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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Housework - who ibu?

370 replies

nobilityobliges · 24/04/2016 12:44

I am 25 and getting married to my boyfriend of five years this summer. He is fantastic, and I love him very much. Pretty much the only problem in our relationship arises out of arguments about housework.

I am a really messy person. On top of this, I am currently working as a trainee solicitor in a big London firm, which means that I often don't get in til 9 or 10pm, sometimes have to work weekends. So I have a limited amount of free time, which I don't want to spend doing housework.

My fiancé, on the other hand, is pretty houseproud, and mess stresses him out. I try to accommodate him, and am a lot tidier than I would otherwise be. I also pay for a cleaner to come weekly. He still does more housework though. However, he has a lot more free time than me - he has been at home finishing his phd for a while, and now he has finished it, he is brushing up his coding skills (a different area from his phd) before beginning a job in that area in a few months time (he already has the job). I think this is a good career move and support him in it. I supported him financially through the last year of his phd, and am still supporting him now (ie I pay rent/council tax/food bills/going out etc). I'm happy to do this, and he is really working hard getting his skills up to speed and is definitely not just lazing around the house while I'm at work.

But my fiancé still just brings up my messiness a lot. For example, there will often be a buildup of my breakfast/dinner stuff in the sink (my bf washes up as he goes). I also often just leave stuff lying round -- eg my make up on the sofa after I apply it in the morning then rush out without putting it away, coffee cups round the living room, clothes in a pile on the chair in our room rather than put away etc etc. Nothing major, but definitely quite a bit of general mess. My fiancé thinks that this stuff is completely unreasonable and that I'm completely selfish for not being tidier.

My view is that (1) it's my flat too, and he has to accept that we'll be meeting in the middle mess-wise, (2) I am working very hard at a job, and it's unreasonable to expect me to also spend ages on housework, when this is something I fundamentally don't give a shit about and (3) I am contributing a lot by paying the rent and bills, so even if he ends up doing more housework than me, it's still a fair split.

The problem is that when I raise the fact that I am paying bills he gets very upset, and tells me that I'm trying to control him financially, and that if it was a man telling a woman this I'd be up in arms etc. I just don't know what's right. I do make an effort, but I'm not going to transform into a really tidy person, and I feel he should cut me some slack. I also acknowledge that he is putting every effort into increasing his future earning potential, but also feel that my current financial contribution shouldn't count for nothing either.

We seem to spend so much of our time arguing about this, and it's bringing me down. Any views or advice would be appreciated! Sorry this is so long....

OP posts:
someonestolemynick · 24/04/2016 15:14

I'm sort of in your situation and think tab a little u.

I'm incredibly messy and am not bothered at all about stuff being left lying around. My do is though. It's a matter of mutual respect. We've gone around it by making a pact: I will make my best effort to clean up after myself.
When I unavoidably skip up. Dp tells me calmly that x is in y location. I give him a deadline when I pick it up and stick to it. It's both your house and you both need to be happy in it.

MeadowHay · 24/04/2016 15:16

YANBU. Yes you both need to compromise, yes he needs to do more housework than you (hoovering, cleaning, laundry even). But "housework" doesn't include picking all your crap up from all over the house wherever you've left it and putting it all back wherever it's supposed to go. That's just disrespectful and if you put things back after you use them it takes about 2 minutes. Apologise to him and try and make more of an effort. Once you get into a routine of putting things back straight away it will become second nature. As an adult you need to learn this simple life skill in my opinion, it's not ok to just leave things all over the place (and especially would be a problem in the future if you ever got pets or had children).

DinosaursRoar · 24/04/2016 15:17

If you weren't paying all the bills, how would your DP fund his career plans? Would he have been able to do his phd, this extra training he's decided to do (rather than get a job)?

Why don't you have any money for a dishwasher? Could you if you lived alone and wasn't supporting him?

Does he realise the hours you are out of the house aren't you out having fun, but working in a stressful job? Why can't he work and study around that? What will be the next reason not to get a full time job? (I would worry if the next step is to be self employed)

He doesn't seem to be supporting your career. Does he seem to care how stressed you are? You do'nt sound like you are a good match, is the fact that you are barely there and that he needs you masking bigger problems?

TowerRavenSeven · 24/04/2016 15:20

If you care about him as much as it seems you do, you'll clean up after yourself. We're all busy and if you don't have time to not leave stuff lying around I don't think it can be called busy, sorry if this is harsh but I'd call it more lazy.

