AIBU to not want to socialise with someone convicted of sexual offences related to children?

[tomhardyonthewaltzers]

Am I losing my mind? because apparently I'm being unreasonable!.

A friends wedding is coming up. Invitation arrived ages ago and I accepted. I was really looking forward to it as would see lots of friends from Uni I haven't seen for years.

One of our old friendship group was several years ago convicted of making and distributing child abuse images. He got a suspended sentence. His GF was also part of our friendship group and she stuck by him. I cut contact with both of them.

A few years later he was caught again and jailed this time. GF found out she was pregnant just after he went inside. Again she stuck by him and they now have two children together and are still a couple but not living together since he was released.

They're both invited to the wedding which I only just found out. So I told friend who's getting married that I won't attend now because they're going.

So now I'm being pressured by the rest of the friendship group. Told that friend who's getting married is devastated, that her wedding won't be the same if I'm not there to watch her get married. Can't I just put my opinion aside for one day? That they don't want to see him either but wouldn't let the bride down. I was even called selfish!.

I CANNOT watch him laughing and joking at the reception or having a dance or whatever. I just can't watch him enjoy himself knowing what he's done and I am more angry with his partner really, although I know that's unfair but I just can't fathom her thought processes at all.

Would anyone on here be able to put it aside and go? I do feel guilty about letting my friend down and upsetting her and it seems like I'm the only one of our friendship group making this decision.

I also agree that this thread shouldn't be pulled.
And yes, I'd also ask people who are saying go and just ignore the chap: How comfortable would you be letting your child near a person like that, knowing that he is looking at your daughter or son and imagines himself having an intercourse with them?

There's a lot of threads being out the 'hang em and flog ems' they're not pulled! I suspect it's mors because the McCanns are more interested in sueing people than having their priorities straight!

So after 8 years, SGB is going on my spreadsheet.

OP, of course YANBU.

OP to answer your initial question you most certainly are not losing your mind. You are to be admired for sticking to your principles and standing up for the children who have been, and still are being, abused by the existence of these images.

I'd like to thank those posters who have been so brave in telling us about their experiences. I hope this thread is not deleted.

Yes of course, but if MN have any no go areas, as they clearly do (yes, hadn't considered the suing possibility. "In the spirit of mn" indeed ) you'd think that minimising this horrific crime would be one of them.

Then again, as thenlater says, it's useful for showing us who they are.
Also for showing them how unacceptable the majority of people find their views.

OP, YANBU. Dont let anyone blackmail you into accepting those people back into normal society. Stick to your guns.

They placed themselves outside of the group. Twice. They should be ostracized.

Active paedophiles dont pay their debt to society and reform.
This pair already had their second chance and blew it.

From my experience. A neighbour, and very good friend of mine, was recently convicted and imprisoned for 12 months (served 6) for the sexual assault of 4 women. These are the women who chose to come forward, I know now that there are plenty of others out there. Not the same as child sexual abuse, but in my book it's still appalling.

Since he's been out, some old friends of his have visited, he's carried on with his hobby, he's back with his wife in the house where some of the assaults took place. He's got his life back.

I have chosen to have nothing to do with him. I can't look at him, talk to him, breathe the same air as him; he makes me sick. At the weekend, I saw him with another old friend who I haven't seen for some time. She obviously wanted to talk to me, but I couldn't - I turned and walked away. I'm in touch with her via Facebook and I'm debating whether to message her an apology, but I'm still in shock that she would visit him and stay in his house knowing what he did. His wife is a good friend, but I'm struggling to come to terms with the fact that she's stayed with him.

OP, you're doing the right thing. You're not condoning someone's behaviour. And until people start standing up for their principles in this way, abusers will continue to get away with it.

I've started a thread regarding Mn policy on this type of post (apologist) it's just occurred to me MNHQ could add to the talk guidelines that apologism is not acceptable.

There was a thread on here a while back which really opened my eyes to a poster who had never seemed particularly controversial or fucky before.

I was shocked by a really racist comment she made and ever since then, I see her on a thread and I just think: "cunt".

I think that will be the case for a lot of posters after this thread.

As to whether it should be pulled, I'm not sure. I've shared (alongside others on the thread) my experiences. I'm not sure I overly want them in the press as someone suggested (not my story personally but the whole thread). But, maybe there will have been some people who read the thread and didnt post who wondered about the whole "paid their dues" etc and could have consider the OP was over reacting , especially in light of recent threads regarding people being expected to keep the peace at family events etc. if you have zero experience of this then it may not be as easy to see why people can't just move on. By seeing some of the stories on here from people who have experienced csa, reading posts from people who work with those in that situation, maybe it will just make a few more people realise it isn't that easy and in fact be willing to make a stand if they ever come across this situation in the future.

for all that have shared, work with or live with this still.

Ratcatbag I'm so sorry, I mentioned the press and that was highly insensitive. I was het up and not thinking

The point I was making was that if the press did get wind of this, HQ would be falling all over themselves trying to fix it, PR stunts, shmoozing with advertisers etc, I have no doubt. Because it is a business first and foremost.

And they could hardly keep advocating the We Believe You campaign when they're basically saying "we believe you, but now it's time to get over it because abusers have served their time."

