To be concerned about my daughter

[kimmybus]

She is in her 20s and doing nothing with her life.

She left school at 18 and that was it. She has suffered with depression, anxiety, panic attacks. I dont know how I can get her to snap out of it, weve spent thousands on private therapists, she has been on different medications, we brought her a dog to give her some company. Nothing has worked and its getting a bit tedious having someone who is miserable all the time.

She started volunteering for a local organisation about six months ago. She gets on well with her boss but she is using her. She changes her hours every week for when its convenient for her. So some weeks she will work every hour under the sun and others she will be sat at home 5 days a week.

She is also very overweight. She is on a diet but whenever I see her she is eating crisps, sweets and wonders why she is big.. She complains she hasnt got a boyfriend and she cant see why that is.

She is also very secretive. She never tells me where she is going and takes hours to go to the supermarket or out to buy a bottle of wine. She very occasionally goes out and socialises but otherwise sits in her room doing nothing. She smokes and we have warned her about the implications of this but she doesnt listen.

She wont get a proper job. She wants to stay volunteering as her boss as filled her head with an idea that she will get a job. There is possibility of this but it is a slim one. She is living off some money she was left by family member who died a few years ago and a small amount of benefits. We dont charge her rent, pay for her food and brought her a car.

Im just disapointed in her. She wont do anything with her life. She complains we favourtise her sibling who is very different to her and has had a succesful career after going to university which we wanted for her. We paid for private education and she threw it away. She wouldnt go to school because she was getting bullied because of her size but the solution was in her hands and she just chose to stuff her face instead because she says it helps her cope.

How can I get her to finally stop and get a hold of her life?

Wow. Your OP made me cry. Your poor, poor daughter.

So much sounds familiar. I don't have mental illness but I do have an "invisible" auto immune disease, which I am pretty sure the majority of my family think I could "snap out of" too. Even when I was rushed into hospital not one of them asked how I was. with the exception of my mum, she is always right by my side So for you, your daughter's parent, to be the one behaving this way, I can't even imagine how bad that feels.

She is likely secretive because she is scared of your reactions as she knows you are constantly judging her. Who is fighting her corner? I know when I feel bad about my sister not giving a shit about me, or judging me for having to stop work I have my husband or my Mum to talk to, vent to, cry to... Who has your daughter got? It's such a lonely place to be long term illness be it mental. or otherwise, you need to help her gently not judge.

The weight/ food thing again may be about comfort. I'm not huge but I have gone from a size 10 to a 14 since I got sick.

Illness carries with it such a lot of guilt already, I feel guilty all the time. Because I can't work, because I am too tired to see people, because I cant do my house work myself anymore. It eats away at you. And when you know your family are noyt on your side, it makes that guilt ten times worse. So you don't need to make her feel bad, she already does.

Please, please be kind to your daughter. I'm so lucky that my Mum completely understands but I would give anything for my sister and brother to try. Or even just ask if I am ok?

I think op would be less defensive if some posts were less attacky?

Attack - defense?

She clearly cares for her dd, she has tried, I know many would have already chucked this girl out on the streets to get on with it.

we are not all born with every situation down loaded, we all have to learn. I dont doubt for a second op is taking in what people are saying.

if she wasnt interested she wouldnt have posted.

Chucked "this girl" out on the streets??!! For being ill?!! She's her daughter! I wouldn't like to associate with the 'many' people that you know!!

Her posts drip with contempt for her daughter. Maybe unintentional but if she speaks the way she's posted irl then her daughter will be more than aware of her mother's feelings about her.

Strikes me that she wanted to be validated in thinking her daughter should just pull herself together and do as she's told.

The OP's looking for constructive advice on how to help her DD. She's clearly very frustrated and distressed at the lack of progress any of her previous actions have taken to help her daughter and is now stuck and looking for new ideas.

I don't doubt for a minute that she loves her DD very dearly but is finding her hard to LIKE at the moment, I would imagine most of us have felt like that about family members at some point in our lives.

Everyone telling her what an ignorant, hardfaced bitch she is will probably not result in either the OP or her DD being helped.

AIBU at its judgey, unhelpful best.

Thank you everyone for advice.

