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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think its unfair to force the dad to be at the birth?

286 replies

ASorcererIsAWizardSquared · 28/07/2015 11:01

Just hear me out :)

We've all heard the view that if they were there for the conception and should be for the birth, but if they (for whatever reason) really, really didn't want to be in the room during the birth, is it fair to force them to be?

DH was at both of mine, but i gave him that choice as i had my mum as my primary birth partner, if he hadn't wanted to be, i'd have been a little disappointed, but i'd have never FORCED him to be there.

I think birth should be as positive and calming and stress free as possible, and having someone in the room who really doesn't want to be there doesn't sit right with me.

I've spoken to a couple of people who've said if their Dh's/BFs had refused they'd have ended the relationship, but i think that's borderline abusive.

If you DIDN'T want them there, and they wanted to be, there would be uproar at them trying to force, bully and blackmail their will on the situation, so why is it ok in some womens' eyes for them to do the same to them?

OP posts:

ApocalypseThen · 28/07/2015 16:13

There's going to be a next one? I assume you're now dripping in the diamonds of apology?

cranberryx · 28/07/2015 16:14

I feel quite smug now about my DP's response to my dad the other day.

"Will you be there at the birth?'
"The only thing that could keep me away is death"

On a second note: I agree with not forcing someone to be somewhere that they don't want to be. The most important thing at the birth is that the mum to be has people there that will support and advocate for her regardless of it's a doula, the MIL or DM or the father to be.

Luckyfellow · 28/07/2015 16:20

Apologies - haven't read the thread as only have a moment. Just wanted to say that I have always had to have been at the births of my children though I have been scared. I would have been more scared without my DH and would have been very unimpressed and disappointed in him if he had said he was too scared to be at the birth. I would not be with such a man. It is not blackmail to say it. Just a fact that that is not the type of relationship I am interested in.

ollieplimsoles · 28/07/2015 16:28

Planning on catching up with this thread in a moment bit just wanting to add my view;

My dh would have to be chained outside the door to keep him away from the birth of our first baby later this year.

I would be upset if my dh said he was too scared or squeamish to be at the birth though, i already feel vunerable and I would want to spend the first precious moments as a new family together.
I have said to him that if he needs to get away for a little while to have a breather then he can do, and Ive made sure he has packed a bag for himself for hospital and has some snacks and drinks for himself if we manage to stay at home.

SaucyJack · 28/07/2015 16:29

"I didn't need a 'birth partner', it just seems to be expected nowadays."

This is true, although the cynic in me thinks this is far more to do with the NHS staffing levels crisis than the desire to promote some sort of family bonding birth "experience".

I dunno what giving birth was like twenty years ago, but these days it's extremely unlikely (IME) that you'll get a midwife attending to you for anything other than the essentials or two-hourly checks. If I hadn't had a birth partner, then I would have spent the vast majority of my births labouring alone.

LibrariesGaveUsPower · 28/07/2015 16:40

No, I don't think men should be 'forced'

But short of a serious phobia or health condition, I would think less of a man who put his own personal preferences ahead of a wish by his partner to have his support.

As others have said, if my DH was going through a serious medical procedure, I would want to be as close as they would allow and he would want in order to support him. The idea that a DH would put his own preferences above that leaves me pretty cold. If there is every a time it's not about you and what you want childbirth is it.

Topseyt · 28/07/2015 16:45

I gave my DH the choice about whether or not to be present at the births of all three of our DDs. I gave him the choice because I felt it would be wrong and unfair of me to force. He chose to be there. He was also there when DD3 was delivered by emergency c-section at 35 weeks.

I was delighted he chose to be there. He was clearly very anxious at the time, and horrified by how painful the whole process was, but he stayed. I know he was apprehensive, as was I of course, as he couldn't really settle, but he caused no problems and wanted to be there.

If he hadn't felt able to be there I would have done it on my own with just the midwives. I am not one of those who would say "couldn't have done it without him" because the births would have happened whether he was there or not.

