My abusive husband

[TheWhiteFlag]

I know Mumsnet is fond of LTB, so AIBU to seek your support? Here's my story condensed into bullet-points:

• Children: 3yr old DS and 4yr old DD. I was a SAHM for 4 years until recently when I started work. My wage: 13K. Husbands wage: 42K.
• I've been with my husband for 10 years. During this time he has gradually become more and more abusive: financially (me no access to money, him taking out secret loans), emotionally (gaslighting, putting me down, manipulation, foul name-calling, sometimes in front of the children), physically (manhandling me, stalking me, tracking me with GPS, waterboarding me), and socially (telling the community that I am a slut, making all the parents at the children's school gossip about me).
• 6 months ago my spirit finally broke and I started an affair with someone from work. This new man has treated me with dignity and respect. For the first time I feel valued. Although I've never lived alone in my life I feel I really ought to leave my husband. I can't take any more. After discovering my affair, my husband has really escalated his abuse. Life is unbearable.
• I have started The Freedom Programme after my new therapist referred me. I am finding it harrowing but helpful.
• My parenting: After postnatal depression and years of being criticized and undermined by my husband, my confidence in my parenting has reached rock bottom. I actually went to citizens advice and said the children would be better off with him, that he was the better parent. In my heart, I don't know if this is true. On paper: he is the better parent: he attends all school appointments, he has excellent family support (I have no family), he's a confident parent, and he can provide a better lifestyle (his income is 4x mine and he drives).

My questions for you guys:

• If I leave and find my own place, giving him full custody of the children - what would be the implications of this? Can he force me to take on more childcare than I am able? (I have zero family support and low income). He's suggesting 50/50.
• If I leave the marital home (only his name is on the mortgage) will I still be entitled to the assets upon divorce? What about spousal maintenance?
• What else should I consider?

Op i think you need to come clean about the abuse to his parents.

They will start helping you and listening to you if they realise what you have gone through.

OP - the procedures for social services vary a bit area to area, but in general you can expect that someone will take an overview of the situation. It wouldn't be a bad idea to write down the key points you want to get across, as it can feel pressured in the moment.

If a parent in my area made a call detailing what you have here, they would be referred from the initial call team to the first tier of social services - they would want to assess how immediate and serious the risk was - initially through telephone contact but then pretty quickly by a visit.

I would be extremely surprised long term if the children did not become subject to a child protection plan, but this is a long slow process unfortunately. Social services will definitely see abuse in the home environment as a risk to the children.

I'm really happy to give more information if you want - I just don't want to freak you out by looking too far ahead!

Take at least 50/50 custody - you will get ctc to help with childcare and they are so close to school and that bill coming down. If you find he is abusive to them (and you have more chance of finding out with 50/50 residency) then you will have more for your fight if you need it - the view of you regaining custody after essentially walking out on them will be harder to convince than a parent who has taken 50/50 residency and continued to parent the children.

I left my ex for less than this, took all our stuff whilst he was at work because I didn't want my DC to hear him call me a fat useless cunt ever again. I am speechless at the abuse he has put you through, I wish you strength and happiness - you can do.it and you deserve it.
Please don't leave your DC.

What is a child protection plan?

I am literally terrified for your children, I am in tears. Please get the help you need to not leave them with that man. Please.

It is a plan drawn up by social services, parents/carers, other agencies to make sure children living in risky situations are safe. But as I said, that is something that is a long way in the future, if it pans out that way.

maddening has made a suggestion worth thinking about too. Courts seem keen to give 50/50 where possible and it would allow you to build up your strength and became more confident in your parenting. Most importantly, you're not giving up on them. If you do that, no one will be left to fight their corner when they need it - which they will.

If you leave with the intent of 'explaining it to them when they're older', one of two things will happen. One, they just won't believe you as their father will have thoroughly brainwashed them. Two, they will ask 'if it's true, why on earth did you go and leave us with someone who was capable of that?'

WhiteFlag, a child protection plan is basically a framework, or indeed a plan, drawn up by social services to monitor a child's health and wellbeing. The plan is designed to ensure that the child faces no harm or danger in their environment. It could for example include regular visits by a designated social worker to oversee that all is going well within the home or family unit. It could feature or outline other services and support that a child or family may need to overcome various hurdles. If SS knew about your H's abuse or rather his crime, I doubt they'd think him a 'safe' parent to leave your dc with.

