To not want DD to have play-dates or attend parties in certain areas due to safety concerns?

[HourOrTwo]

She is 7. Until now she only has playdates with friends whose parents we know well, but now she has a bigger group of friends. Some of these friends live on local council estates. One of these estates has a particularly bad reputation (drug problems, unemployment, high crime rate). When I drove through it recently I noticed kids playing out in street, groups of youths standing around smoking and drinking, big dogs in studded collars roaming around (no muzzles), rubbish everywhere etc. I don't mean to sound judgemental but it's not the sort of place we want DD playing or walking around.

We're happy for DD's friends to come play at ours, and we want her to socialise with children from social different backgrounds... but recently she's been invited on several play-dates on these estates plus a party. So far I've made excuses, as I don't want her playing out unsupervised and TBH don't like her going to houses unless I know the parents and trust them to keep a close eye on her. Even if I chatted to these mums at school gates and they promise to supervise, I don't want her going to houses where anyone is smoking, drinking or teenage siblings are coming in and out with their mates, or any household with a dangerous dog (there are a lot of pitbulls and rottweilers on the estate), but I can't really ask this.

How do we politely decline these play-dates without offending anyone? Is there a way we can have DD's friends at our house without her going to their houses? And what do I tell DD, without mentioning it's because of the area her friends live?

YABU. My best friends growing up lived in less desirable areas than I did with high crime rates etc. I didn't have many friends and if my mum had been snobby about me visiting the ones I did have then I would have been very lonely. I don't see the problem with playdates if they are properly supervised and you trust the parents.

I think the OP is getting an unfairly harsh response here. She is just anxious for her child's safety. She clearly isn't familar with this kind of environment. If you are familiar with it and think her fears are groundless, how about some advice or reassurance?

I don't have much advice except try to get to know the parents who have invited her, it may reassure you to actually talk to them.

Charis post is interesting.

I think the OP is getting a harsh response partly because she keeps changing her story. She said in one post that she was concerned about teenagers drinking and partying in the house, then a few minutes later said she wasn't worried about teenagers drinking in the house, just about the fact that there would be people nearby, out in the street, who might have alcohol problems. And she said she was concerned about the area then backtracked and said that it wasn't the area, it was the fact that she didn't know the families well enough.

It is hard to be sure what exactly the concerns are, and the initial post unfortunately implied that the main problem was not liking the area.

YABU and a massive snob.
Try bothering to get to know the parents, or do you not speak to people who are not naice?

The only thing I would be concerned about is the dogs, but idiots who can't control their dog yet insist he's an angel who wouldn't hurt a fly exist in all social backgrounds.

Some of these friends live on local council estates. One of these estates has a particularly bad reputation (drug problems, unemployment, high crime rate). When I drove through it recently I noticed kids playing out in street, groups of youths standing around smoking and drinking, big dogs in studded collars roaming around (no muzzles), rubbish everywhere etc. I don't mean to sound judgemental but it's not the sort of place we want DD playing or walking around

Sounds exactly like where I grew up. And I had friends from other areas who weren't allowed to come over, and who told me exactly why (you might think you're being 'tactful', but believe me your child won't be). And it hurt and still hurts a bit when I think about it although not too much given I got into a better university and earned better degrees than any of the PFBs in question

Maybe invite those girls back to yours first?
I know it has been said (me included) that you are being irrational. I thinking though, the future has to change - and you could do that! :)
Invite the girls back, that way you can meet the mums and get to know them better.
Like (and l am sure you know) odd balls live everywhere.
I am surrounded by middle class mums who seem to be out doing themselves with 'who can be the most laid back with their parenting' crap.
That isn't much fun either, especially when your daughter is regularly invited for tea.
I let her go though, as we live in a tiny village.
I think you'll try and fix this.
Best of luck sorting it all out. :)

Someone, somewhere in South Kensington is worrying about that playdate with little George. The MIL has some nasty snappy corgis, Ggranny liked her gin and betting on the horses, and there is also a dubious older great uncle.

I said the thing about teenagers and corrected it, not OP. I forgot to put a paragraph break so it looked like I meant the teenagers were high/drunk not people in street.

