about HV reporting me to GP

[spectral]

I took DD to her 2-year development check last week. It was at 1pm, which I wasn't thrilled about as dd is normally asleep then and that's important work time for me, but I didn't have much faith in the possibility of rescheduling again, as we'd initially had a letter making an appointment for a date already in the past. I turned up on time with a completed copy of the development questionnaire and a very sleepy DD.

HV went through the questionnaire asking each question again, word-for-word. About five minutes in she said I seemed 'stressed' and asked why; I told her that DD really needed a sleep, that I really needed the time to work, and that I wasn't sure why I had bothered to fill out the questionnaire in advance if we were going to go through it again word-for-word. Appointment went a bit faster after that; I said that I would ask for help if I thought dd needed it, but that we had no concerns whatsoever about her development. HV agreed no concerns. DD didn't want to cooperate with being weighed and measured, but HV said she looked pretty 'in proportion' so it didn't really matter, and appointment ended by mutual agreement.

Six days later I get a phone call from DD's GP saying he's had an email from HV about me and is 'calling out of a duty of care to a child' -- so clearly not a friendly call just to check everything's ok. I told him about the conversation I had at HV appointment, explained again why I might have seemed stressed, but that that HV had not indicated to me that she might have grounds for passing anything on. I pressed him to say whether there was anything out of the ordinary going on, and he said no, and I decided to be honest with him and say that I was very unhappy (ok, I actually said furious) that HV had decided to report me to my daughter's GP.

I am utterly freaked out, though. I adore DD and do my best for her, as does DH, and I think we are doing ok. I did express a negative opinion about the way the appointment was organised, but I think that should be allowed! What on earth is going on?

I'd leave it now

But YANBU and iiwy I'd not bother with the HV again.

Honestly, you're coming across as quite stressed and agitated in your OP and subsequent replies. Even a week later.
So I can see where the HV is coming from.

If the time was a problem, you could have just changed it.

You seem unnecessarily irritated about the letter with a past date - so what? It was a mistake. Why the big deal? Why so scathing of their ability to make another appointment?

As for going through the questionnaire... Why so angry? Of course she went through it. Otherwise you could just post it! The purpose of the questionnaire is to give you a chance to think through the questions and not be put on the spot - and give the meeting structure.

You said yourself she speeded up when asked!

If you were as prickly in the meeting then I can see why the HV might have been concerned. In a good way - getting you support.

If you don't need it, fine. Just say "thanks for the call GP, that was a tricky appointment timing for me - but yes, everything's fine".

As has been said before there are too many vengeful mini Hitler abusing the CP system.

The HV was clearly not happy at receiving criticism.

Thins are getting silly now and it's become like those who Witch hunted in years gone by.

Why the angst at a hv who expressed concern about someone who is by her own admission under pressure... if she did not pass on concerns and op did happen to have depression or needed any kind of support and did not get it .... how many would then be on her case about not caring or mussing signs she should have passed on to help op.... or god forbid op then became so depressed or ill that child suffered. HP are dammed if they do and damned if they don't ... they are not clairvoyant they can only make judgement calls and hope they get it right. They do not get up in the morning wondering which poor mum to pick on today

Well all the HV achieved was causing stress and anger towards a family who were doing fine until the HV used CP to weird her power over someone wanting to get a tired dc to bed and get on with work.

I'd be annoyed at the call too.

From the outside looking in though, it does sound more like a breakdown of communications between you and the HV, rather than anything else.

Always best to change an appointment if the time isn't going to suit.

She was doing her job. You needed to be doi g yours due to the deadline and your child was tired and cranky ...... and never the twain shall meet. It happens.

You may well hear nothing further. Let it go. It was just a precautionary call I should think.

I disagree I have heard too many tales of professionals abusing cp and harming innocent families, the more it happens the bigger the backlash which in some communities is quite high.

The cheek of these professionals then who expect families to suck it up.

I think YANBU to be pissed off; but try to turn it around and think "well if there had been something amiss, at least she tried to do something about it" rather than going all offended about it.

