to be think the head teacher is wrong (TT holiday)

[Thancred]

We've booked a week long holiday for mid-September. I filled in a leave request form at school citing the reasons for the absence. DH can't get any leave until September, they have a lot of term time workers so the year round staff aren't allowed to take more than one or two days off in school holidays unless it's an emergency/sickness. In addition to this we have a DC with ASD who cannot cope with how busy everywhere is in school holidays, even day trips in school holidays are a nightmare if it's somewhere too busy or loud so he ends up miserable or melting down and we have to come home early - a week of that without the option of escaping back home would be horrid for him. So we made the decision that the only way we will get a family holiday is to go in TT when it is quieter and when DH can get the time off work.

We've had a letter back from the head this afternoon and she has rejected it outright. I rang up to discuss it and she has said she does not consider any of it to be a good enough reason. I explained about the ASD issues and her response was "that's life, if xxx can't cope with in the school holidays then don't go".

I've rang the LEA for advice and they've stated that under their guidance it would be classed as exceptional circumstances but they can't overturn the heads decision so we will probably be passed over to them for a fine to be issued.

AIBU to be annoyed at the head? Does anyone know if fines can be appealed once issued?

He'll be in year two. My other children are below legal school age so not an issue for them (thank goodness, I couldn't have this stress multiplied by three!)

Whimsical, that's a good point about LA rules. I'm going to ring then tomorrow and ask what their trigger points are for a fine.

Oh can't quite believe how rude people are! Lovely to see so many judgemental attitudes here. isn't there a saying walk a mile in my shoes before you can tut tut tut about my choices!

AuntyMag10 you seem to think it is going to be work for the teachers to 'catch up' the kids who are on holiday. Does that mean you think that the first time new material is presented all the kids present in the class will get it? No one will be picking their nose and staring out of the window? Or physically present but mentally absent?

I think, and I taught English for a while to adults and kids so have some small idea how people learn, that we (and kids) all learn at different paces. So the teacher will present some stuff, some kids will get it, some will in time, some might never and everything else in between! When Toby/Jonny/Roxanne returns from holiday telling the class about Spanish food or Japanese paper folding or whatever, they may need a few minutes to hear some stuff and I think Ben/Lily/Felix and Abdul will all be listening intently and picking it up with them.

I think that is how good classes work and how kids learn.

I know it will add some disruption, some small amount, but so does kids being off sick, or teachers being sick. In my child's class although she is year 10, when her teacher was sick her class was parceled off to the younger years. No harm done to me or dd but if that happens sometimes then how can we ever feel every moment of education counts. It just doesn't. But it all builds up to how we treat kids, kids whose parents are paying the teachers wages, effectively.

Sorry the post about my son doesn't make total sense as I wrote it. I meant...

That everyone else not knowing where they fitted in would be distressig for him and would be harder for him. For him to join when things had settled and other children knew how it all worked would be better for him, he could slot into things easier - and he did!

OverAndAbove it is not a non-issue if the Op is being fined for something many of us feel is not wrong!

Right Nicki' so they opt out of a few activities. They don't get a free pass for a term time holiday do they?

If they take the entire week off to go on holiday and the school objects that is as much religious discrimination as the disabilism you are so desperately claiming. Actually it is everyone being expected to stick to the same rules.

If the OP's son is having real issues, he needs to be supported in the school. Maybe being taken out at stressful times. Not missing an entire week.

That is your opinion only orange and it is not a particularly well informed one. I have two dc with ASD, I have worked with children with ASD, I have studied ASD at degree level and am hoping to do a masters if I can afford it. With that experience I do not see this term time holiday as a problem given the other information provided by the OP. For some children with ASD, yes it could be problematic, for many it won't be. It's really not helpful to lump ALL dc with ASD together and stick to one particular idea that "works for all children with ASD". I come up against this kind of rigidity daily and it really is very unhelpful and often very damaging to the individual child.

I have the same problem in my job- there are so many of us and not enough annual leave in the holidays! Sad but very true. So, I will undoubtably be on the fine wagon next year with my head held high. Some of my favourite childhood memories are on holidays abroad and I'll be damned before I let a head teacher tell me if I can have a holiday or not after working 3 night shifts every bloody week! My children, my decision.

FWIW I went out of school nearly every year for two weeks up until year 9. I'm still alive, did very well at school/college/uni and have a great job. It's madness!

Pay the fine and go on holiday- think nothing more about it!

