My dad is making me look wealthier than I am (long)

[dazedandconfused17]

I know my diamond shoes are too tight and in the big scheme of things I'm incredibly lucky.

When I was 22 I inherited a house and some land from my grandparents. It came to me as my mother had died when I was little. It isn't Blenheim Palace or anything, but it had been in her family since 1693 and parts of it date back to the 12th century. My DF thought at the time I should sell it, as while it is gorgeous, it has always been a lot of work to maintain etc. In the end (after a couple of years of faff), DH (then DP) and I decided to move in and try and keep the place going.

We're now in our late thirties and it's still here. It's been a rough ride, but so far we have kept the place standing and our family going. It has, however, been really financially tough, especially the last couple of years, due to a bunch of unexpected expenses, specifically massive issues with the roof. Last year in a real pinch, DH borrowed £2000 from a friend to cover vets bills for our dog. At the time, he was meant to be starting a new contract (he works freelance to help support the family) and thought he'd be able to pay back in a couple of months. The job fell through at the last minute and we've not been able to repay on time. Currently I'm paying it off at a rate of £400 per month, which is very hard (we have zero spare income at all right now) but it is getting done.

The friend in question has been, quite reasonably, annoyed with us and said she was only able to spare the money for a couple of months and needs it all back. Last time I saw her she had a massive rant about how we clearly could afford to as the kids went skiing after Christmas and we have a nearly new car.

The thing is this comes from my dad. He has always said that he won't loan us money (which is fair) and he doesn't want us to rely on him as we're grown ups, but does like to sometimes give random gifts. So, for example, he and my stepmum took the kids away, along with my half brothers (who are both much younger than me - closer to my kids age) for a skiing holiday. We could never afford it. And when he wanted to get a new car last year, he gave us his old one, which was a decent three year old VW Passat (I know! I know!). But this is all coming together to make us look super rich - we live in a huge house (even if currently we can't heat it) and we have a nice car and the kids go skiing and she is getting really angry that we're drawing out the repayments.

DH is working, but only part time as a postman as he hasn't been able to get a new contact like the one that fell through. I am working, part time out of the home and part time on our business which is meant to get the place a bit more profitable and a bit less of a drain. I did try and explain that we don't have money, just a gift from my dad, and she said that if he could afford to give us a nearly new car, he could definitely afford to give us the money we need to repay her.

Is she being U? I am pretty certain that DF won't loan me the money if I ask, and if he does he'll be really unhappy about it, even though he can afford it. Is he being U? Should I ask anyway?

We have tried to get a bank loan, but after a bunch of financial hiccups last year they pretty much laughed in our face at the suggestion of an unsecured personal loan and we can't take a loan through the business and spend it on a personal debt, I don't think. Loan should be paid off start of May, but it's just getting there.

You've explained the situation to your friend. You could get a loan or a 0% or other credit card to pay it off, or you could offer to sell the car to pay her back ASAP. See what she says. If she really needs the money now there are ways to get it to her.
Or once she sees that you have actively found a way to pay her it all now, she might be a bit happier and wait the two months for when it will be paid off.

Nobody is suggesting OP sells house to pay back the loan. Some posters are suggesting selling as the OP clearly can not afford to run the house.

Back briefly. On my phone.

Just want to clarify something. Friend is not facing ruin. It isn't that bad. I double checked with her today following posting this.

She is annoyed because she was having her garden landscaped and was expecting money back to pay for it. We couldn't, so she had to use savings and is now low on them and panicked in case something else happened. She's also unhappy as she says it is the second time she's loaned a lot of money and not got it back - she loaned her sister £10k and didn't get anything back due to sister's marriage breaking down.

She is cross but we had a really long talk and I was super apologetic. I said I was going to get a log book loan on the car and she told me not to be ridiculous - she didn't want me to sell my car, she was just cross at the whole situation. She has told me to just keep paying off at the rate I am as we are nearly there and she won't die without the money in two months.

She did say we were still her friends and she loved us. Just give her a better idea of what was going on next time.

I think OP needs to really sit down and do some soul searching about what her children are going to want to do in a decade or so. It does not look sustainable and quite a few people here who are suggestion to take yet another loan to pay back this one. That's wrong I think. It's not a sutainable situation and it's obvious you will end up with a love hate relationship with this house at some point. And the way you have put your youth into it, I am sure your children are going to resent it all too.

twinkle I don't imagine anyone is suggesting it's sold to pay this debt, but rather avoid the inevitable catalogue of upkeep costs and future problems.