I wouldn't have been happy either, tbh - but they do have a job to do and that includes not taking everything the mother says at face value, as that can lead to people falling through the cracks.

As an extreme (VERY extreme) example of this, a mother who was developing post-natal psychosis decided that she no longer needed help with her baby, she was coping fine and could do it on her own, so the help she had been using was dismissed. Unfortunately, the post-natal psychosis then kicked in massively and it had a very sad outcome for the woman. Could potentially have been avoided IF the GP/HV had spotted the symptoms sooner.

What a joke.

I only have my own (fairly severe) MH issues/knowledge here, but I would have thought only a tiny % of those needing help present as snippy and stressed. Depression et al tends to make you down on yourself - overly compliant rather than asserting your rights. MH issues rarly present as anger (I would have thought especially in women?)

So yes, I would be super pissed off at this treatment, if she genuinely did think you were struggling it may just be proof of her incompetence at spotting true MH signs.

Alternately I can see that being very defensive might be a sign of child abuse? But if that's the avenue she was trying to go down the GP clearly fucked that up by telling you you'd been referred and then deciding your DP was 'a good sort'. Brilliant duty of care being exercised there...

She sounds like an idiot. Try and forget about it!

What kind of messed up system causes a devistated of harm to families Who are then not "allowed " to feel justifiably pissed of?

You people are brainwashed and can't see how fuckers up cp has become.

You do know they are using the same methods for cp witch hunts they use to get Armed services to kill?

They discovered armed services get messed up mentally by killing the enemy so they told them they were protectors to get them to do the unthinkable.

CP trains professionals to destroy families in the same way. I don't think it was set up with that intention. Nobody seems to question it you walk around like a bunch of robots repeating phrases hurting people like a bunch of weirdos.

Forgive me I was wrongly accused and cleared as are many in my community, meaning health condition community.

In trying to come to terms with being collateral damage I am trying to understand, which helps me.

The way I see it, is you are going to have damaged families, damaged relationships between professionals and families and damaged professionals.

It strikes me you are being brainwashed like in a cult to go out of your comfort zone as the armed forces are in their case to kill or maim.

You are being taught you are "hero's" "safeguarding" and "protecting" , when in reality that is not always the case. You are "harming" vulnerable Innocents. This happens due to human error, human projection, coverups of mistakes, trying to feel superior to others to boost your ego, personal grudges, misunderstandings and as with Witch hunts in the past group at times cult hysteria.

I am sure I will be called all sorts and make you feel angry pointing this out. That anger deep down is you knowing you have been brainwashed and you hurt innocents and make them Collateral damage. The more you do this the more you will have more families like op hold mirrors up to you and show you, you are not hero's.

I suggest you yourselves question CP you are being given yourselves.

I think everyone working in child protection dreads being the professional who misses the signs in a future child abuse case, and especially a very public case. This can make them ultra-cautious, indeed I am not sure it is worthwhile for them to apply common sense, rather than just rigidly follow the guidelines.

It isn't clear to me why you accepted an appointment that really wasn't convenient to you when there was no urgency, and I think it may not have been clear to the HV either. It may have seemed that your issue was having to attend at all, rather than the timing issue. Also it seems you told her you had been planning to disengage from the service anyway. So this raises the spectre of the parent who is trying to hide issues from health professionals.

You were quite annoyed and told her so quite clearly. Probably unlike many mothers, who would probably be irritated at most, after all these appointments are quite short and over soon. Which raises the possibility of defensive anger, deflecting issues and temper issues, though you are probably just an assertive woman who is used to saying what she thinks.

If she takes you at your word and gets it wrong, it is her neck on the line. She probably knows that there is nothing untoward about your care of your child, but it is probably not sensible from her point of view not to robotically follow the guidelines.

She passes on her concerns and discharges her responsibility, especially if you are going to disengage from the health visitors. Or she may be being vindictive. We'll never know, but she can certainly justify her actions if necessary. Telling the GP you are furious and writing letters will bring you more scrutiny, not less.

