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AIBU?

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To 'confront' this man when he asked for the priority seat on the bus

622 replies

YoJesse · 02/04/2016 14:43

Me and Ds 3 were on a really packed bus, no seats left at all. I was standing and Ds was on one of the priority seats. The other 7 priority seats were taken up with what looked like young able bodied people and on Dad with a baby.

A man 50ish gets on, walks past all the other seats and says to me 'I'm disabled, can you move your son?' I got Ds up without questioning it but then I heard the Dad with the baby say to the man 'fucking hell, seriously mate?' This got me thinking that maybe it was a bit unfair so I tapped him on the shoulder and said 'as you can see I'm happy to give up the seat for you but as you can see there are lots of young, able looking people on the other priority seats, don't you think you should of asked them not my son?' He then goes off on one say ' I'm disabled, your son should be sitting in here in the first place etc' so I said that he is less able to stand on a moving bus than most other people so maybe he is entitled to the seat. The man got all sweaty and angry and I felt really uncomfortable so I got off.

Was I unreasonable to confront him?

OP posts:
MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 12:19

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MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 12:19

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MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 12:19

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MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 12:19

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MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 12:19

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MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 12:19

He gets it then. Stand up little boy - I daren't ask the adults!!

I'm not disabled but I can pretty well imagine that:

A./ disabled persons are sick of having to justify their need for priority seats and as a result get defensive in advance.
B./ they don't want to confront someone who could potentially attack them (and there are such people)

I also get the OP was upset to have to support her 3yr old but the thing is, the priority seat is for the disabled.

corythatwas · 04/04/2016 12:19

Presumably the man asking the 3yo did not realise that the person in charge of him did not have a seat so was not in a position to take him on her lap. What I would have done in this position, had I been the OP, would have been to have smiled at the man, then asked one of the other passengers if they could give up their seat and I would take 3yo on my lap.

browneyedgirl1974 · 04/04/2016 12:23

Ok understood and apologies. Only said bit about asking in general as op was told that she shluld have done this after her child vacated the seat.

browneyedgirl1974 · 04/04/2016 12:25

Good point cory Hadn't thought of that.

Inkanta · 04/04/2016 12:25

Oh dear Martina - what happened there - a lot of same posts in a row! Smile

candykane25 · 04/04/2016 12:29

To MartinaJ and all the others defending the man with a disability Thanks Thanks Thanks
It cheers me as a person with a disability that you are doing this and you have my back when I am out and about. I need people to be like you. It's hard. I don't moan about it but you know, life is very hard.
There's a moment to refer to a person with a disability as Enabled. People like you enable me to get through the day a little smoother and better.
Thank you.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 04/04/2016 13:00

Inkanta - ask yourself why the man probably felt safer asking for the child's seat than asking any of the adults to move. As so many have said on this thread, it is probably because he has, on many other occasions, asked adults to move and been abused for it. And this abuse is being heaped on top of all the other struggles that his disability causes him.

Given all of that, I can understand why he asked for the child's seat - why he made the choice not to risk yet another mouthful of abuse from an adult. Put yourself in his shoes, and ask yourself whether, in his place, you would have happily laid yourself open to verbal and even physical abuse for asking to use a Priority seat.

The sad thing is that it didn't work. This poor man still got abused.

In an ideal world, one of the adults in the priority seats would have offered the chap with the disability a seat. In a slightly less ideal world, one of them would have got up when he asked for the child's seat. Or someone would have offered the OP and her child a seat, when her child got up, to give the man his seat. In an ideal world, disabled people would not get physically and verbally abused for wanting to use the Priority seating on public transport. People would understand that this seating is not a perk - it is something that makes things you and I take for granted, possible for someone with a disability - ^and that without these things, people with disabilities would not be able to lead what most people think of as a normal life - going to work, to the shops, to medical appointments, to visit friends and family.

These things are not luxuries - they are aids that make life possible for people. A priority seat on the bus is no different to a crutch, a walking stick, a guide dog or a wheelchair. If you would happily take away a blind person's guide dog, or tip someone out of their wheelchair, then by all means sit in the Priority seating and refuse to give it up when someone who needs it, someone for whom it is intended, asks to use it. And by all means, abuse them for asking.

Most people would not take away the crutch, wheelchair or guide dog, or give a person abuse for needing to use them - so why is Priority seating different?

MartinaJ · 04/04/2016 13:06

Oh dear Martina - what happened there - a lot of same posts in a row!

no idea, firefox acting up sometimes. I reported those posts, hopefully they get removed.

Inkanta · 04/04/2016 13:26

' ask yourself why the man probably felt safer asking for the child's seat than asking any of the adults to move.'

I don't know - but it doesn't make it right. Maybe he took the path of least resistance. We can't assume he was expecting abuse.

To be honest I keep hoping this thread dies a death. There is something quite unsavory about arguing against the rights of a three year old in this way. That's why I joined the thread. Patronising people with disabilities does no favours either.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 04/04/2016 13:30

It is not patronising to say that no-one should abuse a disabled person for wanting to use the Priority seating that is there to make their lives manageable. Providing priority seating is not patronising either.

