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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To feel incensed by the woman who gave me daggers today

331 replies

lill72 · 13/12/2015 23:32

I took my 5 year old to a Christmas carols concert at the Royal Albert Hall today. Lots of children go, as it is a singalong. There are also lots of older people there. We were sitting just behind a group of women in the 60's. My DD accidentally kicked the back of the seat of one women. I could not believe the daggers the woman gave me. She turned around and I tried to explain I was doing my best to stop DD from doing this. She just kept staring at me, trying to show her utmost disapproval. She did not mutter a word. ONLY STARED.This was when she did it once. My daughter then did it once more just brushing her feet, again, by accident and the woman turned and did the stare. It was mean and it was ugly.

After interval, I put my programme in front of me so she could not make eye contact with me. My DD unfortunately brushed the seat again as she was a bit restless. the lady turned but she could not make eye contact. I thought I am not giving you the satisfaction miserable old git.

I get it. It is annoying when someone hits your seat. But she was really awful the first time it happened. As my daughter was doing it by accident when she moved it is very hard for me to control. It really upset me soneone could be so harsh when it's an all ages xmas singalong which is supposed to be joyous and bring love and the Christmas spirit into your heart. I feel like sometimes people have forgotten what it is like to be a child or have children.

After this, I did everything I could to stop DD doing it again.

This woman kind of ruined my afternoon. I try my utmost to have a well behaved daughter and I am always aware of others around me, so much so that I probably apologise too much for things I do. I just find this sort of behaviour from this woman so nasty and bereft of any sort of forgiveness for the fact it was a child. I think of anyone, this woman was the one with the appalling behaviour.

The other woman around me were lovely.

OP posts:
CainInThePunting · 15/12/2015 00:35

Ah, I see how this thread was supposed to go, OP is the only one allowed to 'rant and piss and moan on mumsnet'.
Others can only post if they agree with her...
Hmm

Selinemaratima · 15/12/2015 00:54

they could always start their own pissy moany thread 😜

Original poster
lill72 · 15/12/2015 09:40

Cain - you really have not listened to a word I said.

I explained to my child numerous times not to touch the back of the seat. As I said i even held her feet for fear of her accidentally brushing the seat as she moved in her seat perhaps swaying to the songs.

I just think someone should not give you dagger stares the first time it happens. Give some a chance.

I did talk to her and tell her i was trying to do my best. She could not hear me for the music was too loud and that dagger stare was ridiculous. I am sorry but it would get anyone's back up.

I am constantly saying sorry - in fact I would say I over apologise. I catch myself and think why am I saying sorry to people for everything. But nothing but nothing warranted that death stare the FIRST time. It has nothing to do with her being old - she was badly behaved. Why are only children only ever called badly behaved?

Goodness I just some people in this life wont give an inch to anyone - child or not. Cain you appear to be one of them.

OP posts:
Original poster
lill72 · 15/12/2015 09:48

Lynda - I explained to her I was doing my best and was all ready to be apologetic but the music was so loud she could not hear me. I DID apologise but when he gave the death stare that was it.

Gees it makes me so sad that the young and the old just can't see how one could possibly benefit the other...

OP posts:
Original poster
lill72 · 15/12/2015 09:53

striped I was not holding her feet to stop her kicking. I was holding her feet for fear she would touch the seat accidentally when she moved in her seat. BIG DIFFERENCE!!!!! There was no intent to kick ONCE.

She was simply moving in her seat - her feet cannot touch the ground so when she swivels the feet can brush the seat in front.

Last time I went to this concert there were so many children which is why I took her. This concert they seem to be in the minority.

OP posts:
Original poster
lill72 · 15/12/2015 09:55

Yes this was a sway and sing show. A singalong and sometimes we were encouraged to stand and dance to the songs. So it was not a sit and watch concert at all!!!!

OP posts:
KakiFruit · 15/12/2015 09:55

How could the "old" lady have even felt it if your daughter was "brushing" the seat? Come on.

Toffeelatteplease · 15/12/2015 09:59

Yabu

I have a DS whose legs kick out as part of his SN

He still doesn't kick anyone in the back of the chair.

You do want you have to. You take off the shoes, you book a seat with noone in front of you. You don't take your child to the theatre unless they can behave

Once is an accident repeatedly is antisocial. You were not doing your best. You could have taken her out if she did it again. You didn't. You did what suited you at the expense of the poor woman in front.

No wonder she shot you daggers

Original poster
lill72 · 15/12/2015 09:59

HPsaucisness I think so too!

OP posts:
PurpleDaisies · 15/12/2015 10:05

Gees it makes me so sad that the young and the old just can't see how one could possibly benefit the other...

You seem absolutely determined to make this about age. It could just as easily have been a middle aged man in the seat in front who turned round and gave your dd the "death stare". People do not like having their seat kicked. If it had been me (34) I'd have told you/your dd to stop it.

Original poster
lill72 · 15/12/2015 10:21

Toffee - my DD did behave. It was accidental. After I told her she did stop and I made sure of it. But I cannot control how she moves in seat 100% of the time. I did sit and stare at her feet for a while as i was paranoid.

I think if you dont include every detail on her people jump to conclusions.

I am a decent person and try to cause as minimal disturbance as possible with my children.

people should give an inch to others, whoever they are when they are in a public place or stay at home.