Unfortunately even when executed perfectly, and of course with human beings involved it often is not, child protection does incur collateral damage. I don't think anyone would dispute that JoanHickson. And even though there are cases where power is abused or there are very odd priorities and decisions by Social Services, it doesn't change my opinion that there isn't a better system to protect children other than by putting families under scrutiny. This always causes an enormous amount of stress and pain whether there is abuse or not.

I think that as a parent it is easiest to play the game. Be open and accessible, and try not to bring yourself to anyone's attention. Which sounds awful, because that is probably what the deliberate abusers are doing, but if you flag up concerns it can be difficult for professionals to ignore in the current culture.

If health visitors reported concerns about all stressed parents then the NHS would collapse under the weight of unnecessary referrals. It's utterly inappropriate. It might be different if the NHS could actually offer support to people coping with stress or anxiety but even very sick people fall through the net. So what if you were stressed - what on earth does anyone think the GP was going to do about it?

I think you were right to express your anger to your GP. I think too many people are prepared accept poor service so as not to rock the boat and because it's important to "play the game" (what a ridiculous idea).

So she seems someone who is obviously stressed and is seemingly a bit agitated. This person also tells her she is going to disengage with the service.

Too right she should pass on her concerns to a medical proffessional that will still be involved in the families care. I be quite concerned if the HV hasn't flagged up her concerns.

Cabrinha - I totally agree with you. Joan Hickson, I see that you have had some difficult experiences but your posts comparing CP training to preparation for torture are total nonsense. Nobody trains to destroy families, in the first instance the emphasis is to keep the families together, but sometimes there are people who struggle too much to keep their kids safe, sometimes there are downright nasty people who want to do harm. And keeping kids in that situation is damaging for those children and generations beyond.

There is expressing unhappiness with the referral and there is being 'furious' and saying so.

I personally would not want to bring myself to the attention of Social Services because if reports are to be believed they do sometimes latch on when you least expect it, and their investigations can be traumatic, even for the completely blameless. I wouldn't be shouting my unconventional views from the rooftops or being obstructive even when I think they are being a bit intrusive without good reason. I'd just not rather let a minor situation turn into a full-blown investigation. Other people can approach situations differently but that's my view.

There is something very Orwellian in the way that you become suspicious if you voice your disatisifaction, but above suspicion if you are compliant. Being unhappy with a service is not the same not supporting the ethos of the service. I have heard of many cases of parents attempting to disengage with health services being seen as a sign of concern, sometimes to disastrous consequences. As an earlier poster said none wants a child abuse case to slip through on their watch. It means a robotic job's worth mentality replaces common sense. Makes me shiver.

What charlestonchaplin said. It sounded like you were just a bit rude. You should have rescheduled.

Why were you even there? 2 year checks were phased out here about 20 years ago. Was there some particular reason you were singled out fora two year check? Or are they still going on in some places?

I think by getting so worked up over nap time and work when those appointments last no more then an hour you have been rude.

Don't know why she asked the gp to call though. Just is an even bigger waste of their time really.

Maybe it was just the two year old still needing a nap thing? Although not very unusual.

YABU. She was just doing her job. You sound very highly strung tbh. That would probably have set alarm bells ringing.

She is just doing her job but she should have discussed her concerns with you and informed you she was passing it on. You could complain/ask to see your records but personally I'd just leave it.

She was just doing her job but I agree their appointment system is rubbish and they seem very inflexible.
I got sent an appointment for DD's 12 month check on my first day back at work. I phoned well in advance to change it and was told they had no appointments for the next 2 months and if we didn't attend SS,would be informed. She suggested I went back to work later so she was obviously unaware that you have to give 28 days notice to do that. Then she suggested I took a day's annual leave. I explained I can't do that as I'm a teacher but that I could go in half term. She couldn't do that as she was going away. In the end DH took the day off to attend. She was very sympathetic that he had had to take time off and told him he should have changed the appointment ffs! So yes I do get why you are annoyed!