To be close to giving up volunteering because I can't stand one of the parents?

[listsandbudgets]

DD does Brownies and for the last 18 months I've gone along to nearly every session to help. The girls are lovely as are Brown Owl and her helper Snowy Owl. However some of the parents are driving me mad.

At the end of the meeting I usually stand by the door and make sure each child goes out with the right parent. EVEiRY week the same parent is late - not by a couple of minutes but by a minimum of 10 - last week it was 30 minutes. Never a word of apology. Brown Owl couldn't wait as she had an "owl meeting" to go to so DD and I had to wait with the other Brownie. The parents weren't answering their phone so we could do nothing but wait with an increasingly upset little girl. Finally her mother turned up and without apology snapped at her DD to hurry up because they were running late.

I said politely "We did finish at 7.30 it would be really helpful if you could pick her up on time next week please" She snapped back "I pay you to be here, I'll pick her up whenever I like". For the sake of her DD I just said "yes I see but we do finish at 7.30"

The subs are £1.50 a week for an hour and a half of activities with all materials and room hire included. All the guiders and helpers are volunteers.

Its been rankling with me all week and dreading seeing her tonight. It wasn't that she was late it was that she treated me like some kind of underling, DD was late to bed and DS (3) was upset because we were so late back.

While her behaviour was wrong. I wonder if there's more going on behind the scenes.

Ok it could be that the dad is doing brownie duty because the mother can't face you/the brown owl etc, but it may be that there's a reason she's missing pick ups etc.

Drink? Drugs? Depression? Even strife at home from the dad?

The fact that the child was upset means possibly that she's NOT used to it, so it isn't so likely to be long term neglect if you know what I mean.

Keep an eye on the girl and see how she is.

This may be nothing, just a mum who doesn't give a shit about others enough to bother being on time, but it may be more than meets the eye.

I've volunteered and had a very big, scary looking Dad accuse me of interfering and lying because I dared intervene when his daughter was yelling at her team mates and our coach (nor any parents) were present.

I was livid. But his daughter got her disrespectful attitude from somewhere!

Really forever I'm arguing with myself over a point nobody made? Can you explain this post then?

Yesterday 14:47 summerrainbow

Ring social services see if they can help.

Nothing added, nothing taken away. Maybe you should RTFT or at least the first page before you start chucking accusations like that about?

Mermaids, no problem.

Oh, and Thumbwitch, I was hardly quoting ED as an academic source. Just pointing out that Mumsnet is mocked because of posters knee jerk 'call social services, call 101' at the slightest incident. People are saying the same thing on the silly advice thread.

I worry though with call 101 and ss being mocked as silly advice if this might result in people thinking it is silly advice when it isn't.

It is very hard to persuade the victims of DV to contact WA and 101. Yet that is what they need to do. Incidents of DA, even if they are not physical, should be logged for a number of reasons, not least the victims safety.

I know this is slightly off topic but the advice to call 101 is MN hysteria meme that is going around just now is potentially deterring women who really do need to do it by telling them its a fuss about nothing and/or police will not take it seriously. (Which is exactly what theur abusers would like them to believe). These women are often already reluctant to believe they have the right to 'bother' the police.

Just want to say all well and good to say op should have had access to the emergency contact list ... But that might have data protection issues ...
I do the money for our brownies have done for years but never officially. Decided i needed to become official (lots of info about accounts requirements is now on GO official members website) jumped through hoops - needed good chatacter references and disclosure (I'm disclosed for my main job and a few other thing anyway) etc etc to get registered only to find that I don't have access to the list of brownies(name, DOB, parent contact details) ...as that is sensitive info...have to get the info i need from brown owl to do the fee notes...the whole thing was a waste of time!
Also IME there is no guarantee the contact info will be up to date parents change phone nos and don't tell organisations - even schools and childcare settings...recently we had a sick brownie - mobile no not working no answer on home phone - in the end we managed to get the parents new mobile number from another parent (mother of child's friend)

Unlucky, whoever has decided that at your Brownies has misinterpreted the data protection act. If someone can be trusted with the actual child they can be trusted with a list of phone numbers. And the simple answer to that is that if a helper can't be left with the list of emergency contacts then they shouldn't be left with a child.

SmallLegs, you are demonstrating that type of hysteria perfectly actually. That people shouldn't say that phoning SS or 101 is ridiculous in any circumstances (like a Brownie's parent being late) because it might put victims of DV off reporting. I think victims of DV will be able to tell the difference between 20 minutes lateness and having 10 bells knocked out of you.

