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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To feel it is high time that Israel/Palestinian issue got resolved?

534 replies

SippyDippy · 12/10/2015 21:56

conflict us starting up again. I cannot bear another round of children being killed indiscriminately. The super powers would have you believe that it is all oh so very complicated. its not though is it. It is so bloody unfair how those children will keep dying if the status quo is maintained. Something needs to change.

OP posts:
nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:20

So I'm told, Ego.

But is anyone actually doing it on this thread?

Because if not, it seems a bit off topic.

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:20

"if you're jewish, but born in, lets say, Russia, then your homeland is Russia, not Palestine" - true, Nataleejah.

But what about if your homeland was a country that no longer exists (like my family's home in Prussia) or if your homeland attacked you and threw you out (like the million or so Jews from Arab countries across the Middle East and North Africa, not to mention their numerous descendants)? What about the Jews whose families came from...Israel and had lived there for hundreds of years? Where are all these Jews supposed to 'go back to'?

And what about all those Israelis (the majority) who were born in Israel. Where are they supposed to 'go back to'?

It would be lovely if the solution was that simple. Unfortunately, that is not the case.

Egosumquisum · 16/10/2015 11:21

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

hampsterdam · 16/10/2015 11:22

Crystalgall ' most people who disagree with isreal are anti semitic' that's a quote.
I'm not anti semitic. I really don't care which imaginary friend you believe in.

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:23

bakingnovice - agreed, the actions of some of the settlers are dreadful.

I'm interested in also hearing your views on the actions of Palestinians who over the last week have driven at and stabbed and murdered several peaceful Israeli citizens minding their own business. What action do you think should be taken against these attackers and against those inciting them to protect innocent Israeli civilians?

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:26

Well, it would be good if that refutal could be posted while those posters are actually active on the thread and near their comments. It doesn't really relate to the comments that have been made recently.

Of course anti-Semitism does not equal opposition to the current Israeli government. Only about 29% of the 64% of Israelis who voted in the last election actually voted for Netanyahu. That doesn't make all those who didn't vote for this government anti-Semitic!

That would be ludicrous.

TheXxed · 16/10/2015 11:26

I don't understand how anyone can justify colonialism. This is a EUROPEAN problem and should be resolved in EUROPE.

bakingnovice · 16/10/2015 11:29

Nomnom - I think they should be arrested and tried. Instead they have been shot at point blank and videod and taunted. Even those who are pregnant and carrying sunglasses in hand. No weapons. Even children.

The only person stabbing people who has lived has been the Jewish settler who stabbed another jew. He wasn't shot down.

What action do you think should be taken againssoldiers and settlers who shoot any Arab they see?

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:29

How on earth is it a European problem? I know Israel takes part in Eurovision sometimes, but...?

Shakshuka · 16/10/2015 11:30

It's language like the 'sheer evil of the Israeli military and leadership' which highlight the problem.

They are not 'sheer evil'. If you want 'sheer evil', you could just pop over the border to Syria.

Not to say there aren't abuses or that the leadershp is going in the wrong direction. But 'sheer evil'? As opposed to the goodly Palestinian leadership which incites and glorifies death?

No, people who speak like that are part of the problem, not the solution.

TheXxed · 16/10/2015 11:30

nonnom if you are occupying a country you are not peaceful.

hampsterdam · 16/10/2015 11:32

They should be arrested and put on trial. That's the civilised thing to do. Not be assassinated.

Shakshuka · 16/10/2015 11:34

Instead they have been shot at point blank and videod and taunted. Even those who are pregnant and carrying sunglasses in hand. No weapons. Even children.

Wow, wow, wow. Talk about distortion. About half of assailants who have attacked innocent civilians have been killed in action. About half have survived including the 13 year old boy who stabbed two Israelis and who is currently recovering in an Israeli hospital .

They have not been shot for being pregnant and carrying sunglasses. Bullshit. Total and utter bullshit.