I don't think it is fair to force, and I would rather have no partner than an unwilling one. He was only able to come to the births of DD2 and DD3 because my mother was caring for older ones.

Just my opinion though. It clearly wouldn't be everyone's.

Crownjewel · 28/07/2015 16:45

Haha ApocalypseThen, sadly not, although I take it from your reaction that it wouldn't be unreasonable of me to expect an apology would it? I didn't think so either still to this day it makes me want to poke his eyes out when I hear him recount the "magical experience" - it certainly wasn't fucking magical in any sense from where I was kneeling with my arse in the air and several people's hands up my fanjo while he merrily went about organising his dinner and having a little lie down, the sheer "magic" of it all obviously overwhelmed the poor lamb...

Sorry, I'm ranting again

Topseyt · 28/07/2015 17:12

Actually, I think my DH also emerged thankful that I didn't round on him ranting that he "got me into this mess", something I am also thankful that I didn't do.

WixingMords · 28/07/2015 17:17

You know what the problem is with this, if a man is 'fearful' or 'scared' so doesn't want to be there because of these feelings, and he has a partner who wants him to be there because she too has these feelings about the birth, it's a real two fingers at her from him if he refuses to go, "I can opt out but you can't and I don't care" (if you like, seeing the words been used about in the other direction, he's forcing her into a situation she doesn't want and blackmailing her to do it alone)

If a woman is comfortable with giving birth and has a partner with these feeling then the changes are she's going to be OK with him not supporting her because she's not in need to the support.

LibrariesGaveUsPower · 28/07/2015 17:28

Agree wixing. If my DH is doing something big and scary and physically exhausting and wants support, doesn't it make me a bit of an arse to say "Ooh, I would rather not." Why should birth be any different.

Andrewofgg · 28/07/2015 17:30

If there's ever a situation in life in which I don't give a shit about men's feelings, it's childbirth.

I do appreciate tho that if you have an immature and/or EA partner, then you're better off with him out of the room.

Sounds good - but a man may be neither immature nor EA but hopelessly squeamish in the presence of blood and gore and in that case he is just going to be a nuisance, isn't he?

DW wanted me there and I was glad she did - of course if she hadn't wanted me there that would have been the end of the question - but I am not squeamish and I hope and believe I was of some use to her. My first minutes with DS live in my memory and he's thirty now.

maninawomansworld · 28/07/2015 17:33

I was at the birth of my twins. DW wanted me there and I was fine with it but I would much rather have not been there.

I know I am opening myself up to a flaming as all the women on here tell me to get a grip or think of my poor wife actually giving birth (both very valid points) but I found it hard to watch her go through that and be so powerless.

I'm not squeamish in the least, I am a farmer and have delivered thousands of calves and lambs ever since I was a toddler helping my father. I've seen it all, healthy ones, calves born the wrong way round, dead ones that have rotted away inside the mother, the lot.
For some reason a healthy, normal human birth really didn't sit well with me and I found the whole thing a bit uncomfortable and unpleasant.

LibrariesGaveUsPower · 28/07/2015 17:37

Man - you are rather yes. How many women do you think found it all a bit unpleasant and would rather not be there. It really isn't about whether it is a magical experience. It is about supporting your partner through something very hard if she wants you to.

Andrewofgg · 28/07/2015 17:37

maninawomansworld You are right on one point. You had better reach for the flameproof undies!

WixingMords · 28/07/2015 17:43

Man the point was you'd have rather not but you were because you were there to support your wife. Which is what the vast majority on this thread as saying the situation should be.

For what it's worth, I felt totally powerless giving birth to my sons, things went so badly wrong, if DH hadn't have been there he's have been totally clueless and not been able to understand the why I was so traumatised.

PosterEh · 28/07/2015 17:43

Why would you get a flaming though? Your feelings are totally valid. What matters is your wife wanted you and you were there for her.

