to think Corbyn is dead in the water

[oldshilling]

Yes he's a nice chap with a nice beard, but silliness (principled though it might be) like refusing to sing the national anthem is not going to endear him to more than a small minority of the population.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34263447

And the signs are that he intends to be the gift that keeps on giving, in terms of pointless gestures that don't really achieve anything but make him a mega-target for the right-wing press.

Either he gets turfed out before the next GE, or he surpasses Michael Foot as the biggest loser in Labour's history.

I wonder if he'll wear white and red poppies to the Cenotaph? Or will he hVe been so institutionalised by then that he won't.

So Nicole anyone who disagrees with you is brainwashed.?

Hitler and Stalin ran dictatorships where any opposition was literally killed.
We live in the 21st century internet age in a free democracy where a whole
host of opinions are freely disseminated
People who read the Daily Mail or Guardian do so to get their existing views
reinforced not challenged.

An organization such as the BBC who strives for impartiality will get attacked from both left and right for bias,

Tony didn't believe in a God and said so. That's different. but he sang the national anthem. But then he knew how to win elections didn't he?

Tony DID believe in a God; it was Campbell who said 'We don't do God'. Tony was a liar and a hypocrite who won one election convincingly and it's been steadily downhill ever since.

The climate where Tony thrived has changed; this whole debate seems like the death throes of the old, birth pains of the new. If JC's been leader for only FOUR DAYS how can he be dead in the water already?! Give him a chance?! Lots of people (myself included) don't think he's put a foot wrong so far, tho the whipped up media shitstorms give a different impression.

Good on 'im, I say! It's an embarrassingly terrible national anthem anyway. It says nothing about the type of people we are or the land we live in.
It only includes those who are happy to be willing subjects IMO.

"People aren't ignorant because they read different papers to you."

I agree.. But if the different paper they read is The Daily Mail, then they are ignorant.

I agree batshit - it's a shite national anthem. Totally outdated and says nothing about the Britain of our times whatsoever. The time for it to be gleefully scrapped forever is long overdue.

The more I see of JC the more I like him. Only thing Jezza. Get yourself three good suits. I know that's shallow but it will help I promise.

I think its sad that with such an approval labour aren't getting behind JC, he's not an island, they could try and work on moderating some of his policies. There has been lots of toy throwing considering the large chunk of votes received which is to the detriment of the party.

Agree with this ^.

Though there must be some people who are behind him ?

The way it's being reported makes it seem that he is completely alone in a sea of ostracism, criticism and sneering/sniggering and I feel co-responsible as I voted for him.

I did see one supportive MP on TV today - Sarah Champion.

I don't think I'd be sniggering with such a resounding vote of no confidence in the last opposition shadow cabinet.

I don't sing it ~ ever, and I'm as patriotic as they come. I love Britain and the British with a passion.

But, if there's one thing I could change about this country, it's our appalling national anthem which embarrasses and offends me.

Good for JC for representing those of us that feel strongly about this!

what's 'silly' about not singing the national anthem?

Why would a republican who doesn't believe in God waste his time blahing along to 'God save the queen'? Who would he be kidding?! And the full words to that song are actually pretty awful, offensive, and not in line with his beliefs as a pacifist.

I'm a fan of our dear old Queen Elizabeth,having said that I don't know all the words to our National Anthem. Perhaps Jeremy doesn't either.

All is hysteria would be a bit more comprehensible if JC were prime minister.

But of course, he's completely unelectable so why does anyone care?

Plus it's a fucking joke that Sun or Times journalists should lecture an atheist republican about standing in respectful silence during "God save the queen" when they represent a presumably God-fearing, monarchist organisation which illegally tapped royal phones.

Cherchez l'erreur.

I am an atheist, labour party member and have never sung the national anthem. But I think I would have on my second day in office, representing hundreds of thousands of people at a serious national event. AFAIK, the party doesn't have a policy on God and it isn't republican, so I'd have gone with the default setting and then started a conversation about the role of church and state (and our terrible anthem, the lyrics are extraordinary). Neil Kinnock said you don't really get to have personal opinions as party leader and I think on this occasion, that would have been the grown up view. He has said he will sing it in future, so he can't feel that strongly, and presumably he doesn't interpret flags being stained with martyrs' blood literally either. It would have had the added bonus that we could have concentrated on the bills going through this week.

If he had sung it with gusto, he would have been labelled a hypocrite.
If he had sung it half-heartedly, he would have faced the same reactions he's getting now.
He stood respectfully, and didn't mouth along with words he doesn't agree with - I think that shows integrity rather than a lack of respect.

And once again - it's a fuck sight more respect than the royals themselves often show when they're palpably bored, or irritated, or dressed as nazis.

Good points Seekevery! Let's face it, it doesn't matter what JC does, they are going to criticise him, so he might as well do what he thinks is best and sod them.

Maintaining a respectful silence was a good compromise. If he had bellowed out the song like the rest of them, he would have been accused of hypocrisy. That is a lot worse than being accused of disrespect.

But he has said he will sing it on future occasions. So why not yesterday?

The behaviour of other people, including that of appalling royals, isn't relevant - he is setting new standards.

He's going to sing it yes. It's understandable considering his enemies, who are legion, needn't be handed a big stick on a silver platter to beat him with.

Really though, are the broader public buying all this hysteria? There must be a lot of people on the left that relish the muck being flung at Corbyn by the establishment, further proof that they are rattled by him and what he represents. This IMO makes him more popular with his supporters and forces them to rally around him to an even greater degree.

I haven't made my mind up on JC yet. However I have a lot of respect for anyone who has not been programmed to be a media-savvy, career politician who eventually becomes out of touch with the ordinary folk.

I bet JC will appeal to disaffected voters who have felt for a long time there's no point in voting as all politicians are the same. These people have I think been courted by UKIP. Those labour MPs who can't get their head around JC need to understand that the reason no one voted for them in the last GE election and their leadership election is precisely because no one believes them or they don't believe what they stand for should be what the Labour Party stands for.

I do hope we are seeing a new era in politics, and it would be nice to have someone other than bloody Farage willing to stand up in front of the media and say what he genuinely thinks.

If the rumours about him centralising staff is correct and not letting PLP chose there own, there could be a lot of very very unhappy MPs and loss of jobs

I dunno - I don't think you have to buy the hysteria to think that he might have shown poor judgement, given he is not sticking to this principle in future, and to make the point he has given the press some idiotic headlines and lost the momentum on important issues like the TU bill. I agree with a lot of his policies, have serious doubts about others and I didn't vote for him. That doesn't mean I believe what the DM tells me, and I have read plenty of comment in the last few days from Labour supporters or members with broadly that outlook. Owen Jones' New Statesman piece on how JC does need to deal with the media is worth a read IMO.

Lalsy

Spot spot on posts. Couldn't agree more.

He looked and sounded like a well meaning geography teacher on a field trip during Prime Ministers Question Time.