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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be flabbergasted by this?

300 replies

Cloudhopping · 03/02/2016 12:59

My dd is in year 5 of a village school, which we are really happy with. As it's small, I know most of the parents at the school. My dd is learning about Islam as part of RE and is today visiting a Mosque as part of this. Some of the parents have not consented to their children going as they don't want their children visiting a mosque. I'm not sure of the exact reasons and realise I am making some assumptions here, but am I being unreasonable to be shocked by this attitude?

OP posts:
Sosodizzy · 03/02/2016 13:38

Is a visit to a church teaching children about paedophilia? Is a visit to a synagogue teaching children about women wearing wigs?

Keeptrudging · 03/02/2016 13:38

No Muslim pupils I have ever taught, in any of the schools I worked in (over 15 years), have ever participated in church visits. Special arrangements were made for them. That is just my experience, others may be different. I found it quite sad that whilst we were busy teaching all pupils about world religions (including mosque visits at times), it wasn't reciprocated.

lunar1 · 03/02/2016 13:39

As for cultural diversity, we are a mixed race family. My children speak 2 languages and are learning a third. We have a very wide range of friends and manage to expose them to many cultures and religions, all without teaching them that sexism is ok.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 03/02/2016 13:41

Hmm, tough one. While I understand and appreciate Lunar and Laguna's points, I still think that knowledge helps - and refusing to allow children to see the inequality, means they remain to a large extent ignorant of it. If they get to see it themselves, then it will help them to understand people of that faith.

THat doesn't mean in any way that they should accept it, nor that they should be inculcated into believing that way is "right" - but the knowledge that segregation exists is worth having, IMO.

Purplepicnic · 03/02/2016 13:41

But it's a visit, not a donation or a show of support. I'd let my children go to let them see how others live and decide for themselves what they think.

Plus there are x million Muslim women around the world who have no problem using a side entrance. Just because it's different to what we would do, doesn't make it wrong.

MerryMarigold · 03/02/2016 13:42

I went on a school trip to a mosque. As I recall the girls did not need to cover their hair (adult helpers did). Neither did they need to use a separate entrance. So much ignorance!

In terms of this: it is there [sic] right to make a decision for their children - just as you make a decision for your children

Of course it is, as it is not a situation of abuse. However, plenty of decisions people make about their kids are questioned on here every second. No, I would not let my 10yo child play Call of Duty, whilst plenty of others would. What the OP is objecting to is the likelihood that this decision has been prompted by religious intolerance. Which she disagress with.

IssyStark · 03/02/2016 13:42

Sadly this level of bigotry doesn't surprise me. I grew up in NI and in secondary school one history field trip was a tour of our town and some parents refused to let their kids go into the RC church (or chapel as they insisted in calling it) but they were allowed to go into Protestant denominations other than their own.

wheelofapps · 03/02/2016 13:43

I wouldn't want to stop my dc having experience of other cultures / religions but I would want a 'class discussion' on the 'differences' to be part of the educational element of it. ie I wouldn't stop my dd going due to the side door issue but I would expect her teacher to bring it up as a discussion point.

NorthernBird92 · 03/02/2016 13:43

My dh is a soldier we live on the quarters and my child will be going to the local school on the garrison which is mainly military children. There is absolutely no way I would permit a visit to a mosque. Nothing to do with religion and I am in no way racist however a group of military children visiting a mosque to me is like a massive red bullseye on a terriosts target. If she was in a civilian or more mixed with civilian children school I would have absolutely no problem with it

Junosmum · 03/02/2016 13:44

I'm surprised too. It's an educational trip - the same one I did when I was in yr 5, 25 years ago! We were asked to cover our legs, shoulders and heads. In the same way I had to cover my knees and shoulders in a Buddhist temple on my honeymoon last year. I don't see why people have such an issue with it.

lunar1 · 03/02/2016 13:44

I agree that seeing these things for them self is important, but under the correct circumstances. A teacher is hardly going to talk about the morality of segregation to a group of infant age children while walking through a mosque.