It's not rigidity, it's the rules for everyone. You agree to them when you send your child to a particular school

I was an army child. I moved school countless times, more then 10 actually. I often missed periods of education because we weren't actually allowed to start mid term in some of the schools I attended.

I am educated to degree level and had been employed since I was 18, right up until my children were diagnosed and I could no longer work full time.

I taught last year in a school for children with asd. They absolutely agree with you and totally understand that school holidays, esp August are a total no no for lots of autistic children. They authorise for this reason. They have also been known to write to the HTs of nt sibs explaining why. I have a DS who has mild asd. He's not particularly affected by sensory issues at the moment but many others simply cannot cope with crowds and queues at all.
I'd just go. But I'd write to the governors stating your reasons and saying that the LA agreed with you.

nicki it's not about you. And schools have moved on a bit now

That's good to hear itsnot

Just a shame there's not enough special school places to go round and even when you can get one often it's not a suitable fit anyway with the myriad of different presentations in each child with ASD.

Do you know what???
All you lot saying it doesn't matter that the op's husband can't get school holidays off because holidays aren't essential can just fuck off! Really fuck off!

How fucking pious and pompous to tell a mother, one with a child with SN at that, that family holidays aren't essential. For some parents, that family break once a year is all that keeps them going for the other 51. I suppose her washing machine I'd g essential either ax dh's can just make do with a mangle.

This doesn't affect me one jot. My kids are privately educated and my DH can take leave whenever he choses. But the startling lack of empathy here astounds me.

I find it hilarious that missing a week or two at school is going to cause problems with a childs education. My kids missed reception, years 1,2 and 3. They were classed as "home educated" but we never did anything formal with them, played games, read books, had computers with educational games. Caused bad feeling when the first one started school and was ahead of the kids who had been there for four years.

Two weeks isn't going to be a problem and holidays are important for some of us, we all have our own priorities, some people can't wait to get there kids into an education setting at 3 but I wouldn't class it as important but their kids their choice.

Very well said itsnot.

This is so frustrating. When we had DD we took our older child out of school in term time so we could go on holiday in my mat leave. The headteacher authorised it. We said it was a one off as I was a teacher and that year my DH couldn't get time off in term time.
We didn't go abroad. But we did get a family holiday.
It's a shame that good sense is gone. I blame all those people who took advantage and took their kids out time and time again with no regard for anything other than a cheap break.

There doesn't seem to be any consistency. A mum at my son's school went on a term time holiday alone and left her daughter with a relative who lived 200 miles away, so the daughter missed a week of school. No fine given. Bizarre.

OP - sorry about the stick you are getting - most people without an ASD child do not understand what it is like.

We took my son on holiday in the UK last year during the school holidays - it was a complete nightmare and he got so anxious and overwhelmed by the crowds that he could not leave the accommodation. We had to drag him crying to the car and he would meltdown and then refuse to leave the car when we got to wherever we were going. Then spend the day screaming. We ended up going home early.

This year we got permisision to go in term time (DS attends a special school) and it was lovely - he wasn't as stressed and could go out and about. Well at least until it got to the weekend when everywhere was crowded and he refused to leave the accommodation again?

As a family we can't go on holiday during school holidays because of our son's ASD. If we go during TT we can have a holiday - this is the exceptional circumstance or we get no holiday. Disability is a protected characteristic under the Equality Act and people need to make reasonable adjustments.

As for people saying take him somewhere quiet during the holidays - where in the UK is quiet during the school break? My DS can barely leave the car sometimes - how would he get on a boat or a plane. And why should DS's disability relegate us to holidaying the middle of nowhere?

Not read whole thread but our head rejected txt holiday request for children to have holiday with dying father with weeks/possibly months to live, so on that basis I'm not surprised you were rejected.

Just to add I think both should be exceptional and if it were me I would go and accept any fine if it came but I have a bit of a problem with authority.

Shouldof that is absolutely horrendous. I hope you went anyway. I'm so sorry.

How on earth could anyone apply rules are rules to that scenario just beggars belief.

Nicki it wasn't me, but the family did go anyway and they weren't fined, but it did get recorded as unauthorised.

Glad you didn't have to go through that .

Wow your head must be really hard core a bitch.

orangejuice and anyonefortennis ever heard of "reasonable adjustments"? Inclusion (i.e. a child with SN being at mainstream school as opposed to SS) does not mean necessarily being treated exactly the same. Inclusion means accommodating differences.