I really urge you to reconsider leaving your dc's behind because you think they'd be better of without you. They won't.

You know what, child protection plans are put in place for your sort of circumstances; a woman who recognises that she needs support with her children. There is support out there that doesn't involve you leaving them behind.

If you leave them behind they will feel abandoned and may not let you back into their lives when they are old enough to act on their own initiative. If you think that your H will bad mouth you to them either way then why make it easier for him?

Even if he doesn't abuse your children he will turn them against you to the point that they won't ever have the type of love and respect that you have for them. That will lead you to a whole new heartbreak. Please, please understand the legal and emotional ramifications of any decision you seek to make before you make it.

If any element of you feeling you can't parent the children is financial, please bear in mind that if the children were with you you should be receiving child maintenance rather than paying it, you would be eligible for child tax credit and working tax credit adding up to about £600 per month (assuming 2 kids), plus child benefit (£134?), plus approx 75% of your childcare costs. You would also most likely receive some housing benefit and council tax benefit. Please get proper advice before deciding that you can't take them with you. Without his abuse you may very well find you are far more relaxed and able to parent much better.

I don't think you would be able to leave the children with their grandparents and keep him from having them unless he was being prosecuted for the abuse.

What financial help would I be entitled to with 50/50 custody on my 13k wage?

Thewhiteflag how about you try leaving with the DC's on the basis that if you have to, and you really can't cope, you could send them to the grandparents later on?
I think once you all leave things will pick up, but the "thought" of it seems too difficult to comprehend. You don't really know what it will be like until you do it, and you're so broken from this man's behaviour that you can only see the negatives.
I doubt you ever will need to send the children to the grandparents but it might help you to think that's an option if needed

Please leave and go to a refuge, gather all paperwork and passwords etc first

We had similar finances to yours and I am doing fine now, you will be surprised and how comfortable you can be, especially if you are used to him controlling access to money

It will be the best thing you ever do, I promise, I have been there. We are all rooting for you xxx

I would say you are the better parent than someone who does what he does op

You have been through so much. My concern is that you probably aren't in the right head space to make such a huge decision regarding your babies. When I was younger my first marriage was abusive. We had two children together. Exh parents helped a lot with childcare. Exh had all of the family support while I had none. My confidence was at an all time low. I very nearly left my beautiful babies with this man as I thought he could give them a better life. So glad I didn't. I ended up struggling for a while, but then I met the most wonderful man, got remarried and had two more children. My dh is now in heaven unfortunately. My eldest two have nothing to do with their father, plus family anymore. They witnessed his abuse on subsequent wives and girlfriends. After my current dh passed away we found ourselves in a refuge. Long story, but bad financial decisions plus a long sickness. Refuges are not bad, you will find support there. Women in similar situations, and staff trained to help you. Services to help you. Life will get back on track for you. Please have some counselling first before deciding.

And waterboarding! That is torture. You need to start keeping a diary of abuse and then go to the police.

I think you're listening a bit now. It's really hard to listen through the noise in your head, the fear and the self-hatred that this man has taught you to believe. You're being kind of amazing to even try and hear through all that

So to summarise:

1. Do not walk out on your children, you will find it extremely difficult to get them back.
2. Stop thinking your abusive, cruel, hideous husband is a better parent than you. He is NOT a good parent
3. You will get support if you
4. Refuges are not terrible places that you need to shield your children from. Especially if you're going to leave them with a very scary man to keep them safe from the shelter.
5. Don't rely on your parents in law will ever advocate for you or protect your children from their son. You see it over & over again, they side with their child, every time. Do try and tell them the truth but don't stake your life on it.

"I'm not a fantastic parent.
I'm poor, depressed and stressed out of my head.
I have zero family support - no parents, nothing."

not fantastic because you've been subjected to severe abuse at the hands of your husband. Without that happening, you will find yourself again and rebuild your life.

Poor? and? that's what benefits are for - tight, but doable. Child Tax Credits help with childcare for after school etc.

Stressed? no shit! ANYone would be, living like you are... breaking free will reduce that immediately; the effects would be felt not long after.

Depressed? see above

zero family support? same as lots of people; get to know your community - Children's Centre, homestart, gingerbread (for single parents), preschool groups; find a hobby and get some adult time to make friends again... it'll happen. I'd recommend the Children's centre as the first port of call, though.