I agree with Charis and Debbie, people are being very harsh on OP and being very judgemental of her. She hasn't said parents are irresponsible because they live on council estate, she is worried about DD playing out in an area with a drug problem and high crime rate. If she was a snob she wouldn't have had DD's friends for play dates, invited their mums in for coffee or attempted to chat to their mums in playground (who snubbed her).

Reading some of the responses to OP, it's other people who are being judgey and making assumptions on this thread! Why is ok to make fun of 'yummy mummys' or the 'Princess Di' way other mums hug their kids after school? That's so petty and mean. No wonder there's a social divide, if mums from council estates automatically assume everyone else is a 'snob' who is looking down on them! If you live in an area with a bad reputation you need to reassure parents their DC will be safe and supervised.

It sounds like OP made an effort to connect with the mums and get to know them, but they rejected her and have their own clique that she is excluded from.

I chat to anyone at school gates, whether they are mums I know well or not. How 'posh' they are is irrelevant. If my DSC was invited to a play date id want to get to know mum a bit first. If someone wasn't prepared to chat, snubbed me or had very different parenting style to me (eg believed in letting kids roam unsupervised) I wouldn't accept the play date. My child's safety is more important than not offending someone.

I grew up on a very rough council estate. Many of the families, including mine, were very respectable. My father drummed good table manners into us and we very well behaved.
There is nothing wrong with saying you don't want your child playing out on a playdate. But you are wrong to judge families based on where they live.

" I've tried striking up conversation in past but feel like they are uncomfortable and don't want to talk to me."

DS1 is 9 and has friends from all kinds of backgrounds now he's moved up to junior school. I just let him get on with it and am friendly enough that the first time he's visited friend's houses I've stayed for a cuppa and ended up gassing for hours. It's not rocket science, starting up a conversation with someone from a different background than you.

I grew up in foster care for 10 years, and lived on council estates during that time. I had kids say to me "my Mum says I'm not to play with you, you're weird, you don't have a family" and I'll be fucked if my kids are going to be allowed or encouraged to be such asshats. Some of my very best friends come from all kinds of walks of life; the fact that we're now considered a nice middle-class family in a leafy suburb doesn't mean we're better or different.

Your judgements of unknown families is harsh at best. Chat to the parents, get to know them. Deal with the fact that you're a snob and do your best to make sure your DD doesn't grow up the same way.

TooManyMochas I know exactly how you feel. I grew up on a sink council estate but (as I passed the 11 plus) I went to a school where a lot of my classmates were from far smarter postcodes. Friends not being able to come to my house because of where it was (and in some cases being discouraged from associating with me because of where I lived) sucked.

I would hate even the suggestion that my DCs should not spend time with certain friends because of where they lived my older DCs chose to reverse commute into Wembley (from rural Buckinghamshire) for school and spent their teenage years roaming around Harlsden and Stonebridge Park, when many teenagers local to us would not have been into London on their own.

Maybe the Op is getting harsh responses because some of us live on council estates. Hard to imagine that we are the same as you in your nice MC semis I know.

The fact the OP wouldn't let her child play at my house because of where I live is going to offend me no matter how you dress it up.

BTW , the biggest druggies and the loudest parties my kids know, live in the most affluent area of my town.

Also please don't call my kids council estate kids, that's fucking offensive as well.

I agree usual and also the assumption that as we live on council estates we don't look after our kids properly. Massive insult.

Either I've missed one of OP's posts or I'm not reading between the lines enough, but I can't find anywhere she assumes parents on council estates don't look after their kids properly, or have loud parties with drugs, or are not respectable. She listed things she has SEEN when driving through the estates. I too would be concerned about my DSC playing out in an place where there are people drinking, smoking and hanging out on streets, or an area that is notorious for crime and drug problems. I wouldn't stop them having friends there because of area but I'd only let them go on play dates to families I know and trust.

