Dad not seen DS for over 3 years and wants to take him out without giving contact details..

[no73]

Posting in here for traffic as posted in lone parents and its a bit slow there

I'm a bit stressed so forgive any typos etc

DS father hasn't seen him over 3 years. His choice, despite him insisting on a court order, which he broke on numerous occasions and this led to me telling him in with a few choice words (in emails never in front of DS what an arsehole he was)Because of this so called verbal abuse (tbf I didn't hold back) he said he would not see DS anymore. This was on DS 3rd birthday that he told him this by the way, really nice bloke. All of Ex family also decided not to see DS as they supported ex decision to not see his son.

Anyway as I predicted when DS now 6 became easier to be around he got back in contact and also because his siblings are all having kids and he wants to play at being daddy again. After much disagreement, as ex refused to accept he couldn't just come down with his wife (she was OW) and take him out for the day, a contact schedule was reached. Letters first, then a few times at 2-3 hours each at my house without me there and then can be taken out of house. DS would not go to a soft play centre without me present and became very upset at the thought of it so the only way I could get DS to agree to see his Dad without me there is by it being in the house. Ex flatly refused to see DS with me present.

However, DS wants to be taken out to McDonalds now that he has a few letters and feels much more comfortable about the whole thing. I expected this might happen and is why I insisted on letters first to get DS used to the idea of seeing his dad.

However, ex is refusing to give full contact details and all I have is an email and a work address and he may give me his phone number. I am putting my foot down and saying that he can not take DS out of the house unless I have his address. I'm very concerned that he was so adamant about me being there and his complete and utter refusal to give me his address that he may just take DS. Ex lives over 3 hours away so its not like I can go round and stalk him, throw eggs at his house etc etc and I certainly wouldn't want to plus I have better things to do with my time and have no interest in ex's life at all.

I'm not sure where to go from here. I know that technically because he broke the court order on numerous occasions that it should go back to court however, I am trying to avoid that. At the same time though I would not let DS go anywhere with anyone unless I knew their contact details and that includes address. I'm not happy with just a phone number as phones can be switched off and numbers changed.

Any advice? By the way I don't expect ex to tell me everywhere he takes DS I just want full contact details and I think I am justified in knowing them.

[no73]

A court would insist on a contact centre because he has already broke one contact order and he hasn't seen him in over 3 years. This has already been said in the thread so I am not drip feeding at all.

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

73 Sorry, I thought you knew that as fact.
My understanding and experience is that contact centres are not inevitable even when there has been no contact for a period of time.

Your DS has developed a relationship with his dad via indirect contact, and he (your DS) has requested direct contact in the community.
A court would be unlikely to restrict that progress by ordering a contact centre unless your ex posed a risk to your DS.

In family court, Adults are deemed not to be a risk to DCs unless there is evidence to indicate that they are.

[queenofthepirates]

Ah come on, let's be kind to the OP. She looked after her son for 3 years on her own with minimum payments from an absent father. He's come back on, not really showing much remorse and wanting contact. She's facilitating but asking for some securities. To my mind, that shows care and compassion on her part.

Frankly OP, I think you are showing some restraint, I would be looking for a testicle on a spike before I would allow contact to resume (I speak in jest) (kind of)

[Canyouforgiveher]

I wouldn't give my dog to someone who refused to give me his address.

Fair play to you OP in facilitating this relationship despite 3 years of no contact by your son's father.

If ex really wanted a relationship with his son he would give his address, his cell phone number, get on with it.

He wants control. now in fairness he probably wants to see his son too (since OP has been nice enough to let them forge a relationship) but not enough to give up the control he wants over the OP, his ex.

How do these people live with themselves? How could you not see your son for 3 years? And then how could you think you can dictate as if you were on the moral high ground? unbelievable.

Tell him you need an address, contact info and otherwise let him go back to court. Send him an email saying all this:

"You refused to see DS for 3 years. Despite this, I accommodated your return to his life because I want the best for him. you have my full contact details- address, phone etc. In fact I let you into my home to see DS. I see no reason you wouldn't give me your address and phone number. If you want to be a parent then you must accept that I am also a parent -a really important one since I reared DS alone for the past 3 years and parents must work together. Please give me the information I need or else apply to the courts."

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

Oh, I don't disagree pirate - but, the OP has said that her ex has accused her of EA, but she denies it. If a man posted on MN that his exW accused him of EA but that he hadn't done it, the exW would be supported and believed.

The OPs ex may well be an arse, but looking at what the OP has posted from an objective PoV, I think she's going to struggle to present herself as beyond reproach if her ex calls her bluff and does seek a court order.

[no73]

Have you not read ay of the other posters comments about how their ex had to have contact in a contact centre first?? My solicitor when ex first left me told me that when ex stops seeing DS (she predicted all of his behaviour to a tee) that when he wants to be part of his life again he will have to restart contact in a contact centre.

