HELP..... no help from parents!

[pinky77]

Hi all, I am writing to find out other peoples take on this situation. I am a mother of 3 kids under 5 with the view to returning to my work. I am going to have to pay £1000 a month for my kids to go to nursery. My sister also has 3 children and for 8 yrs my mother has minded these whilst my sister worked.
I am upset because I feel my sister has had this help and it should be my turn or at least shared. Also she has a higher salary and a husband that works less awkward shifts and a MIL that also helps. We are younger with less income and this expense is making it really difficult. My mum says she wishes she had more hands to help out but there is no talk of helping me instead. It's not just the work situation my kids also don't get any quality time with the grandparents as the others are looked after from 7 in morning then after school until 7 again 4 days week.
I have no inlaws or other family members available to help. My mum minds the odd time for a parents meeting at school or doctors appointment and will pick up one from nursery 3 days week but doesn't see them other than those times. I feel there are big differences being made and it is making life quiet tough but I haven't said too much to avoid any family rifts we have just been sucking it up and managing through. Any advice or opinions appreciated thanks

I hear you op

my sister had childcare and help in the school holidays, now has a great job

I had very limited help and had to give up a good job as no flexibility

I cared for mum when she grew old, sister did nowt

its shit, simple as that.

I am shocked about the reported conversation with your sister re: caring for your DM when she needs it. Looking after an elderly relative can be incredibly hard work and stressful, and being expected to do so without your siblings help because sisters' career is implied to be "so much more important" than yours is disgraceful.
I don't agree with you (OP) re: feeling like you should have a share of free childcare from your Mum, but your sister's attitude stinks.

I think the pair of you sound very selfish. Your mum should be enjoying her adult years not providing childcare or collection from nursery for the pair of you. You both made your choices and need to step up to your responsibilities.

Grandparents lover should never be measured by the amount of childcare they provide.

I understand why you're resentful and I do get it. That comment of your sister's about care of your mum falling to you is beyond infuriating. I can see why you feel she would take advantage if she could. However.

Your mum does not have to take on three under fives in order to make sure that you get a fair deal. It's just asking too much of a parent. Sadly, there is a sense in which grandparents helping with childcare does indeed come on a a first come first served basis because what's the alternative? That your mum didn't help your sisters for all those years because she wasn't sure she'd be able to look after your children as well by the time you got around to having any? That would be dog-in-the-mangerish of you.

It's unreasonable to expect someone to go to impossible lengths just to make sure you get a scrupulously fair deal in life. Your sister has had a certain number of extra years being mothered by your mum (because she was born first) but you wouldn't expect your mum to make up for that in any way. It would all get a bit absurd and your mum is left caught in the middle somewhere, wondering (I'm sure) why everyone wants a piece of her. She doesn't have to do anything for anyone, you know.

This would all be different if you and your sister were having children at exactly the same time and she was choosing one of you. But she's choosing to continue looking after children she views as in need of a mother figure to come home to (much harder to send older children to aftercare/childminder and expect homework etc. to get done) and she isn't doing bottles, nappies, all-day care, buggies, running around, mess etc. It's much easier. In expecting her to drop one arrangement and start another, you're effectively asking her to at least triple her workload. Why should she, is what I'm wondering. So you can not have to spend money you can perfectly well afford to spend? But hasn't she done her bit for you already in bringing you up?! I have two small children and no mother, but I would never have expected her to shoulder any of the burden of looking after my children. I'm grateful she raised me, not looking for even more.

You seem to feel resentful that your mum isn't in a position where she could drop everything to pick your children up from nursery, because she has your sisters' children. If this is really all you want from her, it's not nearly enough to justify turning your niece(s) and nephew(s) out of their stable childcare arrangements anyway. When my mum was alive, I would of course have turned to her in a crisis, with many apologies. But I would never have planned a situation where I'd regularly be having crises and be reliant upon her to drop everything, just because my busy life couldn't accommodate all my priorities. If your mum wasn't doing childcare at 6pm on a weeknight, I would like to think she would be sitting down to dinner in front of the telly, or perhaps getting ready to go to a nightclass, or whatever took her fancy. Because she can. She's earned the right to have no responsibilities for a while.

You haven't said if your sister had as many children as close together as you have done, or how much younger was mum was back then, but in my view, both you and your sister are a bit unreasonable.

