Sharing tables in cafés

[Athenaviolet]

I'm genuinely not sure if IABU here.

I was in a cafe today. It was quite busy. Tbh if I'd known it was going to be busy I'd have gone elsewhere. My reason for going wasn't for the food & drink but for somewhere to sit to look up jobs on my phone, take notes etc. I wanted to sit for a couple of hours and it cost £6 for the privilege which I could do with not spending. There's tension in the house atm so don't feel comfortable there.

After I'd finished my sandwich but was still drinking my juice (in a transparent bottle so was obviously not finished) an older man came over to my table and asked if anyone was using the spare seats. I said no because that was the truth but it made me extremely uncomfortable him sitting next to me. I found it really hard to concentrate and left before I otherwise would have. (I have autistic traits so find 'social' situations difficult) I spent the next hour driving about in the rain.

Was he being unreasonable 'invading' my space? I was in his situation the other day and I just stood and waited for a free table. I think this is the polite thing to do.

Could I have said "please don't sit there while I'm still having my order"?

I'm very uncertain in these sort of social dilemmas. Imo when I'm paying (the extra) for a sit in meal part of what I'm paying for is 'the experience' of a table to sit in peace at. If I was just hungry I'd just go to a drive through.

And I'd never dream of asking anybody else if I could sit at their table either.

Somewhere, amongst the 22 pages that this thread takes up, someone has hidden a time machine. Because clearly, we are now back in Victorian times. I am now off to cover the legs of the kitchen table lest DH comes home even more inflamed than usual. What with him almost certainly having to share a seat on the bus with a woman.

Wayne, what if the cafe was clearly busy and there were no spare tables left. Say you were sitting at a table for 4 on your own, and you clearly weren't trying to hold seats for people queuing/going to the toilet etc. Someone comes up to you and politely says "excuse me, sorry to bother you, but would you mind if I sat at the other end of your table, as there are no spare tables anywhere?" You would just say "no" to that? It seems like a perfectly reasonable request to me.

I have had people ask to share tables many times, although i do have at around a decade more coffee shop experience than you though!

I'm not arrogant enough to think I have a right to sit on my own when people are standing.

No, exactly. I'd feel like a right heel sitting in splendid isolation at my table with two chairs while someone ate a sandwich standing up!

Jaleh if you refuse a customer a seat because he's male and say he must sit elsewhere (even if there are no other seats) or leave I'm just wondering where you might stand on gender discrimination.

If it was a table for 4 than I'd say yes but I was thinking if I was on my todd at a small table.

sooty, good question.

In my 29 years of existence (so far) I have never had anyone ask if they can sit at my table in a cafe etc, if they did then I'd think that they lack social awareness and I'm sorry but I'd say no.

So you're sitting in a crowded café and a little old lady with a tray of coffee and cake walks up to you and asks if anyone is using the spare chair at your table and you'd say no?

I don't believe you.

I wonder if Lilac extends her table views to trains?

Dh commutes every day and often comes home steaming because a woman (and he says it always is a woman) has arranged her bag and coat over the adjacent seat and then huffs and puffs and glares when expected to move her stuff. Dh used to be passive aggressive and sigh and look at the seat. Now he just says, "Can I sit down, please?"

Is dh some creep invading a double seat where the incumbant has got there first? He only bought a ticket, not a seat. On the 5.30 from Waterloo people are hanging on by their eyebrows, and there is no possibility of pulling the ethnic/gender/social anxiety card here.

MythicalKings why did you have to bring a sweet little old lady into it! Of course you've made me rethink my entire stance, I'd say yes.

I'm laughing at how the people who would rather a fellow customer try to eat, whilst balancing a tray and drink, stood up, consider the person asking to use an unoccupied seat rude and anti social.

Tough. Put your tray on the floor, then there's plenty of room for a mug and plate

LOL at telling a stranger to put her tray on the floor to accommodate your mug and plate. If I say 'no, I'd rather keep my tray until I've finished thanks' what will you do? Snatch it from me and hurl it onto the floor in a rage?

I'm starting to think many people on this thread are being lighthearted rather than serious. If people behaved like this in real-life every cafe would be a pantomime! Chair-fights, tray-fights, accusations of chairs being reserved for imaginary companions, hysterics over coffee going cold and loud complaints about the unbearable hardships of waiting for a free table... this cafe would be very entertaining if it existed.

I'm not saying table-sharing is wrong if both parties are happy about it. Perhaps it's the norm in the cafes you visit. In the cafes I go to it isn't the norm at all and people respect each other's space. I think we must simply agree to disagree about whether this is a good thing or not... and accept people have different views on cafe manners.

I brought her into it because I'm a sweet little old lady, Wayne

MythicalKings

I have quite a lot of sympathy with Lilac, as I too dislike sharing tables. If I go to a café and the tables are already all occupied, I'll normally turn round and look for somewhere else. If there isn't anywhere else available, I'll join the queue and hope that a table comes free by the time I get to the end of it.

