Y1 Teacher Refused to let DS go to the toilet, resulting in sitting in mess all day.

[FreeSpirit89]

My mum picked DS1 aged 5 up from school Friday afternoon (3.15pm), He was clearly distressed, and upset. When she got him beyond the school gates he told her he had messy pants on. He said he had asked to go to the toilet before first break (10.30am) and the teacher had said no, he couldn't hold it any longer and messed his pants.

The school is aware that DS has bowel problems, they have letters on file from his consultant specialist at the hospital as well as the family GP, and myself explaining that he needs to be able to have access to water at all times, and due to his condition he may not have much warning that he needs to go to the toilet, and it tends to leak out of him fairly quickly.

His bottom was red raw, and little sores have appeared at the top of his bum crack due to being made to sit in his own mess all day. He is quite upset, and doesn't want to go back to school because he thinks it will happen again.

Im planning on approaching the school head about this on Monday, but i am at a loss at how to do so? The head's default reaction to anything where the parent isn't there to witness the incident is that the child may be lying. I want to go prepared and not get to angry, which at the moment i'm struggling with. I just cant believe that they have treated this issue with no sensitivity and ignore my sons pleas for the toilet.

Any idea's how i can get them to listen and ensure this doesn't happen again would be greatly appreciated.

You definitely need to raise this. Do you think it's possible he asked and she didn't hear him ask for some reason and didn't respond and he thought that as she hadn't replied that meant no? Or 5 kids were asking her a question at the same time and she said no to someone else and he thought it was no to him?

It seems particularly cruel that a reception teacher would deliberately ignore pleas from a 5 year old.

To be honest, the issue here is not your son's medical condition, but the fact that the school refused to let a 5 year old child go to the toilet when he needed to. I can't condone them doing that to any child and I would take this up with them immediately.

I was a primary school teacher for 19 years. A few points spring to mind:

1. Try to clarify exactly when this happened. If it happened before morning play, I can't understand how no one noticed the smell. If it happened at that time of day, not only was it missed by the class based staff but also all the dinner staff (who IME are usually very good at spotting these things).

1. Worse case scenario is that your ds was refused permission to go to the loo, messed himself and it was noticed but no action was taken. IMO this would be extremely unlikely. But you do need to prepare yourself for this one.

1. It could be that your ds is confused about playtimes and this might have happened before afternoon play (which can be quite near to home time) so more likely to be missed.

1. Definitely email the Head. Cc the SENCo. A paper trail is always a very good idea.

1. Is this the first time something has happened or have you had other concerns?

1. Did the other children notice anything?

1. If you think you may get emotional, consider taking someone in with you. That said, if you do get emotional it may serve to demonstrate just how worried you are about the situation. I have had plenty of parents cry on my shoulder due to worries about their dc. I have never held it against a parent.

Hope your ds has a lovely weekend.

As others have said find out what happened first

I might not be the teacher's fault as such. We've had situations where we've been told under no circumstances to let children out to the toilet.

This is no excuse

Teachers who fall foul of management find their jobs at risk.

They do, but letting a child with medical condition go to the toilet wouldn't be an issue.

I agree that, before you put in a complaint, you need to find out what the teacher says about this first. So I'd suggest starting off with a non-confrontational question about whether she did forbid your ds to go to the loo and, if so, what her reasoning was; then another question about whether anyone noticed that he smelt and was uncomfortable and upset. It just may be that she didn't hear your ds properly, but if no-one noticed the smell for the rest of the day that's a definite concern.

Just too awful for words. Your poor son.

I am sorry but given what you have said about the Head's attitude, I do not think I would be prepared to continue at this school who have degraded your child like this. I would certainly go ahead with the complaint, but do also consider speaking to the LEA as well.

It is always so hard to make a decision to move a child and I prevaricated for a long time myself with my gs, but I have moved him and he has not looked back at all. The staff at his new school have said it is like he has always been there. Get looking at other schools before the Christmas break and go with your gut feeling.

I've seen this scenario more than once before. Generally the teacher denies all knowledge that there was a problem of any sort, and the child is blamed for not speaking up about having had an accident.

The fact that the smell wasn't noticed is defended by saying that generally classes full of young children get whiffy in the afternoon.

I'm not saying this to discourage complaint, just to give you an idea of the school's likely response.

That is a disgrace, even if your ds did not have a bowel condition, it is unacceptable to refuse a child, especially a young child to the toilet. I would be writing a complaint to the head, seeing the head about that. Did you take pictures of his pants and his bottom as evidence!If you get no joy, follow their complaints proceedure and make complaints to Ofstead.