One post out of how many that went into more detail?

But hey, don't let that stop you, you're getting a lot of mileage from your frothing over those 8 words.

Yeah, others that went into more detail agreeing with that post and just saying 'Yeah the child's been abandoned, phone social services'.

I don't give a shit if you do think it's 'frothing'. I'm not going to sit and let stupid comments like that go unchallenged. Social Services work costs money. They don't have a lot of it and they need to spend it on important stuff like looking after children at risk of neglect, abuse or even death. Not dealing with the fallout from a bunch of hysterics online who advise people to call them every time a parent is a bit late or they need help with a fairly minor issue (which, as I said, has already been dealt with, without SS needing to get involved). Do you know how much paperwork and man time it would take to deal with the call? It's a fucking waste of time. People should use public services responsibly.

So what do you suggest happens, then, Booyaka?

Parent 30+ minutes late adult waiting with child needs to be somewhere in 30 minutes time to collect her own DC. Parents uncontactable, emergency contacts not answering.

What does that person do if not contact SS? Sure as hell she doesn't leave her own child uncollected. Maybe she should just leave the kid outside the building and hope the parents turn up, as SS have more important things to do.

I repeat, in schools where I have worked the policy is to contact SS over uncollected DCs.

Mythical have you RTFT before jumping on the bandwagon? The OP didn't have the emergency contact list on this occasion. She's taken this up with Brown Owl and they're sorting it. It would be unfair on both SS and the parent to have started ringing social services because they didn't have some sort of system in place for dealing with the situation. And yes, I said several times when those systems were in place and had still failed calling SS is reasonable.

And I was actually responding to the fucking thread and not some made up situation that only exists in your head.

What do you want me to say? That clearly the OP should have rung social services despite the fact that she's managed to sort it all out doing that and clearly didn't need their help.

Christ, no wonder our public services are on their knees when some people seem to think they're a general hand holding and arse wiping service for people who are incapable of behaving like functioning adults.

MythicalKings, what I would do if the parent was more than 30 minutes late and I couldn't wait would be take the child home with me, leaving messages everywhere saying I was doing so.

That's probably illegal or something, but that's what I would end up doing.

Calm down booyaka!

You don't get it, and that's ok, but really you need to let go.

I'm assuming your children are home educated and don't attend any clubs or groups?

I can guarantee that it's written up as procedure to be followed in such cases. And if it's not, it should've.

Whether it is or not with the brownies in question we don't know, but it should be. Along with emergency contacts being accessible.

Who takes over the care to a child left at a club for over 30 minutes if the person running the club is no longer able to?

I look forward to your answer booyaka.

Let's face it, being half an hour late to pick up a child from an evening activity that only lasts a couple of hours and not being contactable, is pretty worrying no?

Booyaka, if you'd bothered to check you'd see I was on the thread before you jumped on the bandwagon.

Jux A kind and sensible thing to do but, yes, legally dodgy. I was a Samaritan many years ago and part of the training was that if a child wanted to come to the office they had to make their own way there, otherwise it was technically kidnapping. We were advised that even if they were calling from a nearby phone booth we could not go and collect them.

As someone up thread said, mostly you would be fine but if there had been an incident (car accident, drug overdose) you would be part of the aftermath investigation.

As a teacher I have been left many times after a school trip or sporting fixture twiddling my thumbs while I waited for a late parent. Nearly always the same ones who didn't ever answer their phones.

Once when I was dropping my sons at Judo, the car park looked a bit quiet so I waited while they went to make sure it was on. It wasn't. But they arrived back at the car with another lad who'd been dropped off by his dad and dad had driven off. The hall was closed, the lad (about age 10) was in a Judo suit and a pair of crocs - it was cold, rainy and dark. He didn't know his phone number, he lived in an outlying village about 15 miles away and it was another hour or so before the class was due to end. My son's barely knew him, I didn't know him at all.

I have to say it didn't occur to me to call SS. We all piled into my car anyway to get out the cold and wet and after establishing that there was no way to contact his parents I thought I was going to be left with driving him home. I asked who was coming back for him figuring that by the time Dad got home it would be near enough time to come back again and he had a lightbulb moment that his Dad may be at the gym. Only there were 3 gyms in the near vicinity... anyway we struck lucky at gym No2.