You should absolutely not bring up paying the bills as any kind of 'reason' (excuse) - again sorry. If my dh did that I'd have his head. He was brought up in a clean but very cluttered messy home and even after 15 years he still tends to be that way. I'm sure he's not excited when I announce we (whole family) tidies up stuff before I even think about serving dinner but we do it because it's a great incentive and he does it because he knows I hate crap lying around.

As a neat nick married to a clutter bug I feel for your fiancé. It can be very much a huge bone of contention. You've got it made because he will fume and clean up after you or - a bit extreme - but I had a friend whose husband divorced her just for this reason but he wasn't even a clean freak, just got very tired of always cleaning up after her. It was more about a messy house. She also said she had better things to do besides housework but apparently it was ok for Him to do it. Now her 12 year old daughter cleans up after her because She can't stand it.

I'd seriously think about this if I were him.

roarfeckingroar · 24/04/2016 15:20

I'm with him. I would have to kill DP if he didn't put things in the dishwasher and leave his things where they belong. We have a cleaner to avoid housework arguments / stress but general tidiness of your own things is your responsibility and I couldn't cope with mess.

teacher54321 · 24/04/2016 15:21

When I'm on school holidays I do everything round the house because I'm off work. So I unload the dishwasher everyday, clear up after all meals etc. In term time we tidy up depending on who is around. When dh is on shift and around in the daytime, he does all the day to day. If he's at home all day he should be sorting out the house. There's no child to look after and he's not working. I cannot understand why he would do his own washing up and not wash up your cereal bowl.

nobilityobliges · 24/04/2016 15:23

If you weren't paying all the bills, how would your DP fund his career plans? Would he have been able to do his phd, this extra training he's decided to do (rather than get a job)?

No, this is the thing. His PhD was funded but he spent an extra year on it after funding ending polishing it up into publishable form, and now he is working independently on the coding. He has been working consistently hard on these things, so it's not like he's just sitting round paying video games or whatever, but equally, he would have been perfectly employable when his phd funding ended (and his dissertation could have been handed in at that point). So I just feel like he could do a better job of acknowledging that it is my work that has allowed him to pursue his personal goals for the last couple of years - so my perceived "laziness" round the house has a broader context. I just feel like if it's a choice between living rent free with all your bills paid for two years in a flat that's a bit messy and between going out and getting a job and paying for a daily cleaner (or living alone) then he has still got the sweet end of the deal. But I don't think he's "using" me. Our relationship was so much better when we had more time together -- I think it's the long hours and my stress that are making things so much worse (including because I do get much more upset about his telling me off than i would otherwise).

OP posts:
Marynary · 24/04/2016 15:24

If you weren't paying all the bills, how would your DP fund his career plans? Would he have been able to do his phd, this extra training he's decided to do (rather than get a job)?

OP has only said that she "supported him" financially during the last year of his PhD. Presumably before that he had a grant or other funding. I presume that if he wasn't living with her he would probably claim income support while writing up.

seastargirl · 24/04/2016 15:25

Does he actually wash his own pots up and leave yours in the sink? That is very lazy when your fiancee is working a 15 hour day!

I think you need to work on the tidiness, find somewhere to keep your make up that's easy, basket by the front door etc. My major way of improving tidiness is never leave a room empty handed, so whenever you get up always take one thing to put away, it really helps! X

notinagreatplace · 24/04/2016 15:28

It's worrying to me that he "tells you off". My DH and I have been together for over 10 years and neither of us have ever told the other off. We've said things like, "Oh, I'd really appreciate it if you didn't do X, it annoys me" and discussed that type of thing but we're not each other's parents, we don't tell each other off.

DinosaursRoar · 24/04/2016 15:28

OP - even if you lose your deposit money, do not marry him until he's got a job of some sort (not "self employed", where he gets perhaps one contract every other month then does lots of 'networking').

GreaseIsNotTheWord · 24/04/2016 15:29

when I raise the fact that I am paying bills he gets very upset, and tells me that I'm trying to control him financially, and that if it was a man telling a woman this I'd be up in arms etc

And he's totally right.

Be a grown up and put your make up back in the bathroom and your coffee cups in the sink. YABU and sloppy and it would drive me nuts too.

nobilityobliges · 24/04/2016 15:31

Thanks Dinosaurs. I definitely see your point. He does have a job lined up for a few months time, so I think that things will be better then. I think it's probably got particularly bad over the last few months as I'm in my final seat in my training contract so stressed about the next step, he's stressed about retraining rather than having landed a high-flying job in academia, and is worried about not having the skills for when he starts his software job later in the year. Things have not always been this bad. But I agree with the comments that we need to be able to deal with the bad times as well as the good, esp for the future if we have kids etc.