OP posts:
Selinemaratima · 15/12/2015 11:17

Oh lill Just give up hun, seriously we all need to be a little more tolerant. Especially the lady at the AH. I've never heard anything more ridiculous than a 5 year old accidentally kicking/brushing a chair, it then being labelled as antisocial!!! Unfortunately our children are learning how to be in social situations all of the time. With or without SN, effecting those around them with or without health complaints and disabilities. We all need to be a little more understanding, if our children aren't taught 'on the job' how different scenario's carry different expectations of them, how do they learn. There was a time when going to restraunts was a bit embarrassing for us but we persevered and now I can take mine anytime. We can't just talk to small children about being considerate and respectful to others, we most of the time have to show them, in the moment, this learning curve is unfortunately witnessed by those around us. How else do we do it? Lock them up? Not take them anywhere? I wonder if the mothers could confirm -of those on this thread who have such intolerant p.o.v's - were always so exemplary members of society?

KakiFruit · 15/12/2015 11:32

people should give an inch to others, whoever they are when they are in a public place or stay at home.

Aha, so you now understand why the lady didn't want her chair to be kicked - sorry, brushed - and will give an inch to the next person irritated by it?

theycallmemellojello · 15/12/2015 11:32

Have not rtft but surely she turned around and didn't say anything because there was a concert going on and either she didn't want to disturb others by talking over the music, or it was too loud to be heard. And unless she turned round, how was she to know whether something was being done about the child. Also wrt "daggers" - I think it's actually pretty hard to know when a stranger is doing this. What looks like "daggers" can easily be an old person screwing up their eyes as they refocus on something close up after having been staring at the stage. In any case, the woman received a few inadvertent kicks in the back (strong enough to feel through the chair) from an excited child. It's not a massive crime on the part of the child, but it's also not great for her, so in the circumstances, turning around but not saying anything isn't really a horrible reaction. I'm going with YABU.

And as for the people making horrible sexist and ageist remarks ("old hag" Shock) -- really hope that the comments have made them think twice about using that kind of awful language.

IrianofWay · 15/12/2015 11:35

It's horrible when someone complains about your child and even if it is deserved it still stings. I remember taking DD and DS1 to the Colston Hall to a Christmas concert and having a man turn round and ask me 'Control your child!'' because DS was being a bit noisy. I remember feeling utterly mortified and a little less than gruntled....but I had to admit that he had a point.

Some people aren't keen on children - they don't like the fidgetting and the noise. It's not your fault or theirs - it's just unfortunate. All you can do is keep your child as quiet and still as possible and hope that you are surrounded by patient tolerant people...... and look forward to the time when they are old enough for it not to be an issue.

I suspect either your DD has kicked her chair before this and you didn't notice, or she had just had a bruising encounter with another child.

Toffeelatteplease · 15/12/2015 11:43

As soon as the woman turned round the first thing out of your mouth should have been a huge disarming sorry.

Whether it is accidental or not really doesn't matter. It's still bad behaviour and antisocial for the person sat in front.

DS doesn't even have the ability to control the leg movement. Still doesn't mean he gets to kick people in the back of their chair.

If you have any concerns the most basic thing you do is take shoes off. But at five with no special needs you should be able to have enough care of the person in front not to do it.

LyndaNotLinda · 15/12/2015 11:49

The very first word out of your mouth should have been sorry. Not 'I'm doing my best'. That isn't an apology, it's a 'it's not my fault' line.

The reason young people don't get on with older people nowadays is because some young people like you seem to refuse to take any responsibility for their children's behaviour.

Selinemaratima · 15/12/2015 11:53

[toffee] "gets to kick someone in the back of the chair" are you really suggesting that the OP's DC actually intended to kick the chair in front? More so that the DC was actually getting some pleasure from it? Wow what a dismal response, SN or not, children of this age do not have the capacity to be malicious, it was so blatantly accidental, albeit repetitive. Maybe you genuinely don't realise this but part of teaching a child is repetition and consistency, re-enforcing all of the time, unfortunately asking or telling them not to do something once, rarely cuts the mustard, especially IMHO when the OP's DC was doing it by accident!

longingforfun · 15/12/2015 12:01

I think the op should have asked her dc to say sorry to the 'old hag'. It might have defused the situation and also taught the dc to take responsibility for her actions, even if they were accidental.

Toffeelatteplease · 15/12/2015 12:11

I mean that because he cannot take responsibility for not kicking the person in front.

i take responsibility for it for him. I make sure he doesn't kick the person in front.

He does not get to do it. And if I do accidentally get it wrong I apologise and I make sure it doesn't happen again.

I find anyone who thinks it's ok for a child of any age to kick someone else chair repeatedly because it was an accident a dismal response.

PurpleDaisies · 15/12/2015 12:13

are you really suggesting that the OP's DC actually intended to kick the chair in front? More so that the DC was actually getting some pleasure from it?

Have you really never seen kids kicking something or banging something on the table because they like doing it? Confused

I don't think anyone is suggesting the deliberately wanted to annoy the old lady, just that she was kicking the chair in front because kids quite often like to do that.

Selinemaratima · 15/12/2015 12:17

That's not what the OP has described tho is it?

Selinemaratima · 15/12/2015 12:32

I am not saying it's ok toffee. My point has always been from the point of tolerance. As I read it, the child wasn't kicking the chair but was rather fidgeting and knocked the chair a couple of times. OP apologised although the lady was unforgiving, and maintained her disdain, which I think is quite bitter. If someone applogises I think it's gracious to then let it go.

Toffeelatteplease · 15/12/2015 12:45

I read a fantastic gran-ism on here the other day

Don't tell me your sorry, show me your sorry.

Once is an accident, twice is pushing the bounds of tolerance, three times is careless of those around you (assuming there were no others the OP missed)

Do something about it; take responsibility for your child's behaviour.

Person at one the shoes would have been off and made very clear if it happened again we were out.

Tolerance is a two way street. Personally I find people are very tolerant as long as they can see you are trying.

Toffeelatteplease · 15/12/2015 12:46

And according to the OP she didn't say sorry because she was glared at