to think if you have a penis, you do not belong in a woman's prison

[RickRoll]

There is to be an appeal tomorrow, at Bristol Crown Court, regarding the decision to send violent criminal Tara Hudson, who works as a transsexual prostitute (still has a penis, as 80% of transsexuals do), to male prison. Tara wants to go to a female prison.

AIBU to think that if you have a penis, you should go to male prison?

People are arguing that Tara is at risk of sexual assault, but Tara is not unique in this - lots of (non transgender) men are vulnerable, and the prison service has a responsibility to protect them.

What on earth are you talking about Ohbehave? Nobody is saying any of that but you

ohbehave why are you making this about TW being less worthy - we are saying they are different.

Given that 70-80% of TW retain their male genitals then no, I don't think it's appropriate for them to be in a rape crisis centre. Of course TW face violence And sexual violence, but there needs to be specialist centres, not women having to "budge up". TW can campaign for rape crisis centres and refuges and everything that women have had to campaign for over the years.

Oh behave - but we aren't talking about a post op trans women.

Rape facilities exclude men because those traumatised women need to feel safe. And to feel safe there needs to be no one with a penis there. Surely you can see that?

Or a better analogy, a woman with a double mastectomy is still a woman.

Answer my question Rickroll. Or do you not dare.

Oh come on. This debate has become wider than one just about Tara.

Anyone can be raped. Men , women, transmen and transwomen, and children of course. All of them should have access to a safe space. For women, that means no one with a penis in that space.

So? It still isn't about worth or its lack thereof.

That is all in your head.

I will answer Maudegonemad. I personally believe that any person who is transgender and is/has received medical treatment and/or counselling should be placed in a prison of the sex they identify as. In the case of pre op they should be segregated from those that are post op or biologically the sex they identify as.

Why should the feelings of a transgender person trump the feelings of multiple women who want to be in a woman-only space?

And refuges, rape crisis centres, hospitals?

Counselling? So a violent male rapist can get counselling to be transferred to a woman's prison?

Ohbehave- totally segregated? So no contact at all with other inmates. I could live with that. That's just geographical proximity of effectively two prisons. That isn't what is being proposed or planned though, is it?

I don't think many people would argue against a transgender wing/prison?

HermioneWeasley. One of the problems is that the person needs to live as the opposite sex before they will be considered for GRS. I honestly don't know how that works for female only spaces such as changing rooms.

I do think that at a pre op level public spaces need to be treated as the birth sex but post op then they should be treated as their chosen sex. As an exam ample I have already stated, should a post op woman be denied access to a rape crisis centre of they have been raped?

Solitary is a crap solution, it drives people mad.
That is the one option that would be unfair on Tara.

Libraries. Not totally segregated. It may mean that the facility is not available at every prison, but a wing/ suite that can house pre ops.

because too many trans women still carry their male privilege

the thing about being a woman is that we have from a very very young age been conditioned to be accommodating, to think of others first, to try and understand others feelings of course not all women do but it is what we are meant to do and the majority of us will act in that way in supportive groups you do not see this behaviour often with men. In all support groups that I have worked in men will always take centre stage

yet a trans women apparently is a woman and feels like a women, thinks like a women and so on yet why are so few taking on this conditioning that we have and cherry pick what they feel most comfortable with

its fucking laughable I am a woman now listen to me this is what I want

I am a woman, listen to me, this is what I want. I like that!

"biologically the sex they identify as."

You don't "identify" with a sex.

Please learn the difference between sex and gender before diving head-first into these debates with inflammatory posts.

and when have we ever been able to get away with that line

but of course we already know that

As I've said before, if TW want to be treated as women they can STFU and make the tea (joking)

ohbehave I think the rape crisis centre one is inherently problematic, given that a good proportion of TW are still recognisably born male. Of course, I might be meeting TW that completely pass for women all the time and not know it, so I can't say what proportion of TW pass and which don't, but I don't think women in rape crisis centres should have to be wondering whether that TW still has a penis etc. I do think there are a limited number of services which are for biological women only, and TW need to campaign for equivalent services if needed.

Ok cotedazur. Poorly worded but I guess you knew that and say an easy

In the case of pre op they should be segregated from those that are post op or biologically the sex they identify as.

What I meant was the group that are post op along with those that are biologically the sex that the trans person identifies as. Does that make more sense.