to wonder why you think I care about your marital status?

[JessieMcJessie]

I've just received an email from the personal assistant to someone I am meeting later today. Her standard signature at the bottom of the e-mail (name changed of course) is

Mrs Brenda Jones

I sometimes see communications from other women signed off "Brenda Jones (Mrs)"

Why on earth do people do this? Do any of you do this?

NB although her name is not really Brenda, it was an unmistakeably female name, so it wasn't to stop any confusion about her gender. And I myself have a unisex first name but I still never put Mrs on my letters or emails (nor Miss before I was married).

I suppose it's just old fashioned but how awful that society ever thought that marital status and ability to do a job were in any way connected.

Bilberrycrumble

in my line of work it wouldn't generally be taken well to respond on first name terms to someone you've never corresponded with before.

Do you work with lots of old people?

I have a definitely female name and someone once responded to correspondence with "Mr/Ms Jazzle37". I was a bit confused by that...maybe I should have specified.

I sign off/introduce with my first name and surname, although this once led to a very irate service user telling me I should use my full given name, not a shortened one...unfortunately the short version is my full name.

I confess to using Ms as a default if title not known. Maybe one title would be easier, administratively.

Jazzle - or no titles at all?

Really Jackie

I don't recall a time I have ever felt judged by my marital status. I've even been hit on!

And Dragons is right. Imposing one title would be taking away the choice from those of us who don't mind being called a Mrs.

I'm happily married and prefer to use Ms, or just my first name+ surname in a professional capacity a long time ago. It's just what I prefer, but it seems to really get some people's backs up that I don't use Mrs (including my brother, who bangs on about it all the time).

What does it matter? My husband's title doesn't proclaim his marital status, why should mine? I don't get it

Why should you get that choice, though? Men don't, so the choice is kinda being sexist, isn't it?

And Ms is just shite. Probably used by women who are married but get all weird about it when asked if they are.

Ms is used by both married and unmarried women who choose to use it as they consider their marital status is not relevant to others.

I believe it is also frequently the accepted title used in American business settings.

I use Ms. I've been with DP for 28 years and use it because my (non) marital status is simply no one else's business.

Problem is, is that so many organisations are still sticking to outmoded conventions.

DP's driving licence doesn't have a title on it for him. Mine does, so I've sent in the forms to remove the title if possible, or to ensure it's Ms if not (and I don't see why not if titles are not added for men).

Jessie yes I do work with older people and also some very formal people within Government. Dear Mr/Miss/Ms is I see it a basic courtesy. If someone has emailed me with 'Dear Bilberry' or 'Hi Bilberry' I'll respond in kind. Or if it's obvious a less formal response is required.

This will change and is changing quite rapidly. But it's best to adapt your style to your audience.

And Ms is just shite. Probably used by women who are married but get all weird about it when asked if they are.

This opinion is shite in my opinion.

I dunno. It does reveal a fascinating thought process, that opinion. Like there are thousands of women who're part of a covert plan to fuck with everyone else's mental composure by deliberately getting married then pretending not to be. Just for the sake of it.

Sexist? Honestly? It never occurred to me not to use Mrs as a title when I got married.

I could not give it a Fuck if it sexist tbh. So I get a choice and a man doesn't. So what!

And could you see any man caring about that? Don't think I can.

Well, I don't generally decide what to care about based on what men might think. I do my own thinking.

And that's your opinion Nolim and you more than entitled to it.

Lets agree to that.

FryOne is that really true about driving licences? I always assumed that they had a title so that the authorities could double check you were the licence holder, so naturally I assumed that men's said "Mr". Shocking.

Bilberry I work in a very traditional profession but it really is not seen as informal to address someone by their first name. So emails begin "Dear Bilberry," or just "Bilberry,". I am pretty senior but I would not expect anyone, from the receptionist to the cleaner to my trainee to email me with "Dear Ms McJessie" or address me as "Ms McJessie".

However your example reminded me that I do sometimes get junior colleagues starting emails with "Hi Jessie" and I really object to that (though would only tell them not to if they were addressing a client like that). But maybe in 20 years' time "Hi Jessie" will be considered perfectly formal and polite and I'll be the old gimmer feeling offended .

Jeanne I didn't say that being a Mrs indicates intelligence, more that it's up to intelligent educated women to choose how they're addressed, whether it's Mrs, Ms or Bob - it's nobody else's choice to make but their own.

er, because they use that title in something they wrote to me, so they are obviously telling me this information for a reason?

They did that because they wish to use the title. They don't give a damn whether or not you approve.

Idont - well, you did, actually, you said 'a presumably intelligent educated woman'. You can't presume that based on title. And, frankly, I don't really see why dim, ill-educated women should be less entitled to choose what they're called.

OwlCapone

Communicating information to me and seeking my approval are not the same thing. I asked why they think I care i.e. why they think this information is relevant to my interaction with them. I did not ask why they were interested in my value judgment.

Charming! Jeanne

I actually agree with the OP and will make a conscious effort going forward to use my first and last name.

I have no motive when using Mrs and find it old fashioned, but am aware that people may wish to respond to me in fomal English and by identifying my title it enables them to do so.

Yes, I do lack charm. Almost as much as someone who's just labelled women who use 'Ms' 'weird'.

And Ms is just shite. Probably used by women who are married but get all weird about it when asked if they are.

I don't agree with this, even though I use Mrs (and I am divorced). I think people can use whatever title they wish and I don't judge them by it. I will address people however they wish to be addressed - it's called good manners.

If I don't know the person, Dear Owl sounds overly familiar and impolite to me so I would go with Ms Capone if I didn't have any indication of a courtesy title. And no, I'm not over 70. If I was unable to be certain of the gender, I would go with Dear Owl Capone.

Except, obviously, I know who I am

Idont - well, you did, actually

No, she really, really didn't actually.

She made no link at ALL between being a Mrs and level of intelligence...at all.

Go back and re-read and then apologise

I asked why they think I care i.e. why they think this information is relevant to my interaction with them

And I asked why you think they give a damn whether you care or not.

If you are talking about relevance rather than caring, it is relevant because they are telling you the courtesy title they wish you to use.