cultural appropriation

[nceccoli]

Just had a discussion. aibu to say that cultural appropriation works both ways? A number of black bloggers and models have slated Kim Kardashian and Kylie jenner for wearing "boxer braids". But I have yet to see anyone commenting on Beyonce culturally appropriate Indian culture , hairstyle, dress and adornment for her song Hymn for the Weekend?

It changes with time, though, Debs. What you call 'accepted' now is a miniscule snapshot of popular choice. It has no historical significance.

Do you know how many types of rope and of knots there are? How many different methods of spinning and weaving? Hundreds! All of which can be applied to hair, and have been.

Me, I'm shit at doing hair.

Ubik I really think that is insulting and a bit narrow minded and putting a whole race into a box. If you have never been called racist then that is what would constitute as a racism.

Ubic and its that kind of stereotyping and thinking is the reason why black people can't move forward. Am not saying that your black or white person laughing at themselves. Am saying this because if a black person should they decided to engage in any of the list you have mentioned they will be seen as outsiders and because of their skin colour it's not something they should be doing. We don't choose where and which race we are born but we can choose if we want to play polo or not or if I want to send my daughter to Russell group the equivalent to the Ivy League. Shame on you.

IME, People who think it is important to have the right to offend and go out of their way to offend, like to display their white privilege and superiority along the way. They also like to maintain the ingrained racist status quo.

racist? Against white people?

I didnt think it was possible to be racist against white people as they are the more powerful dominant group.

'Stuff white people like' is also satire. It's quite interesting to find yourself satirised as a white person. It makes you realise how rarely you experience these sort of generalisations. It's illuminating And the fact that there is a broad truth to it makes it even funnier.

Garlic I think with the braiding you are missing the whole point. No one is complaining about the French plaits or any other European one. The ones people complained about is specific. Just to be clear. I wouldn't give a hoot if any other races braided their hair in which ever way they want. I change my hair every six to eight weeks and I have had all sots on my head.

It changes with time, though, Debs. What you call 'accepted' now is a miniscule snapshot of popular choice. It has no historical significance.
For black people it does or more than likely did. The fact that they were denied work or called names and not just by other whites but by fellow black people people too for having a certain type of braiding on their heads. The gripe people have is the fact that they were not allowed to celebrate and be free with there hair it takes someone like Justin Timberlake, d beckham to make worthy of a magazine cover.

It's a satire on white cultural appropriation

It's certainly not racist

Seriously, ubik if you don't see what is wrong with that post then it explains why racism still goes on. Go and have a read a gain, look at what is on the list. Go and find black version of that and you will find the answer in the race divide.

It's stereotyping that holds people back. I also think that stereotyping is a form of emotional abuse because it's hard for people to break out of it once internalised.

Laugh away, I hope your not telling a child somewhere what white or black people like and how they should be to either be black or white or any other race.

i dont think it's meant to be taken seriously

It's satire. You know - illuminating political situations through use of humour. White people do not have to transcend cultural stereotypes in the same way that BME people to. That's a fact. it's interesting when it's done to white people.

Of course I'm not telling my children that only white people like camping.

Well said debrianna

How you found the energy - I salute you

And please no.more.fucking.plaits

didn't think it was possible to be racist against white people as they are the more powerful dominant group

Not quite sure where to start or what to say about that little comment really

White people debating black people issues -which they have no clue about (except Debbriana). how strange!

The 'what white people do' list was also particularly lazy satire.
It broadly represented what white 'rich' people do.

Also, wrt the big bum thing - it's mostly white middle/upper class people that are sneery about the rise in popularity.
"You can never be too rich, or too thin".

Regardless of how certain looks or styles became 'acceptable', it's surely a good thing that they are now?
I understand that it's like a kick in the teeth that what was formerly sneered at is now considered 'OK' just because some white people decided it was, but at least it happened and things are moving forward (iyswim?).

ubik ironic that list is written by a white man, and I actually like some of the things on that list but I'm Asian lol

Nonam
For anyone on here who thinks that black people should be over slavery, I would recommend a trip to the International Slavery Museum in Liverpool. I'm white. It made me cry.