I do love my daughter very much otherwise I wouldnt of posted for advice in the first place. I just find it very difficult sometimes because she makes life so hard for herself and she cant see she needs to move on with her life. I get she is ill, but really how much longer are we supposed to let her live in a fantasy? Another year and half her twenties will almost be gone. Its such a waste. Not to mention I know she is waiting for something that wont materialise. Her boss has a good reason to tell her there will be a job waiting for her- she is able to use her as free labour at the moment and she will run and help at the drop of a hat.

I dont mean to compare my children but it is a lot easier to love my other sometimes as she is getting on with my life. I just wish DD could do the same

she is getting on with my life

What a revealing typo.

And no, you clearly don't 'get' that she is ill. You really don't get it at all.

Laffy, I think people find it difficult reading the contempt the op holds her daughter in, as if she is deliberately overeating, deliberately suffering from mental health problems. It comes across as blame.
She has been given plenty of constructive advice, but it maybe doesn't look like it as constructive looks like "do a, b, c", when, as anyone who has suffered a mental health problem knows, that doesn't work, especially when you're trying to do it for someone else.
The dd has got to her 20s, clearly what the op is doing is not helping, so she needs to change what she's doing.

Kimmy, you're not getting it are you?
You can't make her change.
What you can do is support and love her unconditionally, despite your other dc being easier to love - you do know she'll see this don't you? Which will make the cycle continue.

Going off track here, what is the relationship like between your DC?
Does the 'successful' one have much to do with your DD? do they get on? or do they despair over your DD too?
Could play a part in her depression.

I've just sat and read the whole thread and your absolute last comment is the one that shocks me most "it's easier to love my other sometimes". Just wow. I can't believe a decent parent would ever write something so utterly awful.

I would imagine your DD knows exactly how you feel about her, and rather than being in her corner, you compare her to her sibling. Please, please, talk to her, show her you value her, give her your time, attention, praise and love, not bloody money and a car. Children learn huge amounts about themselves from their parents. She's learned from you that she's the black sheep. No wonder she enjoys a bag of crisps.

I am trying to supporther. She cant go through life with no money or prospects. I dont even believe she will get a reference when she leaves. Then it will be me who has to pick up the pieces again when she is upset because of something we warned her about and she could change from now. But she is determined to string it out forever if she can. She cant. She needs money. We cant pay for everything forever. If me and her Dad were wiped out tomorrow she would have nothing.

OP, I think you would benefit from having therapy yourself. It would give you a space to air your frustration and help you to look at the dynamics in the relationship between you and your DD.

Just a thought.
Maybe you two should look at options for her moving out?
It does not sound healthy for either of you to live under the same roof.
It might be good for the dynamic between you, and make her feel more independent, and you could have a not sp strained relationship, better for both of you!

Of course she can get a reference. She's been working there! You sound really defeatist about her prospects with the chance of paid employment and references. Why? This is something she's found that she can actually enjoy and you're trying to make it all into a negative for her. That won't help.

Get her to sign on for JSA or whatever it is she's entitled to. Let her have the chance to organise some finances of her own. That would actually likely be positive, a feeling of independence for her.

But telling her that will increase the anxiety, make her feel even worse.

You are right, she does need to earn money, but first you need to back off from telling her that.
How is your relationship with her in general?

Forget about what you think she could do better and forget that you think that she's not moving forward.

The thing holding her back is feeling so utterly awful ALL THE TIME. Pointing out ways that to fix her 'problems' will never make her feel any better, nor will it help her improve her situation.

Focus on making her feel loved and appreciated so that her confidence increases and she at least feels supported. Before you say anything to her, ask yourself if it is a positive and confidence-boosting thing to say. If not, keep it to yourself as she will already giving herself an onslaught of negativity and doesn't need any more.

Do things with her that you can both enjoy together so that she doesn't feel you are judging her or that she's a burden. Even if that means going out for a massive piece of cake and a litre of coke (as you've already said she likes that!) - her diet is not her biggest problem at the moment. She can tackle that when she feels like she's actually worth it.

Why won't she just move on. I can't support her forever

What an incredibly awful attitude! You obviously see her simply as a burden, apart from when she is doing messages for you. If only she would move on and live 'your' life you want for her, all of your problems would be solved.

