to ask why, if it's generally accepted to be the behaviour of a twat, do parents exclude a couple of kids from class parties?

[Chippedrippedandstinking]

Inspired by Lappy's thread, we all agree it's wrong and yet it happens. With flame amnesty, will abuone admit to doing it, and if so, why?
And if it happened to you, did you call the parents on it?

I've only seen it once, the mother was taken aside and an invitation was issued.

Reading this thread, I have to say I am with pineapple and evil - if that makes me a crap mother in people's eyes, fine. I know I am not and I have brought up my daughter to be respectful to others in such instances, however if she did not want to invite somebody to her party, I would not force her, regardless. I may ask why and discuss reasons but at end of day, it would be her choice.

I don't expect anybody to invite her if they don't want to and I wouldn't be offended either. It's one less present to buy when you've had a few weeks of constant parties

pineapple small children generally are influenced by their parents. We therefore should make excuses for them.
evil not really. Conversation went
'Who do you want at your party'
'Erm, bf1, bf2, bf3'
Anyone else
'Erm, all the girls'
'Ok'
'Oh, actually, not spiteful girl'
Then blah blah blah.
If she hadn't mentioned spiteful girl I would have mentioned her friends from elsewhere.
Dd doesn't let snide stuff slip. Because we actually talk. And she's good at reasoning, you should try it.
Think 'I'm desperate to be seen as pc' or 'bizarre' as much as you like. Funnily enough your approval is something I'm a lot happier without.

I was bullied at primary school and senior school, as was ds2. The bullies don't always get their comeuppance at senior school.

Given that I have tried to contact some of my bullies, and they have not bothered their arses to respond, I have to assume that they don't care that their treatment of me over five years has caused such irreparable damage to me and my life.

I often wonder what they'd do if one of their kids was bullied - would they think back to what they did to me and feel bad? I am not sure they would. I wouldn't wish being bullied on any child, but, in my worst, lowest moments, I have found myself starting to wish that my bullies would experience bullying for themselves. I stop myself, because I want to be better than that. But I would exclude them from any social event I hosted, without a second thought or pang of conscience.

But if we start to make excuses now where will it stop? Children need to learn early on that actions have consequences not when ita too late. We cant make excuses for everything else they never learn

Spiteful girl is already not having the most pleasant time at primary. Some tolerate her when she's not being spiteful. its not something I take any pleasure in.

and she's good at reasoning. You should try iy Right back atcha Lurked.

I guess the rest of the conversation went

DD: Not Spiteful Girl

You: oh well, if you're not inviting spiteful girl, then we need to kick another four off the list too.

DD:

Pineapple ... I cant be responsible for Bullies learning basic friendship rules of kindness and tolerance - not my job. As I said to DD they will get what they deserve when they deserve it, and whilst they should be taught a lesson, its not her place to teach it. I would exclude them. Not to teach a lesson, not to be spitefull, but because DD didnt want them there.

Thats fine excluding them is part of the lesson and part of life. But some on here insist on inviting the bully or not allowing them to be the only one left out which doesnt help. It hurts the victim and allows the bully to not see the consequences of their behaviour

pineapple well said. judging by some of the posts, it seems those parents that would not invite bullies are being petty, selfish, childish and not showing compassion, in turn making our children that way too.

Thats right itsmine 'right back atcha' really got me. Not sure if it was the originality, the wit or the fact it was such an inspired comeback.
evil yeah soz, I forgot you know both me and dd really well, and are familiar with our usual conversations. Although I can honestly say whilst I still don't agree young kids should make autonomous decisions as a rule, I can see there are exceptions where that may be the most sensible way.
Which bit of that you fancy using for the basis of your great wit evil? And when you decide will you be adding 'I know you are, you said you are, so what am I' on the end?

Not sure why you're choosing to be so unpleasant, Lurked. Your previous (now deleted) posts prove you're just as capable of being nasty and immature.