I know HQ haven't said this. But they've allowed posts to stand without taking a stance on the subject and that is what galls.

So, they'll delete a post telling someone she's a twat but they won't delete a post saying "but it's not that bad, is it?"

As to whether I would attend a wedding with my child if another guest had been convicted of this type of crime: I would base my decision on the facts as I knew them.
Firstly, the level of seriousness of the offence/s and how recent they were, in order to assess the potential risk. (a low-level offence committed long ago, followed by judicial punishment and therapy and no further offences would be different to a recent offence of a very serious nature)
Secondly, what I understood of the character of the bride and groom and the reasons for their decision to invite the individual: are they individuals with a strong belief in forgiveness/redemption? Are they people who might be yielding to heavy pressure put on them by someone else and therefore need support? (a hypothetical example might be of a bride coerced by her family into inviting another family member who is an abuser).

Saying that people should respond proportionately to crimes and criminals is not the same as saying that what the person did is acceptable and should remain unpunished. The more emotive the subject, the more important it is to focus on the facts and keep the response proportionate.

I'm normally not one for saying threads should be deleted, because I agree that certain posters should be shown for what they are.

However, I really do think this thread should be pulled before it ends up in the Daily Mail or on Matthew Wright's show (as Maryz said upthread).

There are enough trolls and weirdos joining this site on a daily basis, MN doesn't need to be attracting child abuse apologists, which could quite likely happen if this thread gets more exposure.

Saying that people should respond proportionately to crimes and criminals is not the same as saying that what the person did is acceptable and should remain unpunished

Thankfully those of us who don't spend our time trying to shock with our super-liberal sexual views know that refusing to have anything to do with a man who contributes to the sexual torture of children IS proportionate and should be encouraged.

It's people like you who allow them to carry on regardless while the victims serve their life sentences every single day.

I don't think posters who've shared private things have been ignored, I think it is just a fast moving thread. Ime it does help when pain is acknowledged though.

I'm sorry for everyone who has been abused and upset by this thread and certain posters comments.

Please don't apologise Walter. I did have a smirk for a few minutes at the family's reaction if it had of happened. My god, the screeching would be unbearable. but not something I want happening (mainly for my own children's sake than any of theirs)

I would love to see them squirm on your behalf Rat. I truly hope karma exists and pays them all out tenfold.

I would fully support the op in her decision to decline the wedding invitation. I would also urge her to end her friendship with the group who are so willing to accept this man back into their social circle. I will never be an apologist like some on this thread and wholeheartedly stand behind those of you shouting that this is not OK.

My partner was horrifically abused. He still has nightmares. He still gets so scared. He still can't let me in sometimes and our family nearly fell apart because of it as he turned to drugs to try to make it go away. My daughter nearly lost her dad to drugs, I would have had to have told her he died because that's what this does. That's the pain this causes. That's the ripple effect.

My heart breaks when I hear him screaming in his sleep or I see him battling with it in his head when awake. He shouldn't be in that pain, he did nothing to deserve it. He was an innocent child, the same as all the poor children in these abuse images.

It will never be ok. Never ever. In my eyes if you are an apologist, or a minimiser, or someone who is happy to socialise with a monster like this, then you have no soul. You are vile, inhuman, with no fucking soul.

It baffles me how anyone can say that scum like this have payed their debt and should be allowed to move on with their life...They should never be allowed to move on!! The victims can't...why should they be able to

I wonder if the posters who think this or think that it was only a 'low level' offence would be fine with him moving on with life right next door to you and your kids?

I'm so sorry for what your dp and your whole family are going through belle

And to all the survivors and family of surviviors who have posted on this thread; you are so brave to share your stories and I thank you for it. People need to know this isn't something that should be swept under the carpet. to you all.

Finally, to the people who work with victims and who work tirelessly to convict these animals; posters on this thread much have made you feel sick that your hard work and the victims you work with are for naught.

Most of us appreciate it. for you too.

Well of course you are right to not go to the wedding, OP. And in your shoes I would be honest with the bride and groom as well. It's a shame other people attending the wedding don't seem to have the same feelings about the situation.

Minimising the impact of the making and distribution of images of child abuse is repugnant. This person has been convicted twice. How people can resolve that in their heads as 'not that bad' is so far beyond my comprehension that I'm genuinely shocked.

One final thing - I'm appalled that SS seem to think that this man's children are safe from him if they are supervised by his girlfriend on visits. I can't see how she can possibly be capable of safeguarding them if she's so desperately in love with him.

So some people's opinions upsets others. Really? Well if that;s the case then those people upset should stop reading. On an open public platform.

OnYerBike, can you seriously not see that there's a line beyond which ordinary human consideration demands that you don't go? Sure, if I upset someone because I'm rude about boy bands, or dogs, or their belief in woo, I'm entitled to say they should suck it up. But if I upset an abuse or rape victim about something directly related to abuse or rape, it's on a whole different level.

flan Yes. Just yes. My heart goes out to your partner.

It doesn't end for the victim just because the abuser has been 'punished' by the courts. So why should the abuser be able to carry on their life like nothing happened.