to be sick of all the 'othering' on these boards?

[BishopBrennansArse]

I've just about had enough of this and I'm going to tell you why.

I'm disabled. My three children are disabled.
I am a member of this forum just as much as any other person here. My thoughts are just as relevant as yours. My family experiences are just as relevant as any other poster on this board.

How dare you tell me my parenting experience isn't relevant? Parents like me despite being a relative minority aren't that few around here. We have just as much right to share our experiences on these boards as everyone else, it is an open forum.

So how dare you tell me I can't post about cuts to disability provision, services and benefits. They are just as relevant as the experiences of the next parent. They have a place on this forum just as much as the opinions of others. How dare you tell me I can't mention experiences I've had with my children in public on 'naughty child' threads? When these things ACTUALLY HAPPEN and I'm trying to present an alternative view.

Yet you use phrases like 'SN brigade'. You tell us it's 'not about disability' when actually in real life yes it is no matter how much you might think it shouldn't be.

Undermining experiences I've had and other families like mine is downright ignorant. It's othering and bigoted.

I will defend my family forever.

How dare you.

I think there is a general issue which is that two groups of people disproportionally use the internets. Firstly, people who for some reason are disenfranchised or excluded from other forms of expression. Could be because of access to other avenues being discriminated against due to disability, poverty or something else. So those groups might find support and friendship online.

The other group is utter, utter twats, trolls and goady fuckers. People who no one in RL will give the time of day to and they have to vent their spleen here.

Or not, just a theory.

YANBU at all. Sorry that you have experienced this. There seem to be some very rude and intolerant people around on MN at the moment.

I have autism and have been flamed for not communicating effectively.

I've been told to get a grip because of my issues and when I'm in a very fragile state.

MNERS - you are not mind readers but would it kill you to err on the side of caution??

I hear you op. Years ago MN was very supportive to anyone living with disability.

I noticed it most in the run up to the election, in fact the below is copied and pasted from a rant I had on a MN Facebook page on the 9th of May:

What the bloody hell has happened to Mumsnet? Where is the sympathy, the empathy, the support, the soldidarity and most importantly when the hell did it become acceptable to be disabilist, sexist and a victim blamer. The election threads are full of posters telling disabled posters, or posters caring for disabled children that they will just have to get a job if their benefits/dla/pip are slashed etc etc. How has it changed so much in just a few short years? I might need to take a little break - I am clearly waaaay to invested lol

The op is right, and telling her she isn't is bollocks. The replies I had to the rant above were all in full agreement. The only issue is that lots of those posters have already left mumsnet because they were so disillusioned. I don't know what the answer is, but I am sure it isn't making sneery remarks about the SN brigade!

MrsTerryPratchett I think you might be on to something there !

People who use 'SN brigade' are really, really unpleasant.

To be honest though I am massively heartened by how many posters with no direct experience of disability do post in support.

There are threads where the wankers just run riot but I regularly now see posts which are supportive and posters who are keen to empathise and understand. There are lots of them.
The wankers just shout loudest - don't forget that. It's pretty heartening sometimes and I think is a truer reflection of the board than the 'bloody hell/pc gorn mad/ you can't say anything these days/Bernard Manning wannabes

The people that get on my nerves are the people who rant on a thread about a child being in nappies, in a buggy, getting more attention than their child, getting something their child didn't, behaving in a certain way.

People suggest the child may have disabilities or Sen of some kind and the poster drones on that the child absolutely didn't.

How do you know? You wouldn't think looking at dd she had issues. In fact only her closest friend and school know.

YANBu

People even get in there in advance with their wee digs in threads, before SN has ever been mentioned:

"the SN brigade will be along in a minute to derail thread"

"Someone will soon come along and mention SN"

"On MN there aren't such a thing as naughty kids but you always have to mention SN"

"Not everything is about SN"

"Here we go again"

People often say 'but we aren't talking about children with SN" as if parents of kids with SN have no right to contribute to the discussion.

I often get the "you always talk about SN" ..I have one child,,with SN. I can see why bishop, whose children also all have SN, doesn't feel welcome here.

I get told I am 'twisting things to fit my own agenda about SN", when generally I am discussing my one child who has SN, and therefore my total experience of children.

People regularly argue against inclusion unless people with SN can fit in with standard behaviour rules. When told some people can't conform we are told 'their rights don't trump other people's"

MN can be a grim place for parents of kids with SN.

As pag said, it is heartening when people speak up in support. But not a lot do. I don't blame them, I CbA with the threads these days either.

Totally avoided the thread about accessible toilets.,knew how it would go when posters immediately started saying 'I use the disabled toilet..this will kick off haha" etc.

For all these reasons, MN can be very "othering"

Even the shitty responses to the OP and lack of willingness to listen to her is part of this.