Given the number of stories on here and elsewhere about the abuse people with disabilities have received for wanting to use priority seating etc, I think it is probably fair to assume he was expecting abuse. It is sad that you are dismissing all these stories out of hand.

candykane25 · 04/04/2016 13:30

STDG bloody well said

"These things are not luxuries - they are aids that make life possible^ for people. A priority seat on the bus is no different to a crutch, a walking stick, a guide dog or a wheelchair. If you would happily take away a blind person's guide dog, or tip someone out of their wheelchair, then by all means sit in the Priority seating and refuse to give it up when someone who needs it, someone for whom it is intended, asks to use it,"

Best thing I've ever read on Mumsnet.

The attitude towards people who have a disability about what they are entitled to, being resistant to giving those entitlements, well...

These entitlements are not luxuries. They are enablements .If you want to disable someone, take away their AIDS and adaptations. And then abuse them in top of it, as STDG said.

LaurieMarlow · 04/04/2016 13:34

There is something quite unsavory about arguing against the rights of a three year old in this way

This, times 100.

Disabled rights should absolutely be respected. But I will never understand why the tide of MN opinion ends up with 'the three year old will have to suck it up' rather than 'it's an absolute fucking disgrace that able bodied adults don't step up to the plate'.

candykane25 · 04/04/2016 13:37

inkanta

I am a person with a disability

I am not patronised by this thread

I find people with disabilities are able to decide for themselves what is patronising or not

No one is taking against a three year old. No idea where that has come from?

I have a nearly three year old myself.

I don't think there is anything against three year olds here?

I'm not surprised you want the thread to die a death. It doesn't fit in with your priorities.

The thread won't die whilst people are refusing to understand the enablements society has a duty to provide for people who have disabilities. And by society, that also includes you.

I am able to keep my DD safe in a bus without disabling another person. And I hope my DD grows up to follow the example I set her and will do the same herself one day.

Inkanta · 04/04/2016 13:42

'It is not patronising to say that no-one should abuse a disabled person for wanting to use the Priority seating that is there to make their lives manageable. Providing priority seating is not patronising either'

It is patronising to suggest a person with disabilities is unable discern and ask an adult if they could take their seat. It is patronising to assume they know no better than to pick on the 3 year old child and the standing mother.

Providing priority seating is a good thing for those who are unable to stand or balance, and that includes small children. The mother (OP) had a duty to keep her child safe too, and if she got a bit edgy - that's understandable. Her son is her priority - and she should protect his rights for a safe journey.

candykane25 · 04/04/2016 13:42

laurie that's not quite what is happening.

It's an absolute disgrace that the IO confronted the disabled person.

Instead of assisting the disabled person to find a seat.

It he onus was not in the disabled person to find her child a seat.

The IP should have found a seat for her child if that's what she wanted.

Not made the disabled person day even harder by challenging him.

We all love 3 yrs olds. Please see the real issue here.

candykane25 · 04/04/2016 13:42

*OP

gandalf456 · 04/04/2016 13:45

I don't use public transport much now but when I lived in Germany, priority included women with young children, amongst others. Interestingly, when I had a job interview once, the interviewer asked me to define disabled and when I started, she interjected 'people can be disabled in different ways. People with children with them are, in effect, disabled because they restricted in what they can do.' I had never looked at it like that until then and would almost have certainly disagreed with the concept before.

Threads like these, I find slightly depressing as there is a tone of anti mother about it. We, as mothers, have to suck it up because we chose our life etc, etc. Never mind that having a small child around with you all day makes things difficult and restricts your activities and small children themselves are restricted in what they can do, too. This child was just as restricted as anyone else who would find standing on a bus difficult and unsafe so I think OP made a fair point and is getting a hard time.

And also, never forget that being anti-mother = anti women.

From what OP writes, this man sounded arrogant in the way he went about it. She was quite right in that he could have asked anyone else but he probably had the attitude towards women/children displayed above and, for someone who has to face prejudice in his daily life, that is a double standard.

Someone further up also questioned if he were genuine. I would like to say he was and would hate to question people but, logically, I'm sure the situation has arisen where someone not entitled has demanded a seat just because they can. Not everyone in this world is nice, unfortunately. Something about his attitude did not quite add up. Indeed, why home in on a defenceless child. It just seemed a bit bullying to me.

Inkanta · 04/04/2016 13:49

'No one is taking against a three year old. No idea where that has come from?'

I think so. A whole thread here about making a three year old stand up on a bus!

A three year old versus a person with disabilities!

Doesn't seem fair to me when there were other options??

LaurieMarlow · 04/04/2016 13:53

It's like a mumsnet meme to pit one vulnerable person against a slightly less vulnerable person - and argue to the death.

Rather than step back and say look, both should have seats, how do we make that happen?

Inkanta · 04/04/2016 13:55

'But I will never understand why the tide of MN opinion ends up with 'the three year old will have to suck it up' rather than 'it's an absolute fucking disgrace that able bodied adults don't step up to the plate'.'

Yes - exactly!

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