OP posts:
MrsMarigold · 24/04/2016 15:31

I think lots of people on here are completely hysterical, it's a minor glitch, talk, sort it out and get married. FFS people do over-analyse things on here.

MeadowHay · 24/04/2016 15:31

I've just gone back and RTFT and feel a bit differently! I still feel that you are being unreasonable with consistently leaving your shit all over even though you know it bothers him, and that you should make more of an effort to get into a routine of tidying up after yourself.

However with regards to washing up and laundry, I actually think he should be doing the vast majority of both of those things. I cannot putting a load of laundry on of just my things! If I did that my DH would be like Hmm. At the moment DH does all our washing up, and most of our laundry, as he is sort of on a career break and only works one afternoon a week. Obviously your fiancé is studying so it's not exactly comparable as he will have more work than my DH at the moment I imagine, but it's more the attitude that I'm talking about. Who washes up only their own dishes when it takes about 2 minutes to wash your partner's too? And only putting his own laundry on?! I just think it's bizarre.

I'm with other posters that to be honest you two really don't sound compatible. You sound resentful of his time at home. The way you have spoken about it in other posts...you say you respect him, and then you make comments like "I'm out at work all day so he can sit at home". If you respected his studying you wouldn't call it sitting at home. I really think you should have a massive think about whether this is someone you want to marry. If you go on to have children these clashing attitudes will become more of a problem, not less. And remember that it's always easier to cancel a wedding than to get a divorce.

nobilityobliges · 24/04/2016 15:32

And yes, it does upset me that he washes his own stuff up and not mine. Or it used to, but I guess I'm over it now. He sees it as a slippery slope or something, and I do want things to be equal. it's just hard to work out what equal is...

OP posts:
nobilityobliges · 24/04/2016 15:34

I do respect his studying - his book is amazing and I'm extremely proud of him. It's more of a "a room of one's own" type situ -- i would just like some acknowledgement that he was able to do this thing for his personal fulfilment because he had a dp willing to fund it.

OP posts:
RavioliOnToast · 24/04/2016 15:35

He is not your skivvy, have some respect for the fact he is at home and should be able to solely concentrate on his PHD instead of picking up your shit. If I was him, you'd find your makeup in the bin.

nobilityobliges · 24/04/2016 15:36

Ravioli - he finished his phd a year ago. and i'm not expecting him to pick up stuff. rtft ffs.

OP posts:
Therealyellowwiggle · 24/04/2016 15:37

OP, postponing a wedding is always an option. Sad

Marynary · 24/04/2016 15:38

Does he realise the hours you are out of the house aren't you out having fun, but working in a stressful job? Why can't he work and study around that? What will be the next reason not to get a full time job? (I would worry if the next step is to be self employed)

Writing up a PhD is also very stressful believe it or not. He has done well just to finish it. He is only in his mid twenties and there is absolutely no reason to think that he that he is finding excuses to not get a full time job, particularly as he already had one lined up.
He just doesn't want to be a dogsbody picking up after OP all the time which I think is fair enough.

teacher54321 · 24/04/2016 15:38

Dh leaves his teacup on his bedside table every morning. Does my head in. I occasionally whinge about it. But I always bring it downstairs with my own and load it into the dishwasher with mine because I understand that sloppiness about teacups on bedside tables does not measure the worth of our marriage. He is forgetful not malicious and pulls his weight in myriad other ways.

You sound busy, and stressed and I'm not at all surprised you are resentful. Dh went through a phase early on in our relationship where he was terrible with money and I supported him for about 2 years and I hated it.

Paleninteresting · 24/04/2016 15:39

Seriously, I'm vexed at the posters telling the OP to sort her mess out. Think, what if I was on my own, what would I miss if he wasn't around because by the sounds of it he would miss more.
What happened to the good old term cocklodger because this is what I am reading. Washing his own stuff and not doing the OPs when she is working long hours.
We have an odd definition of equality here. As I said before, take the money out of this and inject some caring, from him.
If she was sick from being overworked, they would both have a big problem.

teacher54321 · 24/04/2016 15:40

He wants things to be 'equal?'

You are getting such a hard time on here and I really don't think you deserve it OP.

TowerRavenSeven · 24/04/2016 15:41

You are going to have to realize equal isn't 50/50 all the time!

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