AIBU to tell friend to report her OH's behaviour with their 4wk old baby?

[WilsonPoppy]

I've name changed for this. I don't have kids yet so I need help to judge this one.

My friend just had a baby 4 weeks ago and was struggling with recovery from caesarian at first but now she is settled and really happy although she has tendencies to be quite stressed and a bit low.

BUT she told me in conversation today that her OH can be quite rough with the baby and last night they were both sitting on the sofa with baby laying down in the bouncer in front of him. My friend couldn't pick baby up from that awkward angle because of her caesarian scar so she asked OH to pick her up and pass her over. She said he picked her up by the scruff of her neck (her baby grow) with one hand and handed her over to her like that across the sofa.

She said she went mad with him and he said he was busy with his other hand (doing something to his foot). I told her that he needs to know he can't handle a baby like that and she totally agreed it was ridiculous and said the baby should be a priority over his ankle.

She told me he is quite rough with the baby and shakes her around a bit too much sometimes when he is changing her/winding her. She then said that he walks around with her in one hand and she doesn't like it. She's told him to use two hands but she saw him with her tucked under his arm like a rugby ball and he went to the toilet and did the toilet with her like that a couple of times and she went mad with him.

After I took all this in I said 'You need to talk to him about this very seriously, he can't do that, it's really disrespectful, it's child abuse' and she said 'he won't do it again, i've told him'. She thinks he is just a bit naive about babies and it's early days and he has zero common sense. He is a big drinker but she tells me he has been behaving himself lately. When he drinks he gets so drunk he doesn't even know who she is or where he lives.

The day they came home from hospital he was swinging her very high up (above his head) quite fast and I thought 'that's too high, too fast' for a 4 day old baby'. I didn't say anything then and maybe i should have. Her neck was supported and she was tiny in his big hands.

I can't ignore it and I'm going to tell her to speak to her health visitor / GP / doctor about it.

AIBU to tell her she has got to tell her health visitor what her OH is doing?

But he's not taking care to hold the baby gently and lovingly, is he BigbyWolf?

That speaks volumes, as far as I'm concerned.

It's not normal to behave like that. At best he's being knowingly careless (why, we can only guess, but I'd wager it's to scare or intimidate the baby's mother). Worst case scenario this is just the start of an escalation of rough handling of the baby which could end in serious injury or death.

And yet, if he accidentally injured the baby (which is a real possibility) and it hit the tabloids, how many MNers wouldn't label it child abuse? Hmmm?

I agree it depends on intent... It rings a little bit of trying to look confident and coming across as fucking idiotic cocky. But it does need exploring further. I've had a cesarean and it does hurt but I couldn't have sat and watched someone manhandle my baby if I had though they were at risk of hurting him.

Red flags everywhere.

I don't care what anyone says, it's NOT normal for a father to pick a young baby up by the neck of its babygro because he's too busy doing something with his foot. Ffs. The baby is four weeks old! It can't support its head yet.

It's NOT normal for a father to be too rough with a newborn baby and swing it high above his head at a few days old to the point that OP recognised it was not the way to handle a newborn.

It is NOT normal to carry a four week old baby tucked under your arm like a rugby ball. At least not in the way I picture it which isn't the cradling position that you all are describing. Now I could be wrong, but I believe he's carrying the baby limp under his arm, not supporting it lying on his arm and tucked into his elbow. Now admittedly I can't be sure that my impression is correct, but I wouldn't use the term 'like a rugby ball' to describe the cradling position. I guess we need OP to clarify, and obviously if I'm wrong, I'm wrong. But something about this really concerned me.

OP I think you need to advise your friend according to your own impressions of the man. You know him and have observed him at least once behaving in a way that was not safe and appropriate with a tiny baby. What do you think is actually going on? Tell her if she is worried she absolutely needs to tell someone. Dr, HV, anyone in a medical or responsible position. At best He needs a talking to by someone he will actually listen to - do people on this thread actually realise how easily a baby can be damaged by overly vigorous shaking? - and at worst she will need to get her baby away from him.

Please report this OP. He could injure the baby (possibly permanently) or even kill the baby. The shaking and lifting by the scruff of the neck is just horrific - it sounds like your friend is crying for help. Please help her and her innocent little baby.

"Or, Multivac you could stop projecting your own holding techniques on to this bloke."

I did. Did you miss the post?

I couldn't not report it I'm afraid.

THe OPs friend is concerned enough to describe the manhandling in detail to her.

I would be worried every day that something tragic would happen to this infant and I could have prevented it but chose not to.

It's too big a burden to carry. THe baby is the most important thing here- far more important than the OP or the baby's mother.

I would have to phone social services. My conscience wouldn't me allow not to.

flumplet No. I say yet again. Intent doesn't matter that much.

Intent affects whether the OP's friend should LTB.
But as regards the baby's immediate risk of physical injury, a brain bleed is a brain bleed. It does not matter a WHIT whether the caregiver meant to hurt the baby, the baby is still injured.