DO NOT believe A WORD that man says. If you left (with the children), you would be supported by every single agency available to you, including Social Services if they received a referral and assessed the children as needing support. Nothing you have said here indicates they'd look down upon you unless you refused to work with them... (IF you were on their books, so to speak - no guarantee that'd happen either)

Regarding him being a "good dad" - he isn't. He is subjecting his children to severe emotional abuse and neglect. That is NOT looked upon well by any agency.

I promise you - he is NOT a good dad, regardless of whether he leaves the children with his parents, buys them all the gifts they want and can afford a car and holidays. Those things do not make life safe for children.

Stability, calm, love, care do .... you can not leave the children with him - he WILL continue to abuse them too. You've been fed a bag of lies for the last x years this behaviour has been going on - and before; grooming you to take the abuse as he ramped it up slowly, invisibly. You can not trust a word the man says - especially when it's about your rights, your responsibilities and your role as mother.

Call the DV 24 hour line - 0808 2000 247 when you're safe and alone to talk to someone about it all.

You can work out here (www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/startcalc.aspx) how much you'd get from tax credits etc.

Please leave and take your children, i promise you wont regret it, you will get by, you will receive help, you will be ok.

I left a similar but not as extreme situation. I was made to believe i was an awful, shit parent, yet my kids are doing fantastic, i don't feel depressed and anxious anymore and life is so much better.

Please don't leave your children with this monster

I have no advice, but I've been there and k just wanted to say I'm sorry you have to go through this.

"What financial help would I be entitled to with 50/50 custody on my 13k wage?"

The 50/50 custody makes no difference at all to tax credits - if child benefit is in your name then you're classed as the resident parent for tax credit purposes.

Could you ask your doctor to sign you off sick with stress for a month so you can take work / Childcare out of the equation while you get yourselves set up. If you remove yourself and the children they will have to house you as an emergency, I know the accommodation may be less than ideal but kids really don't notice that kind of thing as much as you think. Why don't you write down the reasons that you don't feel you can take them with you one by one? And we can try and break down each one and reach a solution, they may be more solvable than you think. You might be making an irreversible decision to leave without them. I imagine your in laws will continue to help with Childcare if they adore the children, purely out of a kindness to the kids if nothing else. My father was an abusive alcoholic and my mother left him when I was 9 (my fathers parents were convinced my mother was an unhinged lunatic) they soon saw differently when my father came to stay with them after losing the house, behaved terribly and refused to leave. Your husband will out himself eventually. My mother was in the midst of a breakdown when she left, in hindsight we were very poor, but I didn't really realise at the time. But I can't tell you the absolute life changing relief of being with my mum on my own, things got so much better so quickly once we were out of that toxic fog. She got work as a cook at a nunnery (we're non religious) but they were very kind to her, we got a nice council flat and a year later went on a magical holiday to stay in a youth hostel in Cornwall. My mum definitely did some basic parenting in the aftermath but the unbearable tension I had been living under was over. My father was a very good looking, charming furniture designer who seemed pretty well off at the time (he was lying on a bed of debts) my mum had no family support and I used to get myself dressed and walk myself to primary school while she did cooking and care work (she left around 5am) and it was all fine. Please take them with you. I know you think you are doing the best for them by not, but that's because you're not free of him yet.

Don't share custody of your children with HIS parents at all.

They may be nice people, but he is their flesh and blood. My BIL was abusive to his wife. He is an abusive and aggressive character, and an alcoholic.

In his mother's eyes though, he could do no wrong. She was a nice person, but very much in denial about him.

Just pointing out that the way could be a gateway to disaster again. Steer clear except for agreed or supervised access.

TheWhiteFlag, please take some time to be just you and your DC, without your H, before you decide if you are good enough to parent them. Nobody could possibly be at their best when living like you have been.

This cloud that you have been living under is so enormous and scary that it is not at all surprising you can't think straight. Imagine how it is for your children living under that same cloud. You have a chance to save yourself and them from it. Just by gathering up a little bit more strength and taking them away. You simply can't leave them to face it alone.

Most importantly, you don't need to plan ahead right now. Just plan for today and (possibly) tomorrow. How to get yourself and your babies away is the only thing that matters. How much benefit you'd get, where you'd live long term, childcare etc can all be sorted later. The priority is getting you and your children somewhere that you can't be hurt anymore. Taking the first step is the hardest part, but it must be done.