I have heard people make that comment a lot. " why can't black people stop talking about racism or why can't they move on and so on" .
Am going to try and explain the little that I know.

The first thing that I know is that even though the slaves owned by Britain and American got their emancipation 200 years ago it was only about 60 years ago that civil rights movement become prominent.

(Nearly 100 years after the Emancipation Proclamation, African Americans in Southern states still inhabited a starkly unequal world of disenfranchisement, segregation and various forms of oppression, including race-inspired violence. “Jim Crow” laws at the local and state levels barred them from classrooms and bathrooms, from theaters and train cars, from juries and legislatures. In 1954, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down the “separate but equal” doctrine that formed the basis for state-sanctioned discrimination, drawing national and international attention to African Americans’ plight. )

These changes happened around the same time the first wave feminism was happening and the rights for women to vote in the uk was being campaigned. In comparison we can all see how far we have come with feminism and we think that racism should have disappeared? With both we have a long away to go and if we don't make an effort to fight then they will both stay the same or it will start to get worse.

I also do think that a lot of people think that once the emancipation happened, all the slaves where compensated and treated like equals and allowed to run around the world and do what they like. The answer is no. Not even the Creoles whose properties where confiscated and all their wealth taken way from them. Or even the black Wall Street that got boomed and burnt down because a young black boy brushed next to a white woman.

Just to conclude, even though all of the above has happened. Thank goodness for the Internet leading the way in fighting racism and sexism to a level that has not been done before. I also do think that black people are moving forward in their every day today lives by making their lives and children's better. I hope they are anyway.

Debri, that's how I understood it to be - it's still very recent history, within the still living generations.

I do t know what you're talking about but it's Coldplay's song, I don't even see how it 'features' Beyoncé.

I am rather confused as to how braiding hair in this particular style is seen as such a problem. Many people from different cultures either wear or adopt different practices from others, if this example is deemed as offensive are we saying that no cross culture is appropriate.

Hi Debbri! Great post. I have been hanging out on this thread because it really interests me, the subject of cultural appropiation, as in various aspects I worry I am guilty of it! (see previous posts!)

"The first thing that I know is that even though the slaves owned by Britain and American got their emancipation 200 years ago it was only about 60 years ago that civil rights movement become prominent."

^^This so much.
Like feminism (and class struggle actually!) it is a fight that has gone on/will go on, sadly for centuries I suspect.
But especially black history, because, as pointed out, it is so very, very recent, in living peoples memories and experiences.

Bunny and baddo
People don't always see it in that context. You still have generation of people who have experienced racism I will never ever experience ( I hope so ) and they will be in their 60s.

Orda1 I think you need to watch the Video. The blonde woman in the song and the woman singing the chorus is Beyoncé dressed like an Indian woman playing a Bollywood actress.

I also don't believe that you can say that an issue can only be discussed by a a particular group

No one is complaining about the French plaits or any other European one. The ones people complained about is specific. Just to be clear. I wouldn't give a hoot if any other races braided their hair in which ever way they want. I change my hair every six to eight weeks and I have had all sots on my head.

The whole thread is about Kim Kardashian wearing boxER braids. Which are not cornrows or box braids or similar.

The photo you posted of one of her sisters imo, was boarder line and I understand the point.

I absolutely hate that anyone is judged on their hair. But it happens. I have been lucky, in my work place I have never heard it based on race. I have been told it happens, so I am going to guess that (since I work in an office of hundreds) some did think like this and never said it anywhere near me.

I have heard a white woman being told her hair was 'too punky and out there to get a promotion'. I can happily report she did get the promotion so our senior team are not that type.

I hate that a white person wearing a style makes it more acceptable and mainstream.

But boxER braids or Dutch braids are not CA. The other issue raised was that some of the black community felt cornrows had been stolen and renamed to make more popular, mainstream and acceptable.They hadn't. Corn row and boxER braids are very different.

everydayfeminism.com/2015/06/cultural-appropriation-wrong/

Just leaving this here again...

ilove I really want to read it but can't get rid of the pop up.