To think that this is the end of women's athletics?

[fidel1ne]

And women's international sport generally?

Transgender competitors will be allowed to compete as the gender of their choosing pre-operatively and after just one year of hormone treatment.

Doesn't this fly in the face of certain feminist theory that women and men can compete in athletics as equal (as an example) and kind of undermines the reasoning to downgrade some entry points (military being an another example)

/being contrarian for the sake of it

No more outrageous than allowing Russian drug cheats to keep the medals they should not have won in the last Olympics.
The whole Olympic system is broken.

Very sad for women and for sport.

What feminist theory is that?

I thought, following the Olympics drug doping escapade, drugs being banned and all, surely hormones should be included in banned substances if they effect your performance. logically.

justanotherlurker
No feminist theory puts women and men as physically equal.
Feminist theory strives for fairness between physical differences in (eg) height and strength. Ergo, segregation based in biology...

Ophelia ... but a transwoman taking female hormones (and whatever you take to block testosterone) would be taking stuff that would weaken performance (I think?). So not the same thing as taking performance enhancing drugs.

I think the ruling is flawed, and this is v unfair. I also think that transwomen should be allowed to live as fully as possible, as female... is it possible for transwomen to have hormone levels within the "normal" range for non-trans females? In which case, surely the answer is obvious...

just seriously? Undertaking something which is relies primarily on intellect as an equal to a man, is totally different to this situation where humans who are genetically male are allowed to enter female sporting competition.

Actually, that testosterone limit looks like the first literal comfirmation of my theory that a woman is now "anyone who is not a manly man (by some arbitrary standard of manliness)."

Because no-one can possibly argue the limit is normal for female women athletes.

Sex hormone levels are not the only factor relevant to sporting performance, Saz. What about existing physiology? Muscle mass, pelvis shape etc?

... of course, having testicles and a penis isn't normal for female women athletes either.

So now it's okay for athletes to take performance de/enhancing drugs, as long as they call themselves TG?

Why doesn't that extend to snowboarders being able to smoke dope?

Yanbu. We women are being royally fucked. And not in a good way .

So now it's okay for athletes to take performance de/enhancing drugs, as long as they call themselves TG?

That's it in a nutshell, isn't it? Nobody has to show enough commitment to the transition to have any surgery.

Garlic I believe you are right.

There were women on that list of people who have agreed to this travesty. How on earth have they allowed this to stand?

What feminist theory is that?

I'm wondering the same thing too.

I'm not aware of any feminist theory that claims that men and women are directly comparable in terms of physical strength/stamina.

Can someone explain the serum levels thing to me? Sorry to ask but I don't understand

YANBU

I really can't believe this has happened. I thought it was probably the path we were headed down but I'm floored it's happened so quickly.

You're right. I would imagine that pretty soon there's going to be no one that's actually born female in the Olympics. And I agree that since it's so competitive that of course there will be plenty of men/countries who'll do anything to "win".

Why is it always fucking women that get sidelined for every fucking minority group that is so much important than a mere woman.

Only read first few posts as I'm going to sleep.

But this is absolutely OUTRAGEOUS.

Honestly, is there nothing left for just women anymore that men don't feel entitled to infiltrate?

FFS.

"I really think women have to stand up for themselves here, threaten a boycott of the olympics or something. It is absolutely ludicrous."

Maybe have an alternative women's event. :)

So is there any point in women bothering with the Olympics any longer?

It's just that previously male TG athletes will only have to demonstrate that their blood testerone levels are 10 nmol/L or less to be eligible to compete Humphrey.

10 nmol/L is also almost FOUR times the top of the normal female range for naturally occuring testerone. So much higher than a woman would naturally have.

But it is bang on the bottom of the normal range for men.

So athletes with testosterone levels much closer to those that occur in men than tp those that occur in women will be clear to compete.

What are the female athletes saying about this, there should be a strong response.

It has to be a joke, surely?! HOW can any sane person think this is a reasonable suggestion?

I guess we shouldn't be surprised, when a 52 year old transwoman is allowed to play college basketball, huh?