I live in rural area, and mums not used to it sometimes have concerns about their DC's safety here. I reassure them their DC will not be allowed to roam in fields/woods/farmland without an adult, and that I'll keep an eye on them around deep pond in garden and in tree-house. Also I reassure them our dog is good with kids and very well-trained but offer to keep dog chained up if DC is scared of dogs. A bit of reassurance is necessary when child is going to play in a new environment. I would never take offence if parents have questions about how I will keep their child safe.

Caspian that's what happens on MN. Lets just take the OP and add to remove things said so we can skate the OP.

She said she felt uncomfortable because of what she'd seen.

How ridiculous.

No lets give the OP a hard time because she doesn't want her MC child to mix with the plebs.

Yes the parties and drunk kids are the kids from affluent families police officers children social workers children that is off the top of my head is that ok because they dont have pitbulls and are not allowed out to hang about. The way these parents allow their kids behave is a disgrace but as long as they do well in school and pass their music exams its fine,

YABVU and really rather stuck up.

DH is from a rough council estate. His family are much more civilised and polite than my toxic family who all live in naice areas.

Even if I chatted to these mums at school gates and they promise to supervise, I don't want her going to houses where anyone is smoking, drinking or teenage siblings are coming in and out with their mates, or any household with a dangerous dog (there are a lot of pitbulls and rottweilers on the estate), but I can't really ask this.

OP, if your DD went to a middle class child's home with a nicer postcode for a play date, would you ask their parents if they drink, smoke in the house, have a dangerous dog or have teenagers with their mates coming in and out of the house?
Or is it just the council estate parents that you worry may do these things?

You can ask them to make sure the kids are supervised, as you say, so that's not really the issue is it. Do you think they're going to use your DD as dog bait or blow smoke in the kids faces?
If you make it clear you don't want your DD playing out in the streets unsupervised, because of her age (which I don't think is unreasonable, some children and parents are ready for this earlier than others) and they accept this and understand your worries about it then I don't really see what your problem is. I think you're being a little overprotective of her, and assuming the very worst about families on council estates. Find out what they're like, then make your judgements.

I live in a rough, largely council area. We can afford a much bigger house here and DS is at a great school here from when we lived on the outskirts of the area. We needed to move and didn't want to move him schools so we ended up buying further in the area.

I have made some friends here and the ones from the school who live in this area (it's a faith school so many of the kids don't live around here) are ok. However I have to walk past one of the other schools to get to ours and I wouldn't send my kids there is you paid me. They are largely as rough as a badgers arse. One day I left my house to see 3 mums screaming in each others faces swearing like mad. From what I later heard they started fighting just after. 2 of them had prams. My dd goes to the local nursery as ds went there and the staff are lovely but if it wasn't for the staff I would never send my children there. The police had to be phoned once because of fighting inside the nursery corridor. Luckily a day we weren't there.

There are local shops which are really convenient, we have built up a life here and I have good neighbours but I can't deny that I'd be happy with sending my children to some of the peoples houses around here as I just wouldn't.

YANBU, I would not want my 7 year old playing out (ds is 7) and as you know they are allowed to play out unsupervised that is a good enough reason to say no.

OP, I can completely understand your concerns. Statistically children of lower socioeconomic groups have a poorer academic outcome. This is surely in part due to poor parenting.

My son has a new teacher who has previously worked in a rough neighbourhood, and she has commented that the children in our village just have to worry about learning, and don't need to be concerned about their safety, their next meal, overcrowding, learning the language, dealing with attitudes regarding gender, sex or nationality,...

Having grown up in an inner city neighbourhood with a bad reputation, a certain knowledge of the neighbourhood was required to be safe. People who live there, know this. But despite appearances there were lots of great people in this neighbourhood too. Please get to know the parents, rather than judge the neighbourhood alone.

To those who currently live on council estates, would you choose to live there if you could simply wish to live somewhere else or would you honestly consider it the best possible environment for your children? I grew up in the environment I did because it was what my family could afford. My parents would certainly have preferred the nice, leafy neighbourhood on the other side of the tracks. The prejudice against my neighbourhood was not unfounded.

Council estates are always rough on MN.

Snobbery at it's finest.

Yes I would and do choose to live here.

I wouldn't choose to live near you though Tulip.