Collaborate · 03/02/2016 13:44

A visit to a mosque would is a great idea, particularly when there's so much Islamaphobia about. It would be good for some of the kids with racist parents to discover that Muslims are normal human beings.

As for different treatment of boys and girls, what a fantastic opportunity for the teacher to engage the whole class in a discussion about gender discrimination in religion as a whole.

And what a shame that some Muslim children don't get to visit other places of worship. I'm sure it's not all. At my daughter's school carol concert there were Muslim girls in the choir. It was fantastic to see such inclusivity.

Only1scoop · 03/02/2016 13:45

Yabu to be 'flabbergasted'

You don't know their reasons

AlwaysHopeful1 · 03/02/2016 13:46

I think it's a bit silly of you to be 'flabbergasted', a bit ott? You don't know the parents reasons, focus on your own child and just not your business.

Collaborate · 03/02/2016 13:46

lunar1 Year 5 is not infant age.

AppleSetsSail · 03/02/2016 13:47

You do realise that children are able to grasp nuance?

We visited Damascus before it fell into its current state of unrest and visited the various Islamic and Christian sites (Umayyad Mosque).

My son still occasionally references this visit in his various historical and RE exercises, I'd hate to have deprived him of this experience because of some dogmatic principles. We live a life that makes it impossible for him to see women as second-class citizens.

LittleLionMansMummy · 03/02/2016 13:48

I am uncomfortable with religion generally and not particularly keen on the fact that women in mosques must pray in a separate room, much as a dislike generally the teaching that men and women are so different that they must be be treated differently. A lot about religion irks me. However, it's an important lesson in life to understand and respect other people's beliefs, even if you don't agree with them. Ds will be going on these visits and will make up his own mind about religion. We always answer his questions with 'well, some people believe x'. Awareness and understanding is a crucial lesson in life.

LagunaBubbles · 03/02/2016 13:48

Plus there are x million Muslim women around the world who have no problem using a side entrance. Just because it's different to what we would do, doesn't make it wrong

Thats their own choice, and yes I do think sexism is wrong actually.

Sadly this level of bigotry doesn't surprise me. Bingo. Disagreeing with sexism doesnt make anyone a bigot.

LovelyFriend · 03/02/2016 13:49

YABU to be shocked.
I think it's fairly obvious that there are lots of ignorant racists in the UK. Your village is no exception.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 03/02/2016 13:49

Surely Y5 is 9/10 year olds? Old enough to have the discussion, certainly.

RedToothBrush · 03/02/2016 13:49

I honestly can think of a good reason why you would ban your kids from going to a mosque.

Lots of shitty lame bigoted, narrow minded, ignorant ones (which include those who regard Islam as being sexist). But no good ones.

I look forward to someone enlightening me.

nancy75 · 03/02/2016 13:50

there are x million Muslin women around the world who have no choice but to use the side entrance - we don't know if they have a problem with it.

Is a visit to a church teaching children about paedophilia?
I wasn't aware that paedophilia was a key part of the Christian teachings?
Islam teaches that men & women should be separate, I don't think Christianity teaches that people should abuse children?

LagunaBubbles · 03/02/2016 13:51

However, it's an important lesson in life to understand and respect other people's beliefs, even if you don't agree with them

My sons dont need a visit to a mosque for that to happen.

AppleSetsSail · 03/02/2016 13:51

Show me a perfectly reasonable and egalitarian religion, please? They're all slightly bonkers, but with historical and cultural significance. Pretending they don't exist is a recipe for (frankly speaking) ignorant adults.

Minniemagoo · 03/02/2016 13:51

My children go to a multi denominational school and DD1s class recently visited a synagogue and a number of children did not participate, they also did not participate in yoga classes in school (school now do mindfulness instead which is apparently ok). They are children of varying Christian denominations (Incl a couple who go to our church) and I find all bar 1 family would be quite hypocritical ie Halloween ok one year, not the next depending on their plans.
I wouldn't necessarily say that in the OPs case that it isn't just Islamphobia but likely they are prats about every religion but their own of which they probably aren't good examples.