She has mental health issues and you just do not get it. Not everything is about you and how it affects you.

I wonder if a compromise might be some sort of transitional housing arrangement where you help her find somewhere close by to live, help her set up home really nicely, and arrange to see her very regularly but ensure she has her own space and increasingly takes responsibility for herself.

AIBU at its judgey, unhelpful best.

The best thing you can do for your DD, and for yourself, is to get educated on the subject of your DD's illness. Would you expect someone with cancer to just pick themselves up, get better and get in with their life, just like that? I'm guessing not.

You also need support for yourself. I can imagine that living with a child with mental illness must be very draining. But until you understand and accept the nature of your DD's illness, nothing is going to change, and it may well get worse.

Best of luck to you.

Maybe you have more in common with your dd than you think, OP? You sound very anxious. You sound like the sort of person who deals with their anxiety by putting pressure on yourself (and others) to do things and fix things in order to try and make the source of your anxiety go away. Probably in your life that has worked for you, so you keep on doing it and your ability to get things done and plot and plan for the future and be seen to be successful has become a huge part of your sense of self worth.

Your dd also sounds like she is a very anxious person, but deals with that anxiety in a very different way. If someone is terrified they will be a disappointment to others however hard they try, it is almost impossible to try. It doesn't sound as though your dd was ever given the chance to build real resilience or a sense of self worth, instead always being made to feel like she was never quite coping and it was all her fault she couldn't cope, because a person is only worth what they can achieve in life, so therefore she is worthless... and you are so much better than her, because you get on with things...

I'm not sure how you get out of this cycle, which is clearly not doing either of you any good, but maybe you need to recognise that your quiet impatience is quite toxic for her recovery. You are both stuck in a pattern of behaviour where she is the hapless, hopeless victim and you are having to prop her up with physical and financial support, and when she needs emotional comfort, she feels she can't turn to you, because you make her feel even worse, and she doesn't have the tools to comfort herself in any way other than through food and cigarettes. To be honest, I think you need to admit to yourself that she is not the only one in need of therapy. You clearly love your dd, but you are not showing your love or understanding in a way that will help her out of this cycle. She really needs to know that she could be happy, even with a five year gap in her CV and a weight problem. Life is long and is not ruined by CV gaps and weight issues unless you have a very narrow view of what a good life looks like.

Catmilk, the op has actually had some amazing advice here.
What would you suggest?

kimmy, my mother had an attitude similar to yours, and similar frustrations with me (not totally similar cases, as I was working and living overseas, but constantly telling me I was too fat, and telling me that I needed to "pull (myself) together and stop yelling" - parent-speak for crying: her attitude was why I left the UK for many years after graduation) - what helped her enormously was counselling: she went because of me, because she found out (long story) I had a student loan and hadn't told her (why would I, when she was hyper-critical, negative and judgemental?). It didn't sort out the problem immediately, but it did cure her issue a little bit that counselling was a waste of time.

Many years later, she went into counselling herself, and as part of that process, her attitudes about all sorts of things have changed, and she has become more self-aware. I appreciate that you may not realise how conversations with your daughter come over - you think you're trying to be helpful, realistic and supportive, and instead, your daughter is hearing criticism and belittlement. Counselling might help you develop more self-awareness, which I think would help.

(Should add that my mother is still an insane narcissist, she's just better than she was 20 years ago...)

But do be aware, your daughter isn't doing this to piss you off: she's deeply unhappy, probably very lonely, and can't understand why she's so loathsome to her mother - because that's how she feels.

Stop nagging about the weight, stop buying crap (yes, I know she can buy it for herself, and she probably will, but not having it in the house will reduce some of her options) and start becoming a bit of a cheerleader for her. Plan a nice mother-daughter afternoon, take her out for a (non-food) treat, and bite back every comment you want to make, until she starts making the changes you want her to. Maybe even try apologising? (I have never heard my mother apologise for anything, but it sure would be a start)

And if she's volunteering and on benefits, presumably it's DLA rather than Jobseekers? So if the state thinks she's too ill to work, you really have to let that one go for a time.

Also, chronic depression and anxiety is as far removed from a 'fantasy' life as you can possibly get.

Wake up OP, unless you change your attitude, you'll continue o be part of the problem.