I disagree with your way of doing things. My DTDs are perfectly happy little girls who know which areas of their life they are able to have more of a say in and which they need to let their parents take the lead.

My point was that you are not really in much of a position to question my ability to reason, as, much as you've pointed out to me, you don't actually know me.

It certainly is a weird thread. Parties seem to cause such trouble and appear to be used to settle scores.

My previous deleted ones were in response to some rather delightful things you posted at me were they not?
I'll hold my hands up and say I can be nasty, and immature and inconsiderate and a bitch at times, but never towards kids or anyone who hasn't done anything to deserve it.
That's great for you, can't say I'm interested in playing one up on who's child is happiest or most balanced, not really my cup of tea.
I'm in a lovely position to question your reason thanks, cast on opposite chair, back propped up in corner, good leg tucked sideways, cat on knee. I appreciate your concern though. It's actually much easier to pick up hints about someones reasoning skills from posts, than to guess at how their conversations with their child go. Basic reasoning 101 innit?

Come on guys we shouldnt be arguing this is a discussion not a slagging match no one can play the better parent card cause there is no such thing we all muddle through as best we can.

As for being nasty to children for no reason no one on here is saying they do that just that they will happiky exclude a child for being nasty and a bully to their own child which is a valid reason

I think you probably need to re-sit "Basic Reasoning 101", and whilst you're at it, have a think about the fact that my opinion differing from yours does not make me wrong, insane, drunk, inconsiderate, immature or a bad parent.

Hope your leg is better soon.

Oh, and what pineapple said.

And no differing opinions doesnt make anyone wrong or nasty or bad parents just different and as i think has already been established in the inclusion of children bit that different is good

Generally the whole class parties are up to year 2, where we are talking very young children- and very few are bullies as such- just children with problems of some sort.
Maybe the problem stems from the school not stopping the bullying, or from the parents not having resolved their own problems of being bullied at school.
The answer appears to be for schools to have an effective anti bullying policy and then everyone could have the whole class party in peace- if that is what they wish.

Small children can be bullies and bully doesnt automatically equal problems. We shouldnt hunt for an excuse for bad behaviour if there isnt one there instead deal with the behaviour and if unfortunately that child ends up being excluded from parties then that is just life

The fact that everyone is arguing and getting unpleasant on here shows that it isn't easy for your average under 11yr old child to get along.
We expect them to be all sweetness and light and yet we can't manage it.

On that note to all. I am off to bed and resolved not to comment further.

Im off to bed too too tired for this discussion right now plus its got heated

I am a bit confused about the bit of parents pushing their own bullying experiences onto their kids ??? I was bullied at school, emotional scars still remain but it doesn't mean I would push that onto my DD. That was my past, not hers. If a bully was targeting her at school (on that basis it was proven), I would expect her not to invite him/her for that reason BUT if she chose to invite still (which knowing my DD she would because she does not hold grudges), whilst I might not like it, I would happily give invite out to said child (and just watch them like a hawk at the party). It would would be sod all to do with school experience I had.

As pineapple said, we all have different views on this, nobody is right and nobody is wrong. Night all

I think the main difference is those that have experience bullying and those that have not. Its tough being the parent of a bullied child. Its tough seeing them unhappy, and not wanting to go to school. Unless youve been there, I dont think you truely understand the depth of hurt. I doubt youll ever understand the devestating consequences which run deeper than a party. These children see no wrong in their actions of enjoying another`s tears.

sally it must be awful :( i don't know how i would cope if it happened to DD (and it still might or god forbid she turns from a placid child to a bully). As you say such devastating consequences. I still bear my emotional scars and probably always will.

I am fortunate my DD has had a far easier time at primary than I ever had. One boy took a dislike to her and picked on her but I wouldnt say it was full on bullying. It was horrible seeing her upset over that and it did bring back memories of my childhood.

Regardless of how when or why, bullying is horrible :(