TheXxed · 16/10/2015 11:34

Israels continued occupation of Palestine is justified because of Europe's history of anti semitism and genocide against Jewish people. The solution is to make Europe safer for Jews rather than steal a country.

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:34

bakingnovice - have all of them been shot down? Do you have evidence for that. Don't think that's true - the 13-year-old in hospital in Israel springs to mind. Agree with you that they should be arrested (albeit sometimes that may not be possible - if someone is trying to kill someone else and is actively stabbing them or hitting them with an axe, arresting them peaceably may realistically be too slow a process and endanger the life of the victim of the attack).

Obviously I think soldiers and settlers who shoot any Arab they see should also be arrested and tried.

What else could any normal person possibly think? That they should be shot on sight? Set free? Given a hero's welcome? Hmm

Shakshuka · 16/10/2015 11:35

Hampsterdam

The 13 year old Palestinian boy won't be put on trial. He's too young. He can't even go to jail under Israeli law because he committed the attempted murder under the age of 14. At most he can go to a closed boarding school and has to be released by the age of 20. How very inhumane.

cleanmachine · 16/10/2015 11:36

The video of the Palestinian woman shot and carrying sunglasses is ask over the Internet. Along with the other point blank shootings of Palestinians.

Occupation and apartheid is evil. It must end.

hampsterdam · 16/10/2015 11:36

Exactly the. Isreali citizens serve in the idf. Most do national service which makes them complicit in the occupation.

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:38

"The solution is to make Europe safer for Jews rather than steal a country."

With respect, xx, most Israelis aren't European. They're Israeli. The clue is in the name. About half may have had some European ancestors but that doesn't make them European. The other half came from the Middle East - and it's clearly not feasible, sadly, for Jews to return to ancient Jewish communities in Iraq, Syria etc, is it? The number of Israelis who were actually born in Europe is tiny.

Shakshuka · 16/10/2015 11:39

Israels continued occupation of Palestine is justified because of Europe's history of anti semitism and genocide against Jewish people. The solution is to make Europe safer for Jews rather than steal a country.

Are you on drugs?

a) There has always been a Jewish presence in the land of Israel. It is and always has been the Jewish homeland. Just like Kurdistan is the homeland of the Kurds. My own family has been in the land of Israel for more than ten generations and were ethnically cleansed by Arabs from their homes in Hebron in the 1920s.

b) More than half of Israel's Jews are of Arab origin and were expelled by Arab countries

c) It is a bit late to make Europe safe for Jews given that most European Jews have already been annihilated.

d) There was no occupation until 1967

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:40

And they didn't 'steal a country'. The United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine agreed the creation of a Jewish state in Israel.

They were given a country. Sorry you don't like it. But it's not stealing - any more than the Poles 'stole' Prussia. Do you protest against the Poles and boycott Polish products too?

hampsterdam · 16/10/2015 11:43

Is isreal still inside the Borders that were agreed in the partition plan ? No the rest they stole.

Shakshuka · 16/10/2015 11:44

I disagree that they were even given a country. The Arabs rejected partition. Israel accepted, declared independence and was invaded by five armies. No one 'gave' Israel a country.

Shakshuka · 16/10/2015 11:45

They didn't steal. The Arabs rejected partition and went for everything. They lost. That's what happens when you start a war and lose.

nonnomnom · 16/10/2015 11:46

cleanmachine '- ah, it's all over the internet.

So it MUST be true then. Hmm

Are you seriously suggesting that she was shot because she was pregnant and carrying sunglasses? That it is official Israeli policy to shoot people just for being pregnant and carrying sunglasses?

Do you have any real, non-nutty links that actually state this actually occurred? And that IF it did, no action was taken against the perpetrators?

Without further knowledge, 3 possibilities seem likely:

  1. This never happened.
  2. It did happen - but she was shot whilst trying to murder someone else (but you forgot to mention that bit).
  3. It did happen and the mad Israeli responsible is now locked up awaiting trial.

I refuse to believe this is standard Israeli policy.