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AIBU?

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Original poster

to think if you have a penis, you do not belong in a woman's prison

990 replies

RickRoll · 29/10/2015 19:15

There is to be an appeal tomorrow, at Bristol Crown Court, regarding the decision to send violent criminal Tara Hudson, who works as a transsexual prostitute (still has a penis, as 80% of transsexuals do), to male prison. Tara wants to go to a female prison.

AIBU to think that if you have a penis, you should go to male prison?

People are arguing that Tara is at risk of sexual assault, but Tara is not unique in this - lots of (non transgender) men are vulnerable, and the prison service has a responsibility to protect them.

OP posts:
QuintShhhhhh · 30/10/2015 19:49

Right, so she can hardly complain she is in prison then. She KNEW what would happen.

QuintShhhhhh · 30/10/2015 19:50

Well, so she is scared she is going to be assaulted?
tough titty.

Has she assaulted women or men, or both?

GruntledOne · 30/10/2015 19:50

The point is that it is a fundamental principle of our justice system that the punishment for a serious criminal offence is going to prison, and people shouldn't be subject to extra punishment once they are there. If someone is at particular risk if they are sent to prison, that still doesn't prevent them going to prison. But it does mean that there is a duty to take appropriate steps to protect them. If someone has a serious heart condition, for instance, we don't make them perform hard physical labour and say "Well, you should have thought about that before committing the crime, it's no use complaining now."

CharlieSierra · 30/10/2015 19:51

GruntledOne she's had massive fake tits added, personally I don't agree that constitutes substantial steps to transition.

GruntledOne · 30/10/2015 19:57

Werks, the rule about self-identifying isn't universal. As set out in government guidance on the topic, it doesn't apply to a provider who is fulfilling a legitimate objective in a fair and reasonable way. For instance, it would normally be legitimate to prevent a trans woman competing in women-only sports events.

HamaTime · 30/10/2015 19:58

If someone has a serious heart condition, for instance, we don't make them perform hard physical labour and say "Well, you should have thought about that before committing the crime, it's no use complaining now."

We also don't say 'if you are a woman who doesn't want to be banged up with a person with a 7 inch surprise then you should have thought about that before.' Why is it the job of women to accommodate male bodied people in their spaces? If it's an additional punishment for Tara to be banged up with other male bodied people, why isn't it an additional punishment for the other women to be banged up with Tara?

GruntledOne · 30/10/2015 19:58

Charlie, apparently the prison service which will have full medical reports thinks differently. Do you think their view might just be more informed than yours?

GruntledOne · 30/10/2015 19:59

Hama, who says she is going to be banged up with anyone? I strongly suspect she'll go on Rule 43.

HamaTime · 30/10/2015 20:00

She could go on rule 43 in a men's prison

HamaTime · 30/10/2015 20:01

8 of the players on Iran's women's football team are pre op trans women

pestilence13610 · 30/10/2015 20:05

Gruntled the prison service sent Tara to a male prison, they were over ruled by politicians.

Werksallhourz · 30/10/2015 20:06

Gruntled

Take a look at this ... www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/apr/16/sport-catching-up-transgender-realities

"In addition, the Sports Council Equality Group commissioned a consultant to explore robust alternatives to the IOC rules, arguing that it was hormones rather than SRS that equalised physical disparities, and that transsexual people should be allowed to compete in their chosen gender just one year after surgery – a point adopted by Badminton England."

GruntledOne · 30/10/2015 20:08

Sure, Werks, but the guidance refers to sports as being one area where it would in appropriate circumstances be lawful to stop a transexual person competing in a single sex sport.

GruntledOne · 30/10/2015 20:09

Pestilence, it remains the fact that sending her to a woman's prison is well within the rules.

Hama: so what?

Werksallhourz · 30/10/2015 20:10

Gruntled ... which guidance is this? Can you point me in the right direction?

HamaTime · 30/10/2015 20:12

Hama: so what?

So nothing. It is not at all interesting that almost 80% of the players on a women's only national team are in fact men. It doesn't mean that women have lost out on those opportunities at all. Fucks sake.

You were the one who brought up sport. So what, indeed.

HermioneWeasley · 30/10/2015 20:21

Yes, trans women (ie: men) are taking women's place in colleges, sports, scholarships and business. They are then celebrated as "women's " achievements. FFS

RufusTheReindeer · 30/10/2015 20:28

hama

I read an article about that the other day

But as gruntled says so what

It obviously doesnt mean that female footballers havent lost out

It obviously doesnt mean that a team full of born women wont be disadvantaged against them

It obviously doesnt mean that this could be extrapolated out to other womens sports in Iran

That was sarcasm by the way

DD loves her sports, but womens sports are vitually always seen as being crap compared to mens...might just tell her to give up now and concentrate on her lessons

Only joking, she'd kill me if i said that Grin she was convinced she could beat her two stone heavier, 3inch taller, 3years older brother at wrestling today

noblegiraffe · 30/10/2015 20:28

So does the prison service rules mean that there already penises in the general women prison population?

FloraFox · 30/10/2015 20:31

Just watched C4 news which was a complete monkeys misrepresentation of this situation. It gave the impression this person was post-OP. It did say the crime was head butting a bar tender - that common women's crime. Hmm

Original poster
RickRoll · 30/10/2015 20:32

"Am I being very naïve here because in her photos she doesn't look like she has a penis? confused"

There's a picture of her on Playboy TV (or similar) with her butt up in the air, and it's very visible, being a capture from live TV, and therefore unedited.

OP posts:
BlackbirdsInaPie · 30/10/2015 20:38

8 of the players on Iran's women's football team are pre op trans women

It's homophobia: it is more acceptable for a man to "become" a woman, and have sex with men, than for a man to have sex with men.

BlackbirdsInaPie · 30/10/2015 20:38

In Iran, that is, in my last post.

Treebuskers · 30/10/2015 20:43

'There's a picture of her on Playboy TV (or similar) with her butt up in the air, and it's very visible'

And you can see her face as well?

Ohbehave1 · 30/10/2015 20:47

Fucking hell. It's not right that she vulnerable women should have to put up with this person in their prison.

I guess that means that it if fine for this vulnerable person who identifies as being female to be subjected to abuse in a male prison.

And HermioneWeasley This is not a woman's rights issue based on the fact that this person was born as a male. But then you have made it very clear you don't accept trans people - you said as far as you are concerned what they were born as is what they are. What a selfish hate filled approach.