Despite all that, it never occurred to me to call SS or the police. I'd either have driven him home or taken him back to mine until the class was due to end and then taken him back up to the hall to find his parent.

The lesson being, never drop and run!

I don't think any of the'call SS' remarks are saying this is the first option. But it is the last option. If parents and emergency contacts are not answering, at some point the child is 'abandoned', whether by carelessness or accident.

It is not the responsibility of a volunteer or other parent. As an individual I can choose to drive someone else's child to their home, but I don't have to. And what if we get there and no-one's in? How long do I wait?

Yes, this should be specified in a policy. But sooner or later it does end up with SS.

Policy and ss if necessary. Absolutely.hope the cow sorts herself out!

It matters not a jot whether the parent is aware they might contact ss or not. Thankfully ss can be contacted by anyone with a concern about a child without the need for prior consent.

booyaka how ironic that you appear to have misread my post. I said the the meme/allegation/bitching going about that MN say phone 101 for everything and nothing is potentially damaging to victims of DV. The very meme you referred to earlier.

I did not say "That people shouldn't say that phoning SS or 101 is ridiculous in any circumstances (like a Brownie's parent being late) because it might put victims of DV off reporting."

I agree the post that simply said phone SS was over the top for the cir umstances of OP. The majority of discussion on the topic therafter was about do many organisations have this as a policy (yes they do) and would ss do something if you called them (yes they will).

And again I say it is better that a few unnecessary calls get made to 101 than people who need it don't call to avoid the embarrassment of some people calling them hysterical.

Likewise, although I would not have called SS in this case (although I might have given the snotty cow a piece of my mind and I asmire OP's restraint for not doing so for the sake of the dcs) I would rather SS were contacted too often than not enough.

I have fairly frequently advised posters to contact 101 but I don't think I have ever done so unnecessarily or in the least bit hysterically.

And this think victims of DV will be able to tell the difference between 20 minutes lateness and having 10 bells knocked out of you. shows an absolutely woeful ignorance of the nature of DV. The whole point is many victims of DA are not even able to admit they are the victims of DA. Because they think it only counts if you are having 10 bells knocked out of you and anything less does not merit the time or attention of public services and by the time it does get to that stage they may be too frightened to involve the police.

But you carry right on calling me and anyone else and MN hystetical.

The OP got good advice on this thread which was to tell Briwn Owl. Which is what she did.

The discussion around SS was helpful in that it related to the kind of policy organisations have - contact parents, then emergency, THEN ss- and why. And highlighted that perhaps in this case the brownies need to formalise their policy so if the parent had been say an hour late they'd know what to do.

The duscussion whoch you clearly didn't read btw booyaka if you are claiming it amounted to "'Yeah the child's been abandoned, phone social services'."

Most of the posts were saying if you did have to call SS because a parent did not show and was uncontactable (not the case in the OP as the parent did turn up if somewhat belatedly) then SS will deal with it. Hence having a policy about contacting SS and when to do it is sensible. (In response to some posters who were arguing they won't deal with it) God forbid anyone should use a public service for what it is actually for.

hissy no she sounded like a rude entitled twat, like unfortunately some are. Mabey her dh is just henpecked and long suffering. If that situation arose, I would keep ringing BO and explain the situation. If child is still waiting she would probably have to come back from what she's doing and see to the issue. She will have the parents contact details and address. Did you have BO number or SO number with you. I woukd not be left alone unless I had contact numbers for The leaders.

Booyaka - no obviously ED is far far far from an "academic source" - but that's not what I meant and you, I'm sure, realise that.

My point was, again as I'm sure you actually realise, that MN shouldn't give a flying fuck what that bunch of misogynistic wankers on Encyc. Dram. has to say about anything that happens on MN; so their thing about MNers rushing to suggest phoning 101 is just another part of their loathsome vitriol against MN. It's no reason to stop suggesting it when it's needed, just because of those haters.

Parent 30+ minutes late adult waiting with child needs to be somewhere in 30 minutes time to collect her own DC. Parents uncontactable, emergency contacts not answering. What does that person do if not contact SS? Sure as hell she doesn't leave her own child uncollected. Maybe she should just leave the kid outside the building and hope the parents turn up, as SS have more important things to do.

The trouble with that is that calling SS wouldn't help, given that the chances of their turning up within 20 minutes (which is presumably the maximum time the adult could leave it before going to collect their own child) are pretty close to zero. Surely in that situation the adult in question shouldn't volunteer to wait anyway.