brother invited his long lost daughter on my family holiday (that he isn't going on)

[help14993]

Long story short, my brother has serious boundary problems. Before he has turned up on the beach when my family were on holiday with no accomodation and nowhere to stay, and once found out where we were going a booked a hotel in the same spot.
He's a bit of a loner, doesn't have any friends at all and is very socially awkward. He was married once over 20 years ago and it broke up and he has never seen the daughter since, and fell out massively as didn't pay child support and massive custody rows. He got back in contact a few years ago with her but hasn't seen her as she lives in the USA.
For my daughters 21st we are taking a big trip out to new York (her, her boyfriend my older daughter my husband and I). Without telling us, my brother has invited his daughter along who my children have never met, to go with us and stay. She sent me an email letting me know she would be coming and was very excited
Obviously I have nothing against this girl, she's had a hard life and I don't want to hurt her feelings. My daughters and her are very different, and have never spoken, and will now have to essentially look after her for the holiday, and its likely my brother will now inist on coming himself (which would ruin the trip, none of my family members get along with him he is very very hard work).
I'm so worried this will ruin my daughters 21st, and they are upset as will no longer have the freedom they expected to have as they won't be unkind and leave her with us. I'm sure they'd love to meet her but that just wasn't what this trip was meant to be about. Obviously this is going to be a big thing for her never having met us and could be very angry etc, its just turning into a bit of a circus and I don't know what to do
Wwyd?

But granny that is exactly what the OP's brother is relying on - that she will feel too embarrassed or guilty to say no.

I don't know how old the niece is but I am assuming that if she is old enough to live and travel independently then she will be mature enough to understand the issue once it has been (very gently) explained to her.

If I was the niece I would be mortified to think that I had been played this way by my own twat of a father.

And it's not a family reunion either. The OP and niece have never met.

Your brother is out of order and everything but...

This 'stranger' is your niece AND a cousin to your DD's. Your daughters could strike a relationship with their cousin that will last a lifetime.

"Your daughters could strike a relationship with their cousin that will last a lifetime."

Yes, but they probably wouldn't need the whole of the holiday to do that!

Are you going to make it clear to your niece that this isn't an all expenses paid trip?

If your brother has invited her she might think that she only has the airfare to find.

to have agreed to come along in the first place, she must be quite keen to meet other members of her family and to find some sense of kinship. Yet her motives are queried as being very odd and out of character for a stranger.

See I would check with the actual people going that it was okay before I booked anything.

Mind you I not sure if that is learnt behaviour - both DH and I have family members who think nothing to offering other peoples time, money or accommodation then act put out when the answer is no to their friends.

Indeed have experience of turning up on our annual holiday as a done deal and it does change the dynamic as it's more people and their wants to accommodate.

I really hope she is looking for kinship and isn't in to for a freebee paid for by some else trip - or thinks OP owes her in some way - hopefully she'll be a pleasant young woman looking to make a few connections and fit round the OP and her families plans - and is prepared to shoulder at least some of the costs once in New York.

I think you are being very nice OP - but I would try and get something nailed down otherwise you could well find yourself shouldering costs of another person or even find you end up not doing things you wanted as you try to accommodated another person into your plans.

Yes, you definitely need to make sure finances are clear. I think it could be fun but I would hate to have been put in this situation.

If your brother has boundary issues why do you keep giving him details of your holidays?
My sibs don't have boundary issues but I don't discuss the details of exactly when and where I'm going away with them, often I find out they are on holiday when I get a holiday text from them. Why tell him exactly which hotel you are going to?
I would be telling him that he is never to do anything like this again and is only to invite people to come on holidays with him.
As it's done now I would reassure your daughter whose birthday trip it is that she and her boyfriend can go off and do their own thing at times and you will look after your niece.
It all sounds very bizarre though, especially as your brother has never met his daughter.
You could maybe suggest you just meet up for a day or 2 of the trip and suggest she does her own thing some of the days. Your niece might prefer to have some time to herself as well not feel obliged to hang around with people she doesn't know all weekend

I would have LOVED the fact that my niece wanted to get to know her family, and see it as a complete bonus that we could meet up in New York (wonderful place). Presuming she's of drinking age then she'll be fine to join her cousins in nights out, and I'm sure she'll be happy to slot in to whatever the family plans are, or take some time out by herself.

I speak from the standpoint of someone who was adopted, who has been welcomed into my birth family on numerous occasions - yes sometimes it's a bit awkward, but there's a strong base of familiarity (even having never met) to work from.

I would tell your brother that if he is coming along he needs to book a different hotel if you don't get on with him generally.

It's horribly awkward, isn't it? If I were in the niece's place, and had fully intended to pay my way, to receive an e-mail making it clear that I had to shoulder my part of the costs would make me feel awful and disinclined to want to go. True, she might not have thought/not intended to pay, in which case she'd still be huffy about a "finances" email.

Also, the girl is presumably 19 or 20, and some young people are naive/clueless at that age and don't even think about who is paying for something. I'm not sure I would have at that age although for a New York trip I'd have had some notion of coughing up. But - if the girl's mother is still steaming about sins past then she's probably saying, "Let those Brits pay."

I'd tell everyone the trip is cancelled. And go NC with your brother and tell your father to shove it. It sounds like your brother inherited being a dickhead from his dad.