A house and land that's been in the family for over 300 years and people are saying sell it to pay off a loan of less than two grand? Utterly bonkers. This isn't a bloody bungalow which granny bought for her retirement!

There are any number of families in a similar situation: asset-rich but little-to-no income. But you do have a number of choices:

Ask father for a short-term loan to pay that poor woman back.
Raise some funds through the business, either via a loan or finding a potential shareholder
What does the land produce? Or what can it be made to produce to raise income?
Maybe sell off a small bit of the land
Raise a lease on some of the land for grazing or farming
Or both of you work full-time until you have a savings-cushion.
If the house is large enough you could raise rent by doing an AirBnB

A house that old is nearly always a money-pit. It was originally built by people who had plenty. But that does not generally hold true of their descendants.

Sorry cross posted. So that bit looks under control then. Hope you figure out the rest too

I'm glad you sorted things out with your friend op.

I think this should serve as a wake up call to really sort out your finances so they're sustainable for the future. It doesn't sound like you can go on like this indefinitely.

Indeed the 70 acres of farmland isn't sustaining the family ingeniusidiot, OP has made that very clear already. I don't think any of the posters who've suggested selling some of it have been under the impression that it was a lot in farming terms? In fact that's probably why so many people have talked about investigating other uses. As for the masses, there seem to be rather more posts telling OP she's not got enough money than there are posts telling her she's rich!

That's good OP. And you've had loads of ideas of how to get that house and land working harder for you.

It is irrelevant whether you live in a 2-bed council house or a big country estate:
when you borrow from a friend, pay her back as agreed.
Or made it quite clear when asking for the loan that she might have to wait several months extra.

Did you even ask the vet about a payment plan, or did you just expect her to suck it up, without being consulted ?
She is totally NBU about the loan not being laid back on time: You put her too far down your list of priorities.

You are massively NBU not to even ask your dad - your embarassment is a price you need to pay, if that gives even a chance that your friend gets her money more quickly. You said he probably wouldn't lend you anything, but he might because your friend is the one suffering.

In your financial situation, taking out an additional loan might be risky.
Better to quickly sell jewelry, electronics, skis, antique furniture, designer handbags, clothes etc. I'd be surprised if you can't raise 2k like that.

Ah, your post just popped up. She's a very understanding friend.

dazed the thing is you are happy to betray the trust of your friend? You can't afford to live in the house can you? I'd like to have lived in my grandparent's large house but I couldn't afford it, you have to live within your means.

Glad you have talked to your friend.

It is a difficult situation. I wouldn't sell the house, it wouldn't even enter my head. Obviously you need to look at diversifying and make it pay for itself. Depends on size of property/lands etc but there must be some way to utilise it for the sake of the future of the property itself. Could it be opened to the public or used as a wedding venue/conference center? Maybe if you found something viable you DF would be willing to invest in it if you had properly drawn up business plans and a clear view of the future? He must has a vested interest in keeping it alive after all!

Keep going OP, maybe there will be something else you can do to earn some more pennies in the area. Make sure you are economising as well as you are able.

can you get lodgers?

I can see your issues OP, and I hope things work out. It si s agood idea to suggest renting out the big house and renting somewhere small nearby, but is the house in good enough condition for a renter with that kind of money to be interested? As an old property, might the National Trust be interested in helping out?

I think my big worry in your shoes would be about passing the place on. You have to hope one of your dc's will earn enough and care enough about the place to want to take it on. Would you be upset if they couldn't cope and had to sell it?

*sorry for typos!

Good you have sorted it out OP, there are have been some frankly bonkers suggestions on this thread.

Long term, it sounds like you definitely do need to find ways to generate more income, but I do wonder if posters would really sell off a 3 year old Passat (possibly pissing off father) to buy a POS car (probably cost more in the long run) for the sake of paying a friend £800 now, as opposed to in 7-8 weeks

Sounds like your friend has been lovely and was worried because of the situation with her sister. Having said that, if she's fretting over £800, she probably ought not to have lent the money in the first place (and I'm guessing you won't ask her and she won't offer in the future).

