To ask if you know anyone who wrecked a promising career

[icecreamwithflake]

And got their life together anyways?

Thanks Tobys. Thanks a lot

Discussion completely off now, really wanted to avoid details but have not and have never been sacked.

OP, no-one will be able to give you useful advice if you refuse to give any details of what you experienced, and then get snippy with posters who try to advise you based on assumptions of what may have happened.

I reserve the right to get snippy when people make stuff up!

I don't want to give detail and if that means I have to forgo 'useful advice' okay. I don't really care tbh.

Sorry but don't come asking for advice and support and be rude to everyone that offers it.

I don't see how the OP has been rude to everyone.

I really haven't been and I am genuinely sorry if I have come across that way. I'm very stressed, plus exhausted and depressed and talking about it is hard enough without people pushing for more detail which I appreciate sometimes people want it for context but also people do want more detail sometimes just to gawp over the detail.

Then when you don't give detail people make stuff up and it's horrible to read!

i hope you manage to work it out

A poster upthread said she'd experienced similar. Got TA work, then supply, then Mat cover, built up her teaching career again.

Is it the case that the person who pressured you into doing the thing that was wrong is the person - now retired - who has given you the bad reference. Were you not tempted to blow the whistle? Just you or others involved?

I suppose the thing is - how bad was the thing you were forced to do? In the scheme of things. Unless what you did was illegal or endangered children, (in which case you probably have to think again) there is probably a way of getting around the reference - in time - if you did as the other poster did and built up your employment history again.

There are also other things you can do with a teaching qualification - tutoring, FE, Youth work, think about those as bridges to getting back into it - if that is what you want.

I feel for you OP.

I don't think Tobys was having a go at you at all, just trying to find out what the circumstances were because teaching is different in terms of references/enhanced disclosure, and it wasn't clear whether you wanted advice on how to get back in (which may be impossible had you been sacked, but it sounds like you resigned but now have the very bad reference in which all the stuff is detailed anyway). She suggested you speak to an employment lawyer in that area, which is actually good advice.

ice-cream you do sound depressed, the hopelessness in the face of this (which is completely understandable) is coming out very clearly. Are you being treated for depression? It's so much harder to think of new solutions when you are depressed and getting treated for that (GP first, counsellor if you can get it/afford it) is probably more important than any other specific advice on the job situation.

To answer your question, yes I do know of people who utterly stuffed up and have good careers, I have a friend who was convicted of fraud (!)- however, what makes the difference tends to be time (so short memories, people moving on) and moving sector.

Are you working now?

www.gov.uk/work-reference

Posted too soon. People should refrain from.giving advice unless they know what they are talking about. It's not helpful.see my.link on the position 're: references.

Can you spell out exactly what you want, what we might be able to help with? I thought I was doing pretty well up thread with encouragement and advice, but I'm not sure now.

Do you want us to give examples of people we know who were teachers but are now doing something else without needing a reference?

I used to teach a vocational subject in FE, and have never used the college as a reference. I now work in the industry that was my subject. I did have a career before teaching though, which probably helped.

Did you have a subject specialism? Even if you don't say what it is on this thread might it help you think of something else?

Teachers tend to have a lot of experience in planning, delivery and time management, would you be interested in Project Management? The vocational qualifications aren't that expensive, compared to something like a new degree.

Ice cream, a little different but I quit in my final teaching placement of my degree as I just hated it. I did nothing to do with education, didn't retrain to do anything else, just simply had a go at stuff. I did also did some tutoring which I enjoyed.

I'm now happier in a completely different field- teaching gives you lots of transferable skills. I know lots of people from my course who did similar.

My interpretation of this is that you don't want advice on getting to teaching again or to discuss anything thst happened - it read to me like you just need a bit of hope? First step is to get yourself feeling better and stronger. Then things will improve and you'll find something you love.

I don't understand- have they withdrawn their job offer now?

No expert on any of this but just wanted to say it sounds like you have lived through a double nightmare - first the initial experience which sounds horrific, then having it all come up again like something out of a horror movie.

I personally don't believe you are unemployable, teaching is such a hard job with so many skills required that there are a lot of jobs out there that you could do in a heartbeat. However, I can imagine all sorts of barriers - yes you sound depressed, perhaps you are living in a deprived area with fewer jobs coming up, if you have ended up taking low paid work you can get stuck at that salary level for a while, there are a hell of a lot of zero hour /part time contracts out there, and if you've been earning not much then it's hard to do things like up sticks and move.

Depending on exactly how crap the financial situation is, if you have a roof over your head and some kind of income (and ideally a partner?) then yes I would think very seriously about going for motherhood, if you know that you want that at some stage. But do at least get assessed for depression.

I agree a thread about people that have gotten other jobs post teaching is a good idea - training leaps to mind, I'd have thought you'd be able to get a contract or temp job as a trainer in some capacity as you have those skills.

Thank you and I apologise again for being rude or irritable with people, I have to tread a fine line really between giving relevant information and between the possibility of being identified in RL.

Firstly I have not been sacked from any position but I have twice resigned to (possibly) avoid this. The first time was when I had done something wrong but was explicitly told to do so. However I'm an adult and have to take responsibility for that.

The second time was when I successfully was offered a job and then worked there for a term, however a couple of days before I started I was told that a reference from the school I mentioned in the paragraph above was needed, I did say that this might be hard as the HT retired, and they accepted this but then after the first term said they needed it, i told the head it would be a bad reference, she offered for me to resign and I did.

One thing I found after being scapegoated and resigning is that everyone I spoke to about it had been through something similar or was close to someone who had. Many employers across all sectors have their share of backstabbing bullies.

OP I don't know what advice to give but you really are not alone. You can get through this. But I agree with PP - please get assessed for depression.

OK. How awful.

How was the second job going? Were you enjoying it, were you struggling?

Are you in fact working now? Presumably not a school job?

I'm working in a school yes.

I think I probably am quite depressed but I won't do anything about it.

I can see that you are stressed and worn out by this all. I'm guessing that part of your stress comes from feeling like you have to be somehow deceitful when you need to provide a reference. It's also then a waiting game to see if you are "found out" afterwards. None of this is going to make you feel great and over time, it's going to make you feel worse.

You have said that you acted on a higher authority in the first instance. You resigned, so that there should be no disciplinary proceedings on your record, right? Your second resignation only came about as the first resignation and surrounding subterfuge came to light?

Do you want to remain in this profession? If so I can only really see one option and that involves you being proactive and being very open and honest if you get offered an interview. Guaranteed that without knowing you, the employer will be reluctant to offer you a post. However, if you were to do some supply and get to know the HT and colleagues, the situation may be different.

Alternatively, it's time to cut your losses and decide that your record makes you unemployable in this profession and move on. Is moving on easy? No. But being proactive and doing something about it will make you feel less like you're trying to climb out of a pit and ultimately make you feel better.

It is a feature of depression that you don't initially seek treatment. Often people feel they don't deserve help or are so despairing they're convinced treatment won't work. But help is out there and your situation can change.

I think you're in a vicious circle of a difficult situation getting you down, which makes you feel like the situation is more difficult...

I'm not saying that as criticism, I feel genuinely sorry for you.

Perhaps if you could get some help with the depression / stress, you'll find a solution easier to reach.