to ask why, if it's generally accepted to be the behaviour of a twat, do parents exclude a couple of kids from class parties?

[Chippedrippedandstinking]

Inspired by Lappy's thread, we all agree it's wrong and yet it happens. With flame amnesty, will abuone admit to doing it, and if so, why?
And if it happened to you, did you call the parents on it?

I've only seen it once, the mother was taken aside and an invitation was issued.

(And she was definitely invited to all the parties ... mums were much more taken in by her than their children, who were too scared to say 'no, I don't want her there')

I can sympathise with the bully, even when we are talking actual severe bullying. Because nobody knows what goes on behind closed doors.
I wasn't a bully, but not because I was such a lovely child I overcame my home life and was able to treat others how I never was, or was blessed by a beautiful considerate personality. I just happened to also be the child who was top of the class academically, was good at sports, etc and attracted peers. And when I was at primary the pretty high achieving mc child got regularly made to feel great by being awarded everything and winning everything, so certainly at school I had less reason to need to put other kids down to feel good. And being attractive to peers as 'fun' meant I didn't need to force or control anyone to follow me. And other adults mainly took to me too.
However I had zero empathy for many other children. I remember quite clearly in y7 another girl was being properly bullied by another group, and my thoughts were ffs, stop feeling sorry for yourself I take far worse everyday and unlike you don't have anyone who cares. I imagine at primary my thoughts would have been the same too. Because to my childish reasoning, compared to my home life, being hounded and insulted and victimised by a group your own age was fuck all, at least with peers she could have defended herself. I'd have traded in a flash for that.
If I'd been an average or less popular child, or not articulate and mc, or at primary today where you aren't praised on a daily basis for no effort high achievement, I would have been a bully I think.
I do remember being outraged by anyone obviously stronger picking on the weak who couldn't defend themselves, and remember punching a boy who was taking the piss out of a classmate even at 6 I could see was more like a toddler. And telling a teacher x didn't understand so stop shouting at him. I had lots of empathy for that type of bullying. But other kids, nah they should defend themselves and stop being cry babies.
I'm not saying I feel like that now at all, anything but. However as an adult I can also sympathise with the bully, because no matter how nice someone's home life appears you don't actually know. And I bet in the majority of cases the bully is dealing with shit that is just as bad. Very few children are born 'evil' it's nurture not nature.

I think i was a bit harsh, doubt he is evil, but he is without any doubt a little shite!!!

Itsmine, you ate describing the very pushy parents, because jonny didnt get the main part in the play, or Zoe wasnt picked for the sports team, or Mary knew all the answers and didnt get to show off her brightness pushy parents = pushy kids who whine and moan lifes not fair. They are more likely to be excluded because they cant take turns, so kids wont play, and they try and enforce their games on others, by what ever means. About time schools were a little more honest in their findings.

I'm not saying he isn't lucy or that it's anything but normal to take your own childs side in that instance. I just think with kids you can also sympathise with the bully, without that reducing your loyalty to your own child.
Even if the parent agrees their kid is being a shit, whilst that may be the absolute truth and they may have a lovely home life, you don't actually know that's the case. No parent is likely to say, yes, I know where that came from because we as a family are abusive when nobody is around to see. Or the parent may be lovely and truthful but unaware the child is abused elsewhere. You just don't know so I'd always give a child the benefit of the doubt.

I'm sorry if I sounded dismissive on a previous post. There is bullying in schools - in fact my ds2 was bullied at one stage - and teachers don't always see exactly what is going on straight away.

My point was that there is a huge amount of behaviour by parents that exacerbates the situation rather than helping. Storming in to school, insisting that a certain child is "an evil little shite" while their own child is not at fault at all etc. One child being 100% to blame is RARE - I'm not saying that it never happens, but usually there is some fault on both sides and teachers have to be given the chance to look at both sides and try to sort it out.

If your child is being bullied of course you must insist on it being looked in to carefully, and be prepared to calmly insist on taking the matter further if necessary. No one wants their child to suffer. But showing empathy towards other peoples children and understanding of difficult situations is something that adults should surely be capable of.

Cue lots of "evil little shit" comments!!

Yes buy where school sits back and does nothing, then the bullied child reacts and it becomes 50/50.. it didnt start that way. It was dismissed straight away in an oh dear play nice .. kind of way so bully gets way with it time and time again, because there isnt one single adult in charge of bullying.

Pasta - this thread is about whether or not you would invite that child to your childs party. Whether you would, despite months of despair and devastation, tears and bruises, your child begging not to go into school, meetings with teachers etc you would invite that child to your child (the victims party), the answer is no. I didn't storm into the school, i got called by them, frequently, infact nearly every time he got hit or punched or kicked someone saw it. They knew the child was capable of this, as he did it to another child the year before. The staff witnessed unprompted violence towards my son by this other boy. I don't think the school knew how to stop it to be honest. Luckily he is in another school now so not my problem. But whatever way he aint getting an invite to my childs party.

Yes and had he retaliated or school didnt know hed done it before, it would have been 50/50...

Pastaeater - my 'crimes' were being an incomer in a small, isolated village, not speaking with the local accent, being intelligent and working hard in school.

Explain how that meant it was partly my fault that I was bullied from age 10 (when my parents chose to move us to the village) until I left senior school for VIth form college at 16, leaving me with life long depression, anxiety and catastrophically low self esteem.

No wonder bullying is such a big issue when the victims aren't even taken seriously.

lucy no I wouldn't invite that child. But I'd also work on the basis it's more than likely that the nasty child is just as much someone else's victim. And unlike my child, if the nasty childs family are his/her bullies, nobody is on their side or offering support and comfort.
Rather than taking the chance I'm inflicting further misery on a child who may well already be more miserable than any victims, I'd just re-jig the numbers so they weren't the only one not invited.

I think you are reading. "People often use the word 'bully' inappropriately" as "bullying never happens". That is not what is being said.

No. I was reading "...one child being 100% to blame is rare...".

100% to blame for bullying, that is.

Totally agree Sally. If schools dealt properly wiht this type of behaviour early on, instead of making excuses for the kids, disbelieving the victims etc perhaps we would have less bullying at a later stage in life where the consequencies can be far more serious in terms of depression, self esteem and the suicides we sometimes hear on the news. My son is over this now. He is happy. But for sometime it was really really hard. I just hope that this boy doesn't find another victim, but somehow I think that is quite likely

Thats how I read it also SDT - as an implication that it can't be true. HOwever Pasta has said that wasn't how it was meant.

You are not reading what I said. I didn't say "it never happens". I said "it's rare" and I genuinely believe that it is.

If your child has been badly bullied of course you are upset and have every right to be, but for goodness sake read the post correctly!!

Try epreading MY post more carefully - I was talking about being bullied myself, in that last post.

Grrr - reading, not whatever crap my fat fingers produced.

I'd add on to pastas that even where on a child level one child is 100% responsible, excepting born sociopaths and similar, somebody else, or many somebody's are responsible.
Children who grow up in abusive homes are just as subject to depression, suicide, low self esteem etc as victims of peer bullying. And I don't see why as adults we need to see it as either/or when it comes to sympathy.

I wasn't replying to you SDT but to posts further back in the thread.

Yes DD was heading for a metal breakdown, i saw the self harm/depression looming, but let feel sorry for the poor bulky who could have stopped but was having too much fun being mean. Maybe she didnt get tea in bed that morning, poor love. Stop assuming bullies are also victims. They are the ones posting hot or not videos, they are asking for likes on how pretty am i, they justify themselves on the best bags or lastest music.

Couldn't agree more Lurked.