Shaken Baby Syndrome is serious. And having good intentions when you let your baby's head get shaken does fuck-all to prevent it. Does fuck-all to cure it, too.

Multivac But then you started it again.

"Multivac But then you started it again."

Um, no I didn't. Sorry.

I'll file that posr under something else?

Because you're clearly over-identifying with this wazzock in it, even if you don't try to claim he's using your hold. You just try to imply the OP is over-reacting.

Funny thing, I found my diary of those "fraught" times of new parenthood, from when I had mine, just the other week. Every thing that DH, MIL, SIL, and the Daily Mail did that annoyed me in the first sleepless month is recorded. I cannot see "DH can't hold babies" in there. Yet he was coping with two babies, too...

I don't think the OP is overreacting at all.

I think several of the people responding to the thread are. The ("I'm not expert but...") diagnosis of 'revenge shaking because he can't have a drink any more' would be hilarious if these weren't real parents, with a real baby, who may or may not be in need of help, now.

I think it's really important to listen to your friend and support her in this - if she is worried enough to talk to you about NUMEROUS occasions where he hasn't held the baby correctly then that sounds like a cry for help.

As a minimum you should reassure her that she is not overreacting and that she can speak to her HV to get more advice and support and to help talk to her DP. I'd also be keeping my ear out for anything else she says and would be reporting further if she decided not to approach the HV.

The rugby hold- fine

The picking it up by the scruff of the neck? Doesn't sound good but I'm finding it hard to picture it.

I think if you have any concerns then you should call and report, or at least ask for advice.

I know having SS knocking on your door is horrid if you haven't done anything wrong but I couldn't live with myself if something happened. Ring and ask for advice and go from there OP.

If this man is such an evil penis-bearing bully, who hates and resents the baby, how come he's changing nappies and carrying the baby around while he goes to the loo? Surely a bad, resentful father would be ignoring the baby most of the time, not participating in childcare.
He possibly is overconfident and/or only used to handling older babies eg friends' kids who are big enough to appreciate being swung up in the air, but I think some people are being very quick to label him abusive.

I think you are right to encourage your friend to speak to her HV or GP. He may just need some parenting advice but it sounds as though the baby could be at risk of injury so something needs to be done to protect the poor kid.. I would contact the NSPCC too for advice.

I wouldn't carry my cat like this, never mind a tiny baby.

He is being rough and not focussing on the baby, just manhandling it as if it were an object, one day he'll be picking the baby up by one arm and it will be wrenched out of its socket, or bruised very badly

evil penis-bearing bully

Sorry, where does his penis come into this? No-one has said he swings the baby around by his penis. He sounds like a shit parent who is endangering his newborn baby - his genitals are irrelevant.

"He sounds like a shit parent"

Yeah. Changing his child's nappy; winding her; carrying around with him. The utter, utter bastard .

I say again, the rugby hold is certainly not fine. Everything on the whole is wrong with the way he's treating this baby. Only if he was a loving father who handled his baby the proper way would the rugby hold be fine. It's disgusting and very disturbing. It's like he's trying to send the message "this is what I think of this baby. Seriously, it needs stopping before it's too late.

Yeah. Changing his child's nappy; winding her; carrying around with him. The utter, utter bastard

You think abusive parents aren't capable of providing any practical care at all?! Women with abusive partners are able to list 'good' things their husbands do for them. It doesn't excuse the abuse. You simply cannot treat a newborn baby as if it's a toy to be picked up any old way and thrown around. Because it can kill them.

Good old MN so quick to jump on the 'it's abuse!' band waggon and contribute to ruining people's lives! I agree with FatMomma solidgoldbrass and multivac
This man is obviously trying. Maybe a slight over confidence issue. Nothing you said is worrying imo apart from the 'shaking' when winding or changing nappy . . . but I don't think you really mean shaking, you don't write that particular part of the post very well, so it's difficult to know what you mean, but I struggle to picture someone winding a baby and shaking her at the same time . . . maybe patting too hard by the mothers standards. He might be a little over confident, but going by your post I don't see anything worse going on.

At the very worst get her to speak to the HV . . . for God's sake don't report him to the social. Poor guy.
And to the PP who suggested she leave him immediately just as her friend had done . . . there are no words!

Blah, your concern is admirable. But hyperbole isn't helpful. You know nothing about this guy other than a reported conversation about some aspects of his behaviour, plus a single, witnessed incident of him - possibly ill-advisedly - playing with his newborn.

Calling him "shit", or worse; diagnosing abuse, alcohol issues so severe they affect his parenting, deliberate mental cruelty; and even suggesting the OP should leave him, on those grounds, is mind-bogglingly inappropriate from a bunch of internet strangers, I suggest.

The OP has been advised to contact a professional with her concerns. The hysterical speculation is surely de trop.

Being rough with a newborn, swinging it high, shaking it, picking it up by the scruff of its babygro - My, all signs of being an excellent involved parent. I bet we all wish our partners were as involved as this fella.

Isn't the rugby ball hold a thing? Where you have the baby under one arm with the head in your hand? I did that.