LibrariesGaveUsPower · 28/07/2015 17:47

Poster - I assumed the reference to flaming wad because his entire post was about how it made him feel.

Andrewofgg · 28/07/2015 17:51

I would not admit to feeling how he felt on this site even if I had felt that way which I didn't!

The father's feelings don't matter unless as I said he would be a nuisance in which case he has no business being there.

ShebaShimmyShake · 28/07/2015 17:58

I can't see the point in forcing anyone to witness something that they would find unpleasant. But I'm less worried about men being forced to be there than I am women being pressured to have men there when they don't want to. Some women sincerely do not wish to have their partners witness all that and they are always being demonised and castigated, even though their preference was the norm not all that long ago.

I think that some men - some - want to attend more out of morbid fascination and schadenfreude than supportiveness. The test is simple. Ask him how he'd feel if his partner said that she would find it easier if he was not a witness to all that. If he says, "She's the one who has to go through it, so I just want to do whatever will be best for her", then yay, good man. If he starts getting huffy and puffy and pissy about his 'rights' and how offensive it is because childbirth should be all about HIM, he's in it for the wrong reasons and can go fuck a duck. And be there at the egg laying.

Incidentally, my husband wants to do whatever's best for me. I am not convinced that having him present while I lose control of my mind, bladder and bowels is something I would find beneficial.

Andrewofgg · 28/07/2015 18:00

and can go fuck a duck. And be there at the egg laying.

Besides agreeing I am PMSL at this!

Canyouforgiveher · 28/07/2015 18:05

Crownjewel, I don't think I'd have a next one with your dp if I were you.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 28/07/2015 18:08

I think a man who is so squeamish that he would be a nuisance is actually immature. A grown up would either get over it or seek help in doing so.

ShebaShimmyShake · 28/07/2015 18:11

Glad you like it, Andrew :)

I'm serious though. I do understand women who say 'well I have to be present so I don't see why he should get a free pass out!' and I'm not unsympathetic. But given that we can't really help the fact that women are the ones who labour, I really don't see what benefit there is in forcing a man who's only going to find it distressing and unpleasant to be there. People can wax endlessly lyrical about what a 'real man' or whatever would do (as if that isn't a pure social construct that has run every gamut from long haired, romantic Cavalier minstrel to mean, lean bodybuilder!) but it's irrelevant. If he hates the sight of someone he loves in pain and gore and stress, and there isn't actually anything practical he can do to help, then how much support is he going to be? What's the point of forcing him to be there? I love my husband dearly but there are some things in my life where my mother or a close girlfriend are just better at offering the kind of support I need for those particular circumstances. Is that really so awful?

And it worries me that childbirth - freaking CHILDBIRTH! - seems to have become so much about what MEN want that women who would rather exercise a different, less socially common preference about who's there, are always being demonised. And I've seen threads in these very pages by women whose abusive partners suddenly demanded to attend the birth, and while the women obviously didn't want it, felt unable to say no because FATHERS' RIGHTS and whatnot.

Ultimately, if she wants him there and he doesn't, it'll have to be up to each individual couple to decide what's best for them and which compromise is preferable. There's no absolute right or wrong for something so personal and individual.

I maintain the test to see what his real reasons are for going. I may be cynical, but I have heard dads talk gleefully and tastelessly about splatter patterns and goo, yet when I suggested that was not respectful, suddenly became pious defendants of being 'witnesses to the miracle of life' and all that. Sadly, miracles are not necessarily spectator sports. My husband and I are in love, but we have a lock on the bathroom door.

For my part, if my husband said that he didn't want to witness me in that state, I really wouldn't see any point in forcing the issue. And if anyone questioned his manliness as a result, I'd just remind them of the time he kung fu punched the living daylights out of a guy who tried to mug me on the street.

Sallyhasleftthebuilding · 28/07/2015 18:11

So if DH asked you to sit in a bath of spiders ... would you do that for him?

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