When you say that your sister should make alternative arrangements to give your mum a rest or some free time, it seems difficult to reconcile with your also feeling that your mum should be using any extra time she has to look after your children.

Do you know there are so many things over the years that appear to be unfair from my parents/mum to my sister and probably to me from my sister's perspective. But i decided long ago that whatever way things happened my mum will have had her reasons and that's just what they are, her reasons for doing as she has. She'll have justified them to herself, she doesnt have to answer to me or my sister. We are entitled to feel hard done by if we like but she still doesnt have to do things differently. So i dont question her actions. Not since i was a young teen. Nobody gets it right all the time, maybe she realises later she got some things wrong but they are her decisions. I just gratefully accept whatever help she offers and if she cant help when i ask i dont sulk, i find another way round it. She doesnt do it to hurt me or be mean.

Fwiw i returned to work as a lone parent when DS was 5 months old and paid £500p/m for a part time place at nursery. I never expected my parents to fund my childcare either through their time or money.

It is difficult and looks unfair, but your mum has made a commitment already. If she'd been looking after your 3 for years and had made the commitment to you and then one day said it was time she helped your sister instead so you'd have to find other childcare, you wouldn't be happy. You'd understand maybe, but you wouldn't be happy.

Your sister may have made longterm commitments in terms of outgoings and work which she may not be able to change very easily. Maybe they got a bigger mortgage and would have to move house if she suddenly had to pay for childcare.

It's not fair, I know, and it's hard on you. I'm not sure there's anything much you can do except tell your mum and sister that it's hard for you without the help, not that they can do anything much about it. It might help to just get it off your chest though.

I think the problem here is that you dont feel your feelings of unfairness are being acknowledged by your sister. She has benefitted and you wont. (And I really dont think things will change as your sister is clearly quite determined to maintain the staus quo.)
Your mum is in the middle of this and I am sure in the back of her mind it does bother her - but opening up this particular can of worm probably feels like too much for her.
As hard as it is you need to get on with things and let it go. (or have at least if you really have to, point it out to your sister but not your mum).
She's your mum and I suspect she's probably quite knackered and conflicted.
Take the high road and take control of your situation.

As a GP how can you forsee how many children your DC will have, and therefore plan 'fair' childcare?

It's an impossible task. And not one that anyone has a 'right' to.

I see friends tied up in knots trying to be 'fair' and dragging their DHs in who didn't want to offer childcare in the first place!

Sort yourself out.

My mother did this, only it was a younger sister, because she had to make up for all the perceived inequalities life had inflicted on her, rather than her more fortunate siblings. I got no help, even on the rare occasions they visited, and even then it wasn't worth it.

It is shit. The relationship with the grandchildren does suffer.

On the upside, you can ignore the interference and the day to day crap. Enjoy the independence.

I don't know what my, no adult, children feel about it. I do not want to stoke any fires of resentment, but I expect they will tell me one day. They are happy doing their own thing at the moment, and I am too.

now adult

If your sisters kids are older than yours perhaps your mum can see that they will need less care going forward and she can get her life back a bit. On the other hand starting again with 3 under fives on top would be a tough ask for anyone. If some one wanted me to mind 3 under fives everyday for free I think I'd run mile

I will never understand grandparents who wish to spend their retirement babysitting,

You really don't understand why some grandparents may enjoy a retirement that involves loads of contact with their grandchildren?

I think grandparents who babysit are lovely but there seems to be a very thin line between helping out and being beholden.

As a parent of 4 DCs I can honestly say I will not ever be doing regular childcare for any of their DCs. Been there, done that when my DCs were small (or rather I outsourced it to someone way better with young children than I was). Fortunately, I don't think any of them would think of suggesting it.

I can see now why my DM has refused to do any regular childcare for grandchildren, it's a loose loose situation if you have more than one set of grandkids.

I feel very similar. My DM has never looked after my DD, picked her up, or anything. OTOH she spends a lot of time looking after my nieces - 1 older & 1 younger than my DD. We all live within a couple of miles of each other. I can't take DD to her as we've no car, although they both do. I was told I'd have to pay nursery fees as my DM was far too busy already. It's hard, and it's harder not to tell her how I really feel when she complains DD barely knows her & they never see each other.

I agree with Blythe. Also agree with Rudelf- you can discuss it with them, but ultimately you are the only one who has any power to change how you feel about these things. Either talk to them, or move on. Don't sit and simmer on it.