I am so angry on your behalf. I would feel very tempted to bring the soiled clothes to the meeting with the head to make a point. Probably not the best approach though.

"The fact that the smell wasn't noticed is defended by saying that generally classes full of young children get whiffy in the afternoon."

Yes, I have heard this being trotted out on more than one thread. What a load of crap (pardon the pun).

I would go ballistic if this was my child.

I agree, it's no excuse to say that the whole class gets whiffy. In Reception the teacher should normally, at the very least, be giving each group of (normally) around 5 children direct attention, and it really shouldn't escape her attention that one of them is in pants that have been dirty and smelly for some time, let alone that he's looking uncomfortable - which he must have been with a raw bottom.

The fact the poor lad has developed sores indicates he'd been sat in it for more time than is even remotely acceptable.

Good luck OP.

This would be unacceptable for this to happen to an adult, why is it then ok for a child. The school failed wholey in their duty of care, and if you are not happy with the outcome with the headteacher, follow the complaints proceedure and make a complaint to Ofstead.

I seriously would be moving schools, this is disgusting, your poor ds.

That is disgusting! My child would not be going back to that school again. I would raise merry hell.

This happened to me 33 years ago at school, when I was 6, teacher refused ,me the toilet and I soiled myself, I still feel humiliated now when I look back on it , even though I went to the welfare office, and was cleaned up and given fresh clothes. This poor boy, wasen't even afforded that, he was made to sit in his own mess for several hours.

Poor little boy. :( I'd be furious but you do need to make sure you go in with a calm head and a list of questions. It is totally unacceptable and inexcusable. I hope your DS is ok.

OP would suggest that you wait until you have spoken with the teacher before getting more upset. Once you have more details about this you can decide what to do next.

I'd also be a bit worried that your son's skin integrity is so poor that this one off episode caused such extreme sounding consequences. I think that you need to get an urgent referral to the tissue viability nurses to examine the area as it sounds as though the skin is already compromised and they may need to up whatever management is in place.

To the person flummoxed that children aren't allowed to pop out to the loo at will, from personal experience: it's because it is almost always contagious as a yawn. In Brownies when one of them goes to the loo you lose the next 20+ minutes to all but 3 of the children going to the toilet - even when they don't really want to go. Same with a glass of water. Once you've lost the better half of a session to kids traipsing in and out of an activity because it's quite nice to hang out in the toilet or kitchen gassing with mates, you will apreciate the need for some degree of crowd management and making the children take it in turns or wait for a few minutes.

Would be worth talking to teacher first perhaps. I teach children this age, and occassionally children have had an accident, but never actually asked if they could go to the toilet. Once or twice a child has gone home with wet (but not soiled) pants as they hadn't said anything and they had wet themselves close to home time. surprising that no one noticed any smells/funny walking though in this instance. We always pick up on this kind of accident.

Ds is potty training and it is very evident when he has soiled his pants, not only does he stink really bad, but he looks uncomfortable, and his clothes will be soiled. If the teacher detects a smell, then either she or support staff should check all children in the class as to where it is coming from. It is very obvious also if you have refused that child the toilet, it might be them, so you check them. Very very neglectful, you have said about the HT response, my ds would not be going to that school anymore. I would be giving a written complaint to the HT, Ofstead, LEA. as well as a meeting with the HT.

This is so very wrong.
Have they always been supportive? Or deep down in your heart do you think they are quite dismissive and think that there's little wrong with your son, it's just you that is the real problem, as an over-anxious mother?

Becles, her ds had been left in poo all day, even after an hour, skin tends to get sore. Yes I would expect skin to react like that if he has been left in poo for 5 hours.

Yes I would request a meeting with the HT, and teacher, provide photos, the consultant letter. They failed miserably in their duty of care for your ds.

Poor child. Sounds very distressing.

I wouldn't go in all guns blazing until you have a bit more info though. Did DS ask the teacher? What did he say? He may not have asked in time. Did the teacher say "No"? Did she know what had happened? Did anyone else know?

Of course this can never happen again so it might be a good idea to make sure DS has a system in place that makes asking easy? Or maybe he could have special permission just to leave the room when he needed to and the teacher would see him go and just nod permission. (My DS had a similar system in place for short time for similar reasons. He was a quiet, shy, dsypraxic child and never found the right moment to ask or wasn't heard in time). Once he knew he could just leave without having too put his hand up in front of everyone and ask the problem was solved.

Maybe she was busy with another child/group and he was calling "Miss, Miss?" and it was too late before she heard him.

Hope it gets better OP - not nice for anyone. Poor little chap.

Don't keep him off school and tell everybody, whoever said that. What will that achieve?

Meet with the head. Take it from there.