to wonder if people would admit to voting "leave" in the EU Referendum?

[evilcherub]

Apparently there is a lot of inconsistency in answers when pollsters phone people and ask for their decision on Brexit compared to answers given online (respondents are more likely to say they will vote to "remain" on the phone but in online polls say they will vote to "leave"). I wonder if people admitting that they are going to vote "leave" is seen as taboo in the same way that nobody apparently voted for the Tories in the GE . If you are intending to vote "leave" would you admit it to friends and family (especially if you think they are more likely to vote "remain") or are you afraid of being called a Little Englander?

We were discussing this last night. With a mixed group of opinions. There was a bit of a general consensus from the remain team that people who wanted to leave for more likely to agree with the like of the Daily Mail. Thus there was a feeling that you were a bit stupid as you had been manipulated by the press.

Incidentally, as an Irish person, if the 'leave' vote gets it, this would see the return of border controls between North and South of Ireland again.

From what was being said today it would be very unlikely.

DontCareHowIWantItNow Haven't heard anything today. Was involved in political discussions on the issue on the good old Facebook yesterday and also asked a political party about it, and their feeling was that border controls between North/South would return. Hopefully Cameron would see the insanity in that move!

I'm undecided, still trying to sort out what it will mean - although I suppose no-one knows, really.

My personal experience has been that the people who I work with - wealthier professional people who perceive themselves to be 'in the know' - are adamant we should stay in, whilst my family and social circle - most who would consider themselves 'salt of the earth grafters' vote leave.

I don't see why someone would be ashamed. Both sides make compelling arguments, it's not like voting UKIP!

CornishPasty I agree with you on vote shaming. I know I oughtn't to but I judge these judgy people harshly! It's a mental battle I lose!

Until recently I would always have voted to stay in. Now I'm not sure - I think I could probably be persuaded to vote to leave - I really can't see what benefit we get from being in.

In terms of the economics, as one of the richer countries, we must surely pay in more than we get back? Just mathematically - if everyone pays in according to their wealth and then get subsidies back, I find it hard to believe we get more back.

Solobo The opinion that "leave" votes are Daily Mail readers and stupid is the sort of opinion that will lose the "stay" Campaign the vote.

By underestimating, stereotyping and dismissing as stupid your opposition you are not likely to tailor your campaign to change their minds. You also reveal your own prejudices and lack of intelligence. (Not you personally Solobo - you were just reporting a group's comments.)

My Oxford educated, (First in Politics), gay, multi-lingual male friend who has written several books and worked for many years with the OECD is voting Leave.

My Lesbian, mixed race - Cambridge -educated, (History), lawyer friend is voting Leave.

They both understand the difficult questions far better than I do - and neither lives in London

Oh and neither reads the DM

BabyGanoich- "The big issues being chaos in Europe in terms of finance (Greece has not been sorted out yet!) and immigration. I also hate unelected bureaucrat fat cat making rules/laws. It's deeply undemocratic! the European parliament has no real power, the bureaucrats decide everything and I don't trust the nepotist fat cats in Brussels"

I agree with you 100%.

I'm horrified that people would think, because I want out I'm a DM reader! It's not about being brainwashed by the press, it's about knowing the EU is undemocratic and a con. They haven't had any accounts audited for years!
And their reaction to the Seria and migrant crisis has been absolutely pathetic and embarrassing.

I'm in the leave camp.

Yes Hermione - you do pay in a lot more than you receive! (see graph on article I linked to above).

How would someone known what the DM is saying if they are not a reader themselves?

Voting OUT and proud and I'm no little Englander.

I'm Welsh speaking Welsh for starters!

I don't have a racist, xenophobic bone in my body .. but I know what a pile of undemocratic bureaucratic steaming shite looks like and it looks like the EU.

And Hermione .. there are very few net contributors in the EU left - a handful of which the UK is one of a dwindling number of Northern European countries. No-one's got any money because the one size fits all euro has fucked up their economies.

I am voting to stay purely because the thought of the Tories having their way, without any concerns about the Human Rights court, is terrifying. However, I haven't spoken to anyone about this IRL.

I actually think the Leave voters are the most vocal this time. Have to say, with the exception of this thread, they're all Britain First, Daily Mail, "SEND TEH IMIGRUNTZ BACK" losers.

Here's the graphic In vs Out thing

I will vote to leave. It's been diluted (the EU) so much compared to what it was. Countries like Romania and Bulgaria joining, what do they bring? Seems like it costs a lot of money, a lot of red tape, a lot of loss of control and for what? Better trade? Bollocks, if people want to trade with us then they still will.

hermione I think the problem is that it's had to put a figure on 'what we get back'. Different analysis seem to say different things. It's almost impossible to quantify the benefits we get from goods moving in free circulation within the EU - so without customs and excise duties etc as opposed to what we would without them in place, for example.

In the article in the economist linked upthread, it mentioned that EU membership cost each individual £340 per year, but the net benefit was calculated at £3,000 although I've know idea how those figures have been arrived at.

On the other side, they say government eu spending is around half what we spend on education, so a huge amount.

We would need to renegotiate trade deals which are likely to be less favourable and could potentially be disastrous - on the flip side, it would give us greater freedom to negotiate on our own terms.

The impact on the economy is the thing that is the sticking point for me, otherwise I'd be a firm leave.

Fontella I love your post!

haveigot which graph? I'm trying to get my head round the figures

I've posted the image a few posts up - but if you click into the article www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2016/01/graphics-britain-s-referendum-eu-membership it's easier to read.

It's In vs Out.

Note - the source of the graphic is 'Vote Leave'.

I think the Leave campaign are skimming blithely over the questions of what the EU will do if the UK votes to leave. They seem to assume that it will just roll over and say 'of course you can keep the same trade terms that you have now, of course you can exclude our citizens who live and work within your borders and there won't be any consequences, of course nothing will really change except to your benefit'. I think that's naive at best and I have not seen a single piece of analysis that takes that into account.

The US has made it pretty clear that Brexit will mean the end of the special relationship.

And before anyone starts accusing me of being a Euro-enthusiast - I'm really not. I think the Euro was the stupidest idea ever. I think the European Parliament is a bloated organisation and as for the annual move to Strasbourg - what a bloody waste that is. However, imperfect as the EU is and much as it needs change, the alternatives are worse.

I think the Leave campaign are skimming blithely over the questions of what the EU will do if the UK votes to leave.

Could also say that IN campaign are assuming that the European Parliament will ratify the promises that have been negotiating. There are no guarantee and it wouldn't even happen will after the ref.

Also - I tried to watched this fella yesterday.

He has a very monotone voice, so it's hard to concentrate on him, but probably worth a listen.

www.iiea.com/events/all-costs-and-no-benefits-the-implications-of-a-brexit-for-the-uks-foreign-and-security-policy?gclid=CMTvyJr_g8sCFQoKwwodZ94P1A

Ah cheers. But the in side are saying it costs us £350 per year and then the benefit is £3000 a year?

That's what's confusing me - are they talking about different things? The problem is it's hard to find information presented in a neutral manner.

pointythings that is the one thing holding me back from leave.