To be concerned about my daughter

[kimmybus]

She is in her 20s and doing nothing with her life.

She left school at 18 and that was it. She has suffered with depression, anxiety, panic attacks. I dont know how I can get her to snap out of it, weve spent thousands on private therapists, she has been on different medications, we brought her a dog to give her some company. Nothing has worked and its getting a bit tedious having someone who is miserable all the time.

She started volunteering for a local organisation about six months ago. She gets on well with her boss but she is using her. She changes her hours every week for when its convenient for her. So some weeks she will work every hour under the sun and others she will be sat at home 5 days a week.

She is also very overweight. She is on a diet but whenever I see her she is eating crisps, sweets and wonders why she is big.. She complains she hasnt got a boyfriend and she cant see why that is.

She is also very secretive. She never tells me where she is going and takes hours to go to the supermarket or out to buy a bottle of wine. She very occasionally goes out and socialises but otherwise sits in her room doing nothing. She smokes and we have warned her about the implications of this but she doesnt listen.

She wont get a proper job. She wants to stay volunteering as her boss as filled her head with an idea that she will get a job. There is possibility of this but it is a slim one. She is living off some money she was left by family member who died a few years ago and a small amount of benefits. We dont charge her rent, pay for her food and brought her a car.

Im just disapointed in her. She wont do anything with her life. She complains we favourtise her sibling who is very different to her and has had a succesful career after going to university which we wanted for her. We paid for private education and she threw it away. She wouldnt go to school because she was getting bullied because of her size but the solution was in her hands and she just chose to stuff her face instead because she says it helps her cope.

How can I get her to finally stop and get a hold of her life?

I agree a SAHM is doing a job. Is volunteering not a job? I assume she does the same thing volunteering that many do in paid employment.

The OP said the issue was a job rather than interview, you're correct. My view, as somebody with issues similar to the DD, is that the interview is the issue. She may have been brave enough to interview for the volunteering (I can't scroll back but somebody up thread mentioned the interview process being less formal for volunteering roles) but that doesn't mean she can cope with repetitive interviews. Also, OP believes her DD can't get paid employment from this role despite the manager saying that it could be available. The DD is comfortable where she is, happy, has formed positive relationships, I don't see it as surprising that she's staying and hoping for a paid role.

I assume she does the same thing volunteering that many do in paid employment..
That's my point. If the OP's DD were in no shape to work more than a few hours a week due to depression; or was only able to do certain tasks, then I'd say that she is doing the best she can. But because of what you said above, I think she should start doing the same thing for pay and start paying her way at the age of 23.

The DD is comfortable where she is, happy, has formed positive relationships
I would also be much happier in a volunteering role for a nice charity, as opposed to the 9-5 job I do for a big company in an open office environment. Sadly no one would pay for my car and cake then, so I don't get the chance. If the OP and her husband died in a car accident tomorrow, what would happend to their DD? Would we expect her sister to continue paying for her coke, cake and car?

I know these are unpleasant questions but I think they need to be asked. Deciding where to spend 8 hrs of your day on the basis of where you feel happy and build positive relationships is something most of us can't afford.

But if she doesn't feel up to interviewing due to her illness? I don't think anybody chooses to work (she is working) for free when they could get paid. Why would you?

I've debated whether to post this but I will. I was in a managerial role, it was too much and I couldn't cope. I've been sacked after being signed off with depression, anxiety and an eating disorder. I'm now prostituting myself for money. Do you think I choose that over legitimate paid employment? Honestly? MH is so hard to understand if you haven't been there, I get that, but I do feel it's important to try to understand as best you can. We don't want to be where we are. We have to do what we can to survive.

Iona- your either incredibly naive or youve been very lucky to walk through life without much holding you back.

Being a SAHM is a job yes. But would you like it say you went out for the first time in months with a group of friends and your DH rang you constantly to see where you were or got into an argument with you if you walked in half an hour later than you said you would? I doubt it.

And volunteering is a job. Ive done it myself- in fact, i worked a damn sight harder as a volunteer as I do now. Not to insinuate im now lazy, more I had more responsibility and more to do with my day when I was volunteering. My choice, yes, but due to personal circumstances- i wouldnt be in the position im in now if I hadnt done it.

Ive been in a similar position to the OPs daughter. I had very controlling parents and it caused me to fall into a depression and led to a stage when I couldnt work. That coupled with the fact my parents refused to acknowledge my illness and told me "it was getting boring" caused me to walk out the door and not look back.

Change your attitude Iona, please. Because just because you have been fortunate- doesnt mean your current or future children will be and you never know where its going to get you- and dont be surprised in 10,20 or 30 years your sat their scratching your head wondering why you dont see or hear from them anymore.

Socks, I am sorry to hear what happened to you :(. I also packed in a management job (in education) because of stress (though I jumped before I could have been pushed).

As to volunteering: I must say that if I had someone who reliably paid all my bills whatever I did or did not do, I would choose volunteering over paid work. I could choose a field (charity) I was passionate about, and the responsibility would be minimal.

Walford I have not been especially fortunate, nor do I think I am naive. But I was born and spent the first 35 years in my life in a country where there is no welfare net to catch people who don't work. (There is unemployment benefit for those who 1. already worked a number of years so they qualify and 2. it is for 6 months' only, to allow you to get another job and retrain). And somehow no one is off work with depression, eating disorders, anxiety or similar. I don't think that genetically the people of my original country are less prone to MH issues than the UK population - the difference is in the benefit system and the resulting culture. The way things like depression, anxiety, bipolar disorder, eating disorders are viewed in the UK is just one way - the way of a rich country. I am sorry if this sounds blunt to those who have grown up in the UK but in other countries you get on with it. Which is why I suggested to the OP that she should give her DD a deadline (and I said a long one, e.g. 6 months), and support her, but have her move out so she'd be forced to get a job and pay her way. In the country I come from the situation would not arise because no one would tolerate their child not doing either paid work or full-time studying - unless they are, of course, hospitalised.