I agree if your sister said that, then it is unfair. However, you also don't appear to like her very much (and are quite dismissive of her as a mother for not being "maternal enough"). I know from personal experience that dislike can colour how you perceive things.

Totally agree with NannyOgg - I'm a granny and I look after the grandchildren of my oldest DC when they have a night out or need a bit of help.
My second DC hasn't had kids yet but should I ration my help to my older DC in the spirit of "fairness" because of potential future grandchildren?
Because I'm not getting any younger and I get tired more now than I did in days gone by - running around after a toddler would probably exhaust me in a few years time if DC2 has kids.

That's just the way it is - people get older and have less energy.

And frankly, I'd rather not over-commit myself.

Unfortunately it does facilitate one set being closer to GP than the other grandchildren. It's more than money really.

I've watched my mil travel to the other side of the world to see one grandchild, but can't travel forty five mins by car to see one of ours.

One time when they were invited for Xmas, they had to check with the other grandchildren if it was ok as they be soooo upset not to see them at Xmas.

They'd provided regular childcare so were very close.

OP I understand where you're coming from, I'm in a similar position. DM used to look after my DS one day a week after I returned to work, it lasted a year and then I went off on maternity leave again. During the year she had him she got loads of stick of my DSis who was ttc, she felt it was unfair that DM spent so much time with DS when she needed support. I ignored the while situation, I know DSis must have been going through a lot to be so UR. Then DSis conceived and I swear, from that very second, DM stopped helping me out with DS. I'd decided to have DS at the childminder full time with the new baby once I went back to work, I thought it was unfair for DM to have both DCs with nursery runs every day too.

DM now spends every waking minute with DSis and her DC, I have to hear about how hard DSis finds it because her DH doesn't help out much and they are pretty much raising her DC together. DSis works 10 hours a week and DM has her DC. Now she is preganant again and DM is worried about 'they' will cope with 2. She's seen my DS1 and DS2 who is 7 months a handful of times since he was born and never for more than an hour. We've also never seen her without DSis and her DC. I'm sick of it but I don't think there is anything I can do.

I'm upset that my DCs will have a very distant relationship with her yet my DSis's DC see her as a second mother. I have always paid for childcare and I don't do nights out etc where I ask her to babysit but the situation doesn't change. I guess what I'm trying to say is that your DM will be more than aware of the situation but unless she wants to change it there isn't much you can do. Bringing it up might just make it worse, depending on whether she's the defensive type so I just wouldn't. I'm just playing the long game, I don't turn down invitations (when she actually remembers she hasn't seen us for months and invites us over!) or opportunities to see her but I don't go out of my way to create them. At the end of the day, don't be the one to cause a rift and just be there on the sad day when she realises your DC have grown up and she's missed it.

YANBU.

You sister sounds pretty selfish. Ok, so she was first in line for the free child care and that's not her fault but to be so arrogant about her career that she has no intention of helping when your parents are older, after all the help shes had, is appalling.

needtobebetter very similar to my experience. Parents used to visit and tell my children what their cousins were up to rub there noses in it by telling them what they had done with them and could not go a day without ringing my sister up whilst never ringing me.

You seem to have found a good way to deal with it.

My mother can babysit for my sister for a whole week if necessary, but has never agreed to babysit DS for more of an hour or two. Sometimes I think it may be that my mother is older and more tired and not wanting to open the door for minding another child long term or long hours.

I still think that helping or not is her prerrogative, as my mother would say, she has raised her own children, any extra raising is totally optional.

I would say that you have to bite that bullet, get the job and spend most of your salary in paying the nursery fees. It will be worth it, if you wait until they are in school, you will find it very difficult to get the job you want after a long career gap.

But I insist, don't blame your mother. If you choose to have the joy of a big family, it is only natural for it to come with higher expenses.

...and obviously, I didn't realise this thread had so many pages...

OP -Your posts have left me

My mother provided childcare for my sisters children for 7 years but I have never asked her to do the same for me, I wouldn't dream of it.

Grandparents aren't there to be free childcare. I can't believe how entitled you are being.

And going on about treating siblings fairly and how your mother should "do her bit" for you just sounds so childish.

They are your children and their childcare is yours and your husband's responsibility - including the financing of it.

I feel very sorry for your DM, firstly because of the demand put on her by her other daughter and secondly for the unfair expectations you have of her.

Just let the poor woman enjoy her life without being tied to childcare for the rest of it.