My son has absolutely no recollection of this man, he has received 4 letters from him. Ex has massive form for not only not turning up for DS but also not regularly seeing his daughter. You think that a judge would just 'yep you can take your son out and no the mother of your child doesn't need to have your contact details'

You might think its perfectly safe to send your child off with strangers but I don't.

[Oswin]

If I gave up my daughter to care and fucked off for three years would I be able to stroll back in and demand access?
No I fucking wouldn't.
This piece of shit abandoned his child then won't even do his best to ensure that he sees his dc.
What a cunt

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

You think that a judge would just 'yep you can take your son out and no the mother of your child doesn't need to have your contact details'

Yes. I've read lots of posts on MN from distressed mothers, in exactly your position, who have been told just that.

[stitchglitched]

If a man posted that his ExW accused him of EA and then decided not to see her child for 3 years, leaving him in the care of said abuser not a chance would she be supported. If you are going to do a reverse of genders and least do it accurately.

[no73]

where have I said I have been emotionally abusive??? we have both sent argumentative emails its called having an argument not being emotionally abusive?? Jesus are we really living in a society where we can not call someone on their utterly disgusting behaviour!

I'm quite happy for him to go to court, it doesn't bother me. He was pulled up for his behaviour last time in court and no doubt he would be this time.

This is a man that hd an affair, that told me he was too skint to pay to see his daughter so I paid, I paid for everything in the home apart from mortgage and electricity/gas. He said he was too skint all the time he was taking the OW out for dinner and staying in hotels. Thats is emotionally abusive in my eyes not someone telling you your behaviour was cuntish!!!

[no73]

we paid half of mortgage and utility bills despite me earning a lot less.

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

where have I said I have been emotionally abusive?

You say in your first post that he accused you of verbal abuse.

If a woman accused her exH of verbal abuse here on MN, she would be believed. She wouldn't be expected to give him her address if she didn't want to.

[stitchglitched]

It is almost certain that after 3 years no contact a court would do a gradual reintroduction of contact that was child focused. They are unlikely to take kindly to a parent who disappeared for so long, has refused meditation and thinks he can dictate how it will go, whilst threatening to abandon his child again if he doesn't get his way.

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

And while I'm not unsympathetic to the way he's treated you - none of that would be considered relevant to his contact with your DS.

Even his absence from your DS life for the last three years would be set aside if he presented as committed to the future.

Family courts give parents the benefit of the doubt. Unless there is evidence that the DC is likely to be harmed, it is assumed that the adult has the DCs best interests at heart and do not pose a risk.

[Canyouforgiveher]

You think that a judge would just 'yep you can take your son out and no the mother of your child doesn't need to have your contact details'

Yes. I've read lots of posts on MN from distressed mothers, in exactly your position, who have been told just that.

Well fine. Let a judge say it so if there are any repercussions, the court system can take its share of blame rather than just the OP (cant you just hear it - What? you let you son off with his father even though you didn't have his address, what kind of a mother are you??)

Op if you have reservations, then let the family courts take on the risk you worry about.

I can't imagine a situation in which a father is happy to let his son live with his mother exclusively for 3 years with no contact from him but suddenly thinks that woman is unsafe to have his address despite the needs of their child.

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

six it's a fairly common disagreement in family court - and there have often been posts here on MN.

I can think of several posts in which the outcome of the court case was that the RP was ordered to hand a DC over for contact despite not knowing where they were going to be staying.

Even though the DCs father has not been in his life for 3 years, that does not, in the eyes of the court, mean he poses a greater risk to the DC. Assuming there is no evidence of risk, then The court is concerned about the child's welfare. How does the DC feel about contact? Will he be comfortable?

A meeting between child and parent, requested by the child, in a public restaurant, will be considered beneficial and not a threat to the DCs welfare.

OP as you've been to court before, were you and your ex ordered to attend the CAFCASS Parenting Course ?

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

the only reason considered would be how does it benefit the child.

A court won't consider the RP's peace of mind when making an order - it's would be up to the Rparent to prove why she needs the address, not the NRP to prove why he shouldn't give it.

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

Definitely - and there are many cases where contact is facilitated by a third party or away from the home, and the NRP doesn't know where his DCs live.
Schools will sometimes facilitate passing on letters and cards if indirect contact is ordered.

[PrettyBrightFireflies]

Look at it the other way though. Why does an ex need the address?

Take me and my ex. Either I'm a risk to our DD or I'm not. If I am, then him knowing where I live/stay with her doesn't make me less of a risk.

He may want to know my address for his peace of mind, but that is irrelevant to my DDs safety, and the court isn't there to consider what is of benefit to him.