However, if there still isn't a table free by the time I've got my coffee etc, and if there are no signs of anyone leaving imminently, I'm afraid that I will ask someone if I can share. And I suspect I will first look for the single person on a four seater table, because I won't have to sit opposite them and we can happily ignore each other. After that, I suspect I would go for a couple on a four seater table, because again I hope that they'll talk to each other and ignore me while they are there. In the final analysis, it will be the single person on a two seater table. If they are hogging it with their tray, I may politely ask if we could move the tray out of the way on the basis that no-one needs to have their cup and plate on a tray. And sorry, Lilac, but I do feel you're grossly exaggerating in suggesting that that means that I would be in their face or leaning over their food. But, finally, if the person I ask to share with says no I would certainly respect that. And if I get a table on my own and someone asks to share it, I wouldn't say no if there are no empty tables in the café.

For what it's worth, in my experience that seems to be the general attitude taken by café customers, and I can't actually remember ever having come across someone refusing to share a table.

If I say 'no, I'd rather keep my tray until I've finished thanks' what will you do?
You need to be kept isolated from people, seriously. The lengths you are prepared to go to to avoid acting like a sociable human being are mind boggling.

If people behaved like this in real-life every cafe would be a pantomime!
I've never seen it happen as (thankfully) I've never come across anyone as selfish as you.

If the table is that small I will put my coffee on the tray, put my book on the chair, put my tray on the counter, take my book in my hand, and put my backside on the chair!

Icimoi - exactly.

If I by any wild chance asked to share someone's table and they said no, I'd be absolutely crushed. Perhaps Lilac should consider not her own sensibilities, but those of others.

I'm sorry but I'm with you 'you have to share brigade' let's image, no other seats available do you really expect somebody to just stand, holding their tray, letting their food go cold while you have a table for two all to yourself? Let's suppose that person was elderly or disabled, would you really just sit there guarding the spare place? Would you expect somebody else to stand up so they could sit down, or actually, it would be a couple standing if no other spare seats?

For what it's worth I really dislike sharing tables but I'm also not so self important to think this trumps other people's need for a seat.

If you really can't share don't go to cafés or leave if it gets too busy.

Jaleh What if there is nowhere else and you've just sold him a coffee?
Andrew then he has to wait. If she doesn't need the chair he can take it to another part of the cafe. But if she is keeping the seat for her husband or friend I will tell him he must wait for another seat to become free.

What if he doesn't ask, just sits down quietly and takes out a book, making no attempt to talk to the woman?
Is she is ok with this, no problem. But it will upset some women. He can ignore her yes but still he is sitting physically close to her using her table after she said no. He is being disrespectful. If the table is spacious and he is not talking I can suggest he moves up and puts space between them but only if she is not keeping other seats for her family or friends.

Gender and ethnic origin are not irrelevant Andrew. We all need to be respectful to each other and understand cultural differences. Yes both A and B are customers but she arrived first and took the table. We will not force anyone to share a table. Of course if he got the table first and he needs all seats for his friends, he can keep seats until friends arrive. Customers keep seats for others all the time. We'd rather only 1 person of each group joins the queue and others sit, there's not a lot of room if everyone stands in queue.

In all honesty, I think if someone is uncomfortable enough that a person of the opposite sex sitting near them would grievously upset them, they shouldn't go to a busy cafe.

Cultural/religious issues that affect only some people must take second place to EVERYONE'S right to buy food or drink and sit down to eat it (the cost of the food and drink will almost certainly have a 'sitting in tax' built in to it).

I feel really sorry for blokes. I happen to know a few of 'em and they're really not all creeps using a latte and a wrap to bother women in cafes.

What if someone really handsome asked to share your table? Would that be creepy or possibly a jackpot moment? (Unfortunately have to grope back into the mists of time to imagine this scenario...)

Lilac, have you ever considered extending some of the courtesy and bodied ration you appear to demand to other people? Tried honking that their need for a seat at a table is equal to your own and that sharing is actually a pleasant thing to do that does not normally have a negative impact?
I just cannot understand why you feel the need to be deliberately obstructive. It cannot be pleasant to have to go through life with such a negative attitude towards the world in general that you refuse to see how your actions impact on others and only think of your own wants.
Do as you would be done to

Well Jaleh this if she doesn't need the chair he can take it to another part of the cafe is at least a constructive suggestion but this he must wait for another seat to become free is not because that may be another seat where a woman does not want to share a seat with a man!

Gender and ethnic origin are irrelevant: you cannot refuse to provide a service because some of your customers have discriminatory prejudices such as not wanting a person of another gender to share the table. Yes, we need to be respectful, and if there are two empty seats and one of them is at a table where there is a woman in a hijab I will take the other. If the next customer is also a man her luck will run out. This is not one of those countries where gender apartheid is the practice. If I am merely sitting there, having my coffee and reading that is not capable of being offensive from any reasonable standpoint - if she is offended it is JTB.

Jaleh, I'm hoping your cafe isn't in the UK.
That kind of discrimination is illegal.
If you have an eating area then you cannot stop customer A using the only available seat because he is male but you would let customer B sit there because she is female.
Whether or not it is "disrespectful" for a man to sit at the same table as an unrelated woman is irrelevant.
To discriminate on grounds of sex is illegal.