Definitely YANBU.

I've been on Mumsnet 9 years. I don't use it anywhere near as much.
I do think in the days of Miles for Maude , when trinity lost her dh and such it was a nicer place to be. Now whenever I mention Mumsnet to people they comment how bitchy it is when they take a look.

There's still amazing support her but you have to dig a bit deeper through the crap to find it.

The one that annoys me is someone moans about a persons behaviour, someone says "they might have SN" and the op insists they can't possibly have SN and they're just an arse. You know this...how?

Or they're moaning about something, people with SN explain that it's part of their condition and op says "stop taking it personally I didn't mean YOU". It's like well you sort of did, because looking at me you'd have no idea, judge me quietly and go post on a forum about it

Add message | Report | Message poster Noeuf Tue 30-Jun-15 21:18:53
I don't know I think it's a bit of both tbh. Sometimes people don't want to consider sen or disability as it doesn't fit with their view. Other times Op will post 'dont you just hate it when someone sits right in front of you at the school play when there are loads of other spaces?' And someone will get all huffy and say 'what about me? I'm disabled and I can only sit in (OS REFERENCE) I suppose you think I shouldn't be allowed out?'

Re this post. I think people don't even realise when they are dismissing others life experiences.

Think about it. The person is not being 'huffy'. Their life is that they have to sit somewhere which may cause an issue to others. They probably feel embarrassed and shit about this, especially when reading threads moaning about it, so they post in an attempt to try to make people understand that some people can't help it, in the vague hope they will encounter some understanding when out and about.

Then they are dismissed as 'taking everything personally" and told 'We aren't talking about Sn" probably accused of derailing the thread and get embarrassed and sidelined. Someone will probably mention people 'thinking their rights trump others"

Think about it.

Fanjo exactly! People aren't posting to make it about them, they're trying to explain why someone might do something, so people understand instead of thinking they're being an arse

Everything Fanjo said. I agree with the OP too.

It's also unreasonable to expect posters to constantly behave in a quiet measured way when they feel under attack a lot of the time.

It's breathtaking to me how little empathy people can exhibit and indeed be quite proud about.
I didn't read the disabled loo thread but they always have a poster who will say something like 'well why do they think they don't have to queue - why do they want special treatment?'

If I get up and go out with DD I pick up my handbag, make sure she is ready and we go.

If I go out with DS2 I have to tell him the night before and put it on the calendar. I will probably have to talk about it with him 20+ times. He will want to know the route and which shops we are going to. I will need to work around going to a particular cafe if that is on the agenda. People will stare , possibly laugh at him. If he needs to go to the loo it may well be urgent and I may need to help him.
So it's not fucking special treatment. It's what is needed to allow him to do what most people do without thought or problem.
And he and I have it really easy compared to others.
It's that level of disinterest and thoughtlessness that wears some of us down.

Good posts Fanjo.

II do believe someone was told, when talking about their 18 year old who wets herself if there's a queue for disabled toilet, that she should use a nappy. rather than people not using the disabled toilet if they don't need to.

Fanjo that makes me so angry

The toilet is there for people who are disabled, why on Earth should non disabled people be using it?!

Disabled covers invisible disabilities too by the way, those of you who are going to claim you've "seen" non disabled people use it

I am sure that any digs at people with 'SN', although in the minority, stand out much more if you are actually dealing with it like you are OP and probably feels like a slap in the face each time. On the whole though MNers seem sympathetic.

Love your username!

People are regularly told that it's fine to take a pushchair on the bus in the wheelchair space as 'I never see wheelchair users on bus" or 'they can wait for next space like we all have to' ..completely missing face that there are hundreds of buggy users and if no one folded the wheelchair user would never get on the bus.

Just examples of the breathtaking lack of empathy Pagwatch mentioned.

Then on top of this people take it further by not only dismissing people's experiences but joining together to belittle them and silence them.

Not nice.

Yes everything Pag and Fanjo said.

I commented to someone I know very well not to have SN about them using the disabled toilet causing my SN child to wet themselves. Her answer to was everyone else does it ...
Yes that's kind of the problem!

People are people, with a wide range of experiences, some of which will include experiences of disability. There is a tendency for some on here to try and shut that down. It's unpleasant and unnecessary and MNHQ should do more to get rid of it when it's reported to them.

There was a thread in here a while back about a person featured on a tv programme. A person in real life, who some posters compared to an animal, even going so far as to say they should be 'put down', because of complex and long standing behavioural issues which impacted on their care and supervision in prison. Because they weren't a Sleb who would get lawyers involved it was left to stand. Encouraged to challenge on the thread though. Well whoopee shit. It's the job of all of us to challenge that? Away with you. It really shouldn't be.

'SN Brigade' should be treated as a PA every time.