to think Mumsnet should delete posts in which women are called cis

[violetsarentblue]

I (and I imagine quite a lot of women on here) are fed up with being referred to as cis. I find the term deeply insulting.
I'm a woman and prefer to be addressed as a 'woman', not a cis woman.

I noticed MN are quick to delete posts where transgender people are called 'he' instead of 'she', because that group of people find the term insulting and MN don't want to offend.

Generally we delete posts in which people persistently refuse to refer to people by the pronoun (he/she; him/her) by which they’ve asked to be referred, out of respect for that individual’s wishes.

Please - could we have the same depth of consideration for our wishes?

Thank you.

This is the first time I have ever heard of it. It doesn't even make sense. Cis? It's not even short for anything, doesn't relate to sex or gender or anything. Just a stupid made up word.

I am a woman and wouldn't refer to myself in any other way, or accept it from anyone else.

It's not a label I like or accept for myself. I'm a woman and that's that.

But I don't think I'd go as far as to delete all references to cis. I think it's a faddy ridiculous term but not sure it's harmful.

I'm with you OP. It is bloody insulting. MNHQ should delete it.

Genuine question do they call men - cis too?

Some others are only coming across it for the first time so obviously are not insulted because they have not seen it used misused in context.

I have seen it used plenty of times in the context of lengthy internet debates about gender identity. I still don't find it insulting, any more than I think 'straight' is some awful insulting term imposed upon me by the ever-powerful gay agenda.

Flip me, I've never heard this expression in my life!

The things you learn in MN...

Man, woman, trans, gobshite.. What's the difference?

As long as it's not illegal it doesn't bother me.

I have never heard of it- or seen it on MN.

Jeez Louise, MN never fails to surprise! I am with you though Op - I am a woman, not a cis-woman!!

I look forward to a time when it's not needed, in the same way I look forward to when 'lesbian' becomes a medical rather than a social term but I don't find it in the least offensive.

Agree OP.

This is ridiculous. Why on earth should women have to be defined in this way. I was born a woman, grew up a woman and will die a woman.

I don't need cis written in from of what I am in order to make someone else feel better about themselves.

Women have been defined by society one way or another for generations. Surely now that many of those restricting definitions have been left behind we don't need yet another one foisted on us.

Of course it's insulting if people find it insulting. Just because some people don't find it objectionable doesn't mean it isn't so. It's a matter of opinion and in many women's opinions this term is insulting and objectionable.

www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/cisgender

"Denoting or relating to someone whose sense of personal identity and gender corresponds with their birth sex. Compare with transgender."

If the above does not apply to you, then you can object to being called cis.

If it does apply to you, then cis is the correct word for you.

It's not an insult, it's a description.

Most of the time, it's not needed. Most of the time "woman" applies to all women.

In some circumstances we need to refer to a group that specifically excludes trasnswomen. In that situation, this is a useful word.

I think cis is fine, what I don't like is when it's used as an insult. I'm taking back the power calling myself a cis woman.

For those who are unfamiliar with the term, it gets used a lot in feminist / trans discussions but in the last few weeks a lot of those topics have begun to appear in the more mainstream boards, and there's quite some pressure for this kind of language to be adopted into mainstream language in the media.

Those that use 'cis' to describe others often object to women describing themselves as 'women', and consider using the term 'women' to describe females as being 'cissexist'.

I'm not cis, I suppose I look it if you are simplistic, but I don't see why I have to tell people I'm not, not to be called it. I'm all woman though.

I had two meetings today - one for work and one for personal business - with men who generalised about women and girls and "mums" all over the place, it was making my teeth itch. I would like to start telling people to use masculine pronouns for me, not because I intend to start cross dressing or watching football or anything but just in an attempt to get out of this stupid box where people think they know what I am and what I like.

I told someone I had two daughters and that fortunately they get on and had the reply "yes because I suppose they like the same sorts of things, being girls." I said "yes, unicorns and ribbons" and got a completely sincere nod of understanding. Twat.

I am seriously considering telling people to call me "he". what will happen?

What is the actual problem though?

HQ have said but if it’s applied pointedly to a poster who doesn’t identify as a ciswoman, we would delete that.

So just tell who ever applies it to you, that you don't like it and then report.

I was born a woman, grew up a woman and will die a woman.

What did you weigh at birth?

I don't like it because I dont like the word. A gay friend of mine posted on Facebook a while ago to ask whether it was derogatory to refer to straight people as 'breeders' (he felt it was a similar term to 'gay''. I pointed out in no uncertain terms that 'yes, that's deeply offensive'. Its derogatory as 'queer' or similar would be. Honestly, can't we all just be people?

I'm not sure why the term is needed? I'm female, I was born this way and haven't had to make any changes to be the person I am - I'm a woman as in the Oxford dictionary definition 'an adult human female'.

Please don't try to label me.

I'm with Worra - sick to my back teeth of the whole fucking thing.

(but there'll be another one along soon).

Someone is going to have to explain this to me as I still can't understand what is going on here. So I am a woman, have always been a woman, and am happy being a woman (except on the days when I feel like being a unicorn). So am I supposed to describe myself as cis? Is it alright for me to call myself cis but not for other people to do so unless they specifically know I am ok with the term? What would make me not be ok with the term? Am I now supposed to be offended by being called a woman -or not?

It does have a meaning. 'Trans' means across from, we use it a lot, transatlantic, transnational etc. 'Cis' means on the same side as.

If I get flak for not being "sincere" about wanting male pronouns - because I don't want to change anything else, like how I dress or speak, or because I am proud that I gestated and gave birth to and breastfed my children - then I can say: who are you to judge? Who are you to say I don't have the correct external appearances to match the "real" me, as evinced by my feelings, which are telling me very strongly that I don't want to be patronised, pigeon holed, belittled, or underpaid? It's entirely sincere.

I hate it. I don't need what I am, a woman, to have a qualifier attached.

IoraRua - people with autism are normal. They are normal people with autism. Some of them even refer to themselves as autistic people or even autists. Most of them still consider themselves to be normal people.

Neurotypical is used to refer to anyone who is or appears to be neurologically intact, for want of a better word. Neurodiverse refers to people who have some neurological condition which differentiates them from the general population.

Occasionally, neurotypical can be used in a derisory manner, and in those situations, its use is wrong in as much as it is not being used with kindness. It is being used with the same intent to diminish as when someone child free calls someone who has one or more children a breeder.

In the main, though, neurotypical is used to define the difference in the person displaying neurodiversity. For example if I were to discuss some of DS2's behaviour, this morning, I would comment that he was rubbing his cheek against every hedge he passed, which is not something that most neurotypical people would even consider doing.

The problem with cis is that it is increasingly being used with the intention to diminish and, as pointed out in the MNHQ thread about this, is being used against people who do not identify as such in much the same way that people were making a point of referring to Caitlyn Jenner as "she" in the recent thread about her. The intent is the same in those two situations.

'Cis' means on the same side as.' - the same side as what though?