To wonder what your views are on 'working class' accents

[Timri]

And think people need to learn the difference between the words correct and standard
Inspired by a comment by somebody saying they didn't look down on anybody's accent, but hated words being pronounced 'incorrectly' such as 'bovvered'.
Uhm, it's called th fronting and it's one of the central features of a cockney accent FFS.
Please tell me I'm not alone in this?

The lack of knowledge about phonetics and linguistics on here is depressing.

Twinklestein, sorry, the question mark completely changed the way I took the sentence! But I agree, it doesn't.

Scotland has its own set of posh accents and WC accents just like England does. If you leave the UK and observe from outside, you will see that the only genuine differences between the two countries are a) one is further to the north and b) one is smaller than the other.

Educate us, then dexra - don't just stand there and sneer.

I'm just a bit tired. I'm not really sneering and wish I hadn't made the comment. People's views on accents are value judgements based on prejudice. RP and standard English accents have the highest status in this country. The anecdote from a pp about her scruffy DH buying a car illustrates this so clearly.

Not all posh Scottish people who went to Scottish public schools have Scottish accents - Tony Blair was born in Edinburgh and went to Fettes, a very smart Scottish school.

At some point in his life he decided that a fake 'man-of-the-people' accent would better serve his ambition.

Sorry, derxa

I think it's a really interesting thread but would have been better referring to 'regional' rather than 'working class' accents.

www.aston.ac.uk/research/case-studies/you-are-what-you-speak/
Here is a clearly explained article which indicates that attitudes may be changing.
Tony Blair did go to Fettes but he didn't grow up in Scotland. Conversely you can hear some Scottish vowel sounds in his speech. His father grew up in Glasgow.

When he wasn't at school he would presumably have been with the family in Durham. Glaswegian dad, Irish mum.

I understood that he pretty much erased his Scottish roots because it was felt he would do better within the. Labour party if he were perceived as English, and the accent was part of that.

I like a working class accent. Mine is Cock-er-nee.

It really doesn't appear to have the same stigma regarding working in the City (of London) that it used to. Thankfully.

I don't entirely agree with the Aston link. If the divide between rich and poor is returning to normal levels (i.e. a bigger difference) then rather than accent/class differences becoming less important they become more so.

(Yes, if you said ISIS to me 15 years ago one of the associations for me would always have been the very long standing Oxford journal of that name where many a writer first started their career).

The Aston piece seems a little optimistic to me, Deo - the experiences shared in this thread show that 'accent prejudice' is alive and well!

In the UK you are judged on three things : your accent, which school you went to and what your dad does for a living.

Your accent has a pretty strong effect on your life, I'd say.

And the university perhaps to an extent too as if it's oxford not Middlesex that probably means you are bright or at least pulled your finger out at school in your teends and weren't a slacker.

Some people are bright enough to go to Oxford but choose not too regardless of class.

Perhaps there should be a campaign to make being northern and/or working class a protected characteristic for discrimination legislation purposes as there are certainly a few people admitting to blindly discriminating against such people on this thread.

it's a good job I decided to stick with the first job I found seeing as being a working class miners daughter who went to a bog standard comprehensive school and talks like she could be found down t'pit hersen, I would have had no chance of getting any kind of high flying job .

Although after a few promotions and a first class honours degree but from an ex poly so obviously doesn't count I don't think I have done too badly to find myself on a secure fairly stress free usually 35-40 hours pw job paying just over £40k pa.

I remeber a thread similar to this and the snobbery surrounding accents was/is astounding. There was a comment about the bbc breakfast bussiness (sp) presenter the poster was put off watching because her accent was too northern

My mum has a posh accent and sales people always rush to help her as well. She thinks it is because they respect her, but obviously it is just because they can tell she has lots of money!

mrsjayy hope they didn't mean the lovely Steph? I like her!

Yeah Steph the posterreally meant she sounded common

Barbara, my family were minors and I am originally from the NE. However to fit in to some kinds ofj obs you just need to speak and dress in a particular way, just as you did down the mines. You can easily fit in. You just change how you speak and dress. Simples really.

I really like Steph too and I think it's great that the BBC does have regionally accented presenters, even if it still is too London-centric.

However, not everyone feels the same www.theguardian.com/media/mediamonkeyblog/2014/nov/25/viewer-offered-bbcs-steph-mcgovern-20-to-correct-her-northern-accent

I see accent prejudice as no different to racism and am suprised that so many people admit so openly to it.

Deo that fact is no one should have to change their accent

The Uk prohibits race and sex etc discrimination but not class or regional or even Indian caste discrimination or discrimination when someone is fat.

Mow we might as someone above suggests legislatte to do so but it is not currently illegal. If your customers won't buy from you if you don't speak like they do then an employer might well want some kind of speaking requirement just the same as they will often require fluent English for many jobs.

(miners.. not minors! in my post)

I don't think Steph sounds common just Northern. Is there anything wrong with sounding 'common' anyway? As long as you can be understood and don't talk rubbish. pish