confused at to what you thought I meant by "deeply unpleasant" if not that I think it is bad?

I pointed out it wasn't racism because this is a discussion about racism. Not general discrimination.

Also - my post wasn't in response to yours, but another poster, which I made quite clear in bolding their name.

Have a look at the pay and employment gaps for ethnic minorities in the UK and you'll see why we don't feel equal in 2016.
In an unequal and often discriminatory context comments don't feel harmless.

cuntymccunt, report it, evenif your DD is 30! HV all say that they have previous medical training, and part of medical training is cultural sensitivity (albeit I know a racist GP).

OP, is this reference of racial ignorance related to the Beyoncé thread?

Why do you wish people wouldn't notice? Variety's the spice of life. I'm surprised you think "where are you from?" is a weird question. Perhaps it's because I meet more people who are from other places that makes it less so for me.

It sounds more like you're stuck on eternal tourist/expat mode, where everyone else is foreign/exotic/fascinating, and you're not particularly interested in hearing why some people who face your question daily might find it offensive: you've decided it's not (in Dartmoor, everyone asks that!), so clearly they're just looking to be offended.

It's entirely up to you. I do cringe at your assumption that it's all lovely chit-chat conversation that nobody could possibly mind. Ironically, if you're asking this somewhere like America, and you have a British accent, you're probably being cut a lot of slack because people assume you don't realise it can be a loaded question. If you were a white guy from Iowa, asking Asian-looking people in New York 'where are you from? Oh, New York?' you'd probably receive more 'get a fucking clue' type responses. Context is important. Great article about it in The Atlantic, but I think you've already made up your mind.

www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/07/question-where-are-you-from-racist/373818/

Ok. 'Deeply unpleasant' suggests a level of detachment. As I said, even though it's not directed at me specifically (my bad, didn't read properly and missed the reference to the PP) I am aware it's not racist. But excluding anyone on the basis of their colouring is awful and shouldn't be minimised. Guess that's what your comment felt like?

That wasn't my intention ginger. As I said,I have quite a few ginger relatives so I have seen the unpleasantness.

I didn't actually see your post until well after we started interacting following my comment, I'm sorry those things happened to you.

I think that the OP is saying, in the original post, that she had no idea of the true extent to which racism occurs or has embedded itself in our very western open progressive culture (UK?). The OP considered that racism was largely an urban myth that occurred occasionally in situations with the police, at football matches with thug BNP members, in working men's clubs (?), on sink estates where everyone knows one another or is related to one another and pitches in to help, you know, in places that most of us don't frequent.

Racial prejudice would never intentionally exude from an educated, masters possessing, worship leader or admin staff, who interacts with people of 'many diverse' backgrounds on a day to day basis. Is that correct OP? I can see why one would make that assumption to be honest. But sometimes our friendship circles reflect the world that we would like to have, and not the one that exists.

Babooshka, said to here "I do cringe at your assumption that it's all lovely chit-chat conversation that nobody could possibly mind."

Phew, I thought it was just me in this thread. I guess it also throws me because it tells you nothing about a person, as with most small talk conversations.

I've just been at a garden centre (I know, I'm a cliche) and got chatting to a lovely woman, we were chatting away for about twenty minutes till the staff came round to say they were closing so we should pay and leave. I think in a mutual outbreak of chat, it's not a question that comes naturally at all, not least because chatty interludes are informal so there's more chat about whatever got you chatting in the first place.

Alisvolatpropiis No problem. I do get quite uppity about such things and you are clearly an honour are ginger!

I usually ask new people I meet where their family are from originally - I think it's an interesting thing to know and chat about, whether it's bognor or Barbados.

would anyone find that offensive? I am a bit worried now that I have been rude inadvertently?

It's the constant assumption that we are foreign. Where are you from, and when I say London, that's fine. But what we usually get is 'No, I didn't mean that, I can see you're not originally from London', or no, 'where are you originally from', means I am looking at you and can see you're not English. Or as dd gets: well you look Asian. 'Where are you from' in itself, without the follow up, is fine.

Scared, just out of interest do you ask regardless of skin colour? If you ask only BAME people it is weird. My family could have been in London for centuries.

If I say "London" and you say "no really where are you from" can you at least see why that is rude?

In case it's of interest England had our first black Mayor in 1904. I must admit, growing up, I thought the first one was the mayor of Battersea bit recently found out about Norfolk.

Just one reason why "where are you from", with the expectation of hearing "not here" is weird.

I work in healthcare & often ask people where they're from if I hear that they don't have a local accent, regardless of their ethnicity & particularly if I hear a Midlands accent - I'm from Nottingham & the accent is so instantly recognisable to me & pretty unusual where I currently live (North Yorks / Teesside). I don't have much of an accent myself. I'm genuinely interested and nosy

Dawn, I suppose im so used to "where are you from" meaning that the answer won't satisfy them, I make assumptions about the question.

But I honestly can't think of a time someone who asked that question was okay with the answer....

no, not at all write - I ask everyone, even people with strong cockney accents (I live in London). i use it as an ice breaker and because I am genuinely interested in people, if I am interested enough to talk to them in the first place :)

Scared, so if you asked me and I said "I'm from Highgate" (totally not, I wish) and talked you about the Shivering Chicken, you'd be fine with that? That's grand, it's the people who want to hear about where my ancestors are from that and make me feel like I must be foreign because of my skin colour who get on my wick.

I'd be fascinated if you talked to me about a shivering chicken - what is it?! I've only ever heard of the highgate vampire.

I have always thought that people tell you what they want to tell you about themselves. So if you asked me, I would say I'm from Yorkshire originally but lived in London for years hence sounding like a poxy southerner, much to my father's disgust!

I ask questions about where they say but nowhere else, if that makes sense - so I would ask you about highgate, not, "but you must be from somewhere else originally", which would be both stupid and vile in my view.

It's the constant assumption that we are foreign. Where are you from, and when I say London, that's fine. But what we usually get is 'No, I didn't mean that, I can see you're not originally from London', or no, 'where are you originally from', means I am looking at you and can see you're not English. Or as dd gets: well you look Asian. 'Where are you from' in itself, without the follow up, is fine.
this

Also the wanting to pat your hair like your a fucking exotic pet in a fucking zoo I don't have European hair and I have never once asked to pat or pet a woman with European hair

Also my oh is white and I often get asked if he's dated black women before me I would never dream of asking a white person a similar question

And being asked what I think on any given black issue

And being asked what I think on any given black issue
^^^

this! Pure bollocks! Like all people from one race or gender think homogenously!

"the black voter...."
"black people prefer..."
"black areas"....
"that's unusual for a black person...."
"i didn't know that black people..."
"Caribbean isn't an ethnicity" (yes well neither is black, it's a race you nincompoop!)

oh eff off!

And
"African americans..." cos they're the standard of black aspiration aren't they???

Not all the black diaspora look to the US as a standard of higher living and thinking.

groannnn

If you doubt that monkey stereotypes are alive and well just take a look at the comments made when Malia Obama got into Harvard.

that makes sense thank you. i am comfortable I would never do it on purpose, but it will help me to think twice before flapping my gums!