A house and land that's been in the family for over 300 years and people are saying sell it to pay off a loan of less than two grand? Utterly bonkers. This isn't a bloody bungalow which granny bought for her retirement!

^ This

OP as well as suggestions PPs have made, is there any way you can let out a room/part of the house? I wouldn't ask my dad, in your shoes. He is already helping you out in a number of ways ie holidays for the DCs, giving you his car. He does enough. & anyway the price of all this is him having inside knowledge and commenting on your financial affairs. Your house needs to "work" for you in some way.

You aren't being realistic about your life. You and your DH are grown adults with a family of your own. One of you is going to have to work very hard at least for now, to fund your lifestyle. & the other, if possible, is going to have to work too, at least part-time. If it means somebody working harder/longer then so be it. You can't spend your life turning to other people whenever you hit financial crisis. What happens next time?

As understanding as your friend is being, if a friend had been kind enough to lend me money in a crisis Id be so grateful I wouldnt care if I had to work 12 hour shifts or get a part-time job on top of what I already do - paying her back in a short space of time would absolutely be my 1st priority, there wouldn't be an opportunity for anybody to say I was taking too long to pay the money back. She lent you the money when you needed it, not 3 months after you needed this

Although I think you should stay in the house - doesn't make sense not to, & if it needs a huge amount of work would anyone buy it in the near future anyway, and it doesnt seem you'll have the money to do it up - you sound entitled "Friend is not facing ruin. It isn't that bad" I mean, so what? Thats hardly the point and nor is it relevant. & also, you aren't going to be able to rely on enablers always being there so, either way you and/or DH need to get up and improve your financial circumstances. Plenty of people have no choice but to do exactly that

BuggersMuddle - Yes I would if it would cause my friends real problems, Glad to hear it does not.

A house and land that's been in the family for over 300 years and people are saying sell it to pay off a loan of less than two grand? Utterly bonkers. This isn't a bloody bungalow which granny bought for her retirement!

Do some people just wilfully and deliberately try to not understand? It's not about the flipping loan it's about the roof and the fact that the place is obviously a millstone that makes them miserable and puts them under stress.

Re: ways we have tried to make money.

When I first inherited the house, both DH and I worked during the week and used it as a holiday home. That turned into a bit of an issue because there wasn't someone on hand to keep an eye on things so we didn't know when a window got broken and water got in, and we had squatters one summer which was a total pain. Plus in our area of the country there is a huge problem with young people leaving due to lack of jobs, house prices being pushed up by holiday lets etc and we felt like we were part of the problem.

So then I moved in full time and DH worked away. That worked until we had the kids. At the time, DH had the opportunity to move to contracting which would have made a bit more per year than he was earning working away and would cut back on the costs of him needing to rent a place to live during the week and he'd get to see the kids.

For nine years that worked - tough at times but with forward movement. If you'd asked me four years ago I would have said we were solid. We weren't rich - we had an old banger for a car, didn't have holidays unless dad wanted to take the kids, clothes were mostly Christmas presents or second hand - but stable.

The last two years everything went wrong. We had a total disaster with the roof which turned up some major structural issues which had has gone undetected. At the time we had to raise money by mortgaging the holiday lets to the hilt to get enough cash to get the house back into "structurally sound" so we could look at mortgaging or selling it. It wasn't the kind of 'repairs that always come up' - more 'once in generation problem facing medieval building'.

And that's been the last two years. Then last year, DH's last contract ended, right when we were in the middle of things. We made some bad calls because we thought he'd get a new one quickly and got ourselves into a hole with the renovations. We are digging ourselves out but it is tough.

Re: full time jobs - we can't both work full time, keep the house and land, and get the kids to school. I have three kids at two schools. They can't fly to and from school. I work part time, and then I do enough to keep the other businesses going. Home business + part time job earns more than I'd get in any full time job I could get around here, and there isn't much.

DH is actively seeking full time/contract work all over and will move away part time. It is just hard to get while working part time which limits his ability to go and pitch people etc. But we need the part time income.

We will get better. If he gets another contract, that gets us back on our feet and back in the game straight away. We have applied for several grants which would also let us finish the restoration of the house and mean the business stops being drowned paying for that. But right now it is tight.

Can you split some of the land and sell off a building plot ?