This holiday is for your daughter.

Cannot believe people think you should have the niece along and pay for it.

WTAF?

I think meeting up is fine, spending the whole holiday with someone you have never met not fine. I would probably phone her and discuss her expectations and financial aspects. I would do this if I planned to go on holiday with someone so I think it definitely needs doing with an unplanned person. She has booked flights and a hotel so is maybe a financially independent adult.

It's ridiculous that her father has invited her to the whole thing rather than just telling her that her Aunt & cousins will be in NY & perhaps some time together could be arranged?

Or giving contact details to OP so that she could contact her niece if she wanted!

It is great that he has thought about his daughter though.

Ok so if you all have resolved to meet her I would email words to the effect what a lovely surprise that you will be in New York the same time etc and send her your itinerary and say that she is welcome to do her own thing whenever she wants
Whey would happen if you tell your brother what for?

OP, are you going to talk to him/her about the financial aspect? Do you know if you're expected to pay for hotels, days out, food etc. If that is the case then you need to tell her that you cannot afford to do that, surely a 21 year old would understand that?

I would message her or contact her saying that she is expected to finance the holiday as you cannot afford it, and see what she says.

Several things op;

1. who is paying for accommodation etc? Ask your brother.
2. is there a chance your brother will decide to come?
3. how did your brother find out?
4. ask your DN where she is staying Unless you've gone into great detail, how does she know?

I'm wondering if your niece has inherited some of your brother's traits.

Anyway, I would let her come along (possibly limiting her stay to a few days if possible at this stage by making some excuse, such as you are staying with friends for part of the holiday who only have X bedrooms), because she has had a hard life. It sounds like everyone has let her down, she has never been allowed to be a family group and shutting her out at this stage would be incredibly cruel. Be the bigger person and reach out to her.

Then someone really needs to give your brother a rollicking about his behaviour. This should have happened years ago, when he abandoned his daughter. His behaviour is absolutely appalling.

I know that if I cause any fuss on this my father and brother will act like I had made my brother loose his daughter forever and I will never be forgiven for it

So is that of your father. What should have been the bigger issue years ago is the irresponsible idiot that your brother has become, and what sounds like your father's enabling behaviour. Does no-one ever stand up to these men, or do they simply get away with what sounds like juvenile delinquent behaviour extended into adulthood? Is there any problem about "not being forgiven" by this pair of idiots?

I'm not sure why everyone thinks the niece is expecting to have everything paid for. She has bought her own flight tickets, maybe she has booked a hotel as well. OP can easily ask her, "Are you planning on booking a room at the same hotel as us?"

I think you need to contact your niece directly if at all possible.

Tell her, that whilst it will be LOVELY to meet her, your brother has sprung the whole thing on you - which is how he tends to be, in general! Be welcoming, friendly and jovial but quite clear that your brother is not a person who thinks ahead.

Tell her it is a 21st trip for your Dd which you have saved long and hard for. Ask her if her DAD has made sure she has enough to cover her expenses, as though you'd love to take her for a special day out, you cant fund her whole trip sadly.

You need to let her know her Dad has been an idiot (gently!) and somehow not let this get in the way of YOUR potential relationship with her (which might be the only reliable one she gets from your family, by the sounds of it).

I feel sorry for her, I feel sorry for YOU being put in this situation, I feel with your brother who wants (YOU!) to pick his Dd up like a toy for a trip after her whole life being raised by someone else and him not even contributing £ yet alone being a proper father. Idiot!

Blimey, why on earth do you tell your brother anything at all? After the first time he gatecrashed your holiday, I wouldn't have told him anything and wouldn't tell my parents either if they were passing on the information to him.

I agree with the PP who said it sounds as though your niece has some of your brother's characteristics. Who on earth would write an email like that when they hadn't been invited by the person?

I would email back saying your brother had made a mistake and had heard you all saying you would like to go to NY but unfortunately you can't afford it. However, if she would like to come over to the UK for a holiday some time, she would be very welcome to stay with you and you'd take her around and show her the sights.

If by any chance your brother has actually emailed bookings/flight details etc (and how would he get hold of them?) then I would say DD1 has chicken pox and the trip is going to be cancelled.

Email the girl back and explain that there must have been a misunderstanding somehow, and it will not be possible for her to join you on the trip this time. Invite her for a day or something when you are back.

I am SURE that 99.9% of the world's population would not expect that they are being invited on this trip to NYC when they have never actually met, so I am sure that this girl will understand this.

It would be MUCH better all round if are all are given the space to get to know each other but at your own pace, not flung together on a holiday - which is often fraught with close families, let alone strangers.

I know that if I cause any fuss on this my father and brother will act like I had made my brother lose his daughter forever and I will never be forgiven for it

DO tell them BOTH to FTFO, eh? they have no-one to blame but themselves

"Who on earth would write an email like that when they hadn't been invited by the person?"

Could be that she is like her father, or that he has said that this is where your Aunt, Uncle & cousins will be & they'd love for you to join them & that she has no reason to disbelieve that.

Tbh, I would have emailed back & said that I had no clue what she was on about & taken it from there!

I certainly wouldn't invite her on this holiday. It will only cause resentment. Have a lovely holiday but invite her to your house at another time.