Iona, are you really saying that depression is all about "lifestyle"?

Sheesh.

OK Iona. Lets say tomorrow your prtner dies. You loose your house, and find he has a mountain of debt so you sell everything you own to pay it off. You then move in with a friend and fall into a depression. Said friend then says to you "you have six months to sort your shit out and your on your own".

You'd think that was acceptable would you?

I think what Iona is trying to say is that in other countries the system is less forgiving- people are expected to cope somehow. I imagine those who cannot cope would sink much quicker. The culture is much harsher.

On the other hand, there is sometimes a degree of "wallowing" and putting things off with the excuse of "don't feel ready"/"don't feel up to it"- sometimes there is the need for a helpful "push" to make the next step rather than stay firmly where you feel most comfortable.

And let's face it, whilst the OP may be unhelpful towards her DD in other ways she is putting a roof over her, food on the table and has bought a car. This is allowing her DD to "choose" to volunteer and remain in her comfort zone.

It's all very well saying that OPs DD should not do anything until she "feels ready" but from experience she may never "feel ready/comfortable". It's a balancing act- push too soon and things can fall down around your ears, don't push at all and nothing ever moves forward.

Iona The fact that mental health issues aren't really acknowledged in the country of your birth doesn't mean they don't exist. Obviously they are just brushed under the carpet. I don't doubt that people aren't off work suffering with depression. They probably simply don't have a job to be off from. They are probably living horrible and short lives in extreme poverty on the streets. Countries which have little or no welfare net for their citizens tend also to have massive inequality. I don't think it is a system to be admired.

Of course, your solution may solve the OP's problems but the toll on both her daughter and wider society is likely to be much greater than it might otherwise.

I live in a country with no unemployment benefit or any other type of government support and I know an awful lot of people who currently or in the past have suffered from depression, eating disorders and the like. Their families have to cope or else they end up on the streets.

This is the hardest thread I think I've ever had to read. Usually I don't "attack" posters, but OP you sound awful. People have given advice and you are not listening. If you can't see that your disgusting attitude, judgement and general nastiness have clearly contributed to your DDs illness then I don't know what can be said to help you.

Please take on board what people are saying and go easy on your daughter. Research mental illness, it's well overdue!

A guy is driving on the motorway with the radio on. The radio announcer says: "Attention, important announcement: please beware, there is a lunatic on the M1 driving on the wrong side, going against traffic, the wrong way." Our guy exclaims: "One?! But everyone is coming the wrong way!"

I love the analogy and will steal it for something else, but it doesn't apply to the OP's DD.

Family therapy works because it is pretty widely accepted that an entire family's worth of issues can manifest in one member. The OP has tried therapy for the daughter on her own and it's got nowhere so the next stage should be to look at how she fits in the whole family and whether there's anything that she's exhibiting that comes from somewhere else in the family. It all sounds a bit woo I know but it's really far from it and it helps a lot of people.

And somehow no one is off work with depression, eating disorders, anxiety or similar.
Because you're unaware of it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It does and it's so common in countries without benefits that people dying from depression, eating disorders, anxiety or similar go unreported.

I do feel for the OP, and the daughter. I suffer with depression which can be crippling, plus physical issues which compound things. I grew up with a mother with a severe mental health issue. I know what that's like and I wouldn't cope with that ever again, even talking on the phone can be tricky and it's difficult not to challenge her, and when I do I'm a terrible person despite it being perfectly logical. I can see when others challenge my depressed/low self esteem/warped view if the world - it seems so true because of X, y and z evidence - I'm useless/stupid/fat/unlikeable. It's the experiences which challenge these perceptions which will help drag her out of the negative spiral that's stopping her living her life. But having exposure to positive experiences is risky and means getting out if your comfort zone which can seem impossible. You need to be there and be positive - don't try to constantly 'fix' things or offer solutions, mostly she needs understanding and a shoulder to cry on, someone to talk through her emotions without you telling her what to do to make it better. Even with physical illness this is infuriating.

But it does need to come from her, you can't do it for her you can just stand by her side while she does it and through the possibilities without pressure. However, I do think a bit of tough love could help. I really believe my depression (and physical illness) is better because I have no choice but to operate at a minimum level to care for the kids. Just doing the school run probably makes me so much more functional. Living in a house share or alone would help her self esteem, as would taking small steps in her work situation or doing little things like hobbies in and out of the home or just going for a walk. It's like trying to piece together a normal life again, one with some sense of purpose and meaning. And don't focus, either of you, on specifics - weight, not having a job, not having a boyfriend, lack of social life. All of this can be built in baby steps and solving them won't magically make her better.

I don't know if 'kicking her out' is right but I do think it's better to do it sooner rather than later. I know two people stuck at home and it's screwing up their self esteem especially as their relationship with their parents isn't healthy. I think it's comfortable and a trap too, so the incentive to move, to lose weight, to get a better job, to find a boyfriend is lower. Another friend's sister is 35 and stuck at home with no friends, no relationship and no life. It's a huge boost to know you are able to take of yourself so that's the aim but please take it in baby steps. Make sure she has therapy, yes even for years, a did drugs work then those too.