to wonder why you think I care about your marital status?

[JessieMcJessie]

I've just received an email from the personal assistant to someone I am meeting later today. Her standard signature at the bottom of the e-mail (name changed of course) is

Mrs Brenda Jones

I sometimes see communications from other women signed off "Brenda Jones (Mrs)"

Why on earth do people do this? Do any of you do this?

NB although her name is not really Brenda, it was an unmistakeably female name, so it wasn't to stop any confusion about her gender. And I myself have a unisex first name but I still never put Mrs on my letters or emails (nor Miss before I was married).

I suppose it's just old fashioned but how awful that society ever thought that marital status and ability to do a job were in any way connected.

Being married is who you are? That's odd. It's just my marital status and makes no difference to who I am.

My mother always wrote (Mrs) after her name at the end of notes to the school and I remember even as a child thinking

I can't believe you don't care about my marital status!

Puds11 (Miss)

I usually use my title in correspondence and sign Mrs Annie Pianist.

It's because otherwise you get a Dear Miss Pianist or Dear Ms Pianist back - neither of which is correct.

I asked why you (and Brenda) think I care?

Personally, I don't. I just want to make sure you use my correct name and title when you reply to me.

It's alright, OP (neatly sidestepping etiquette), you can call me Lying.

I don't mind disagreeing with you, or you with me. If I didn't know somebody I wouldn't use their first name, it wouldn't feel right, regardless of gender. It's easy to do that in writing and even easier when people use e-mail so much as nobody seems to use Mr/Mrs/Ms/Miss.

I do have a few acquaintances who put MSc after their name on e-mails... even HNC/HND. It doesn't grate exactly but I do think this belongs on business cards and nowhere else.

Annie is that for social or professional usage?
I cannot think of a reason why it would be relevant to point out your marital status to an aquaintace at work.

Was thinking about Miss/Ms/Mrs the other day. I think the really interesting thing is that women's "titles", on the whole declare their marital staus. Married, single, divorced. I said "on the whole" because I realise this isn't always the case.
Whereas men are Mr and that's it. Interesting.

Not to reopen the can of worms, but Ms doesn't mean divorced, roz.

AnniePianist It is a good point I suppose, if the other person will insist on using a title when they reply to you. I almost invariably get "Dear Mr McJessie" and it does annoy me a bit because "Dear Jessie" would have been fine.

Would you object to Dear Annie?

I agree that all adult women should have the same title. After all unmarried adult men are not addressed as Master. Maybe if people started to do this they might thing again.

I agree with OwlCapone

I don't want one title for all women thanks very much. I'm happy being called a Mrs. Was happy to be called Miss before I married as well.

And Ms is just shite. Probably used by women who are married but get all weird about it when asked if they are.

How does one 'get all weird' about being asked if you're married?

Do you think we're secretly hairy-legged lesbians gagging for a divorce, who've undertaken marriage as a social experiment?

To be fair to her the sign off is probably some outdated house style.

I once worked alongside some consultants in a government department, and their consultancy required them to record a voicemail message along the lines of "This is Title Firstname Surname, on assignment from Self-Important Consulting at the Department of Administrative Affairs, please leave a message." I felt a bit sorry for them.

Lying I am glad we can both agree to disagree and also just agree - I am definitely with you on the academic qualifications letters after name signoff! I sometimes see LLB ( from people who didn't go on to qualify as lawyers) and BA (Hons) and it looks really try-hard.

Though as I said above I do think that a Doctor (both academic and medical) can and should sign off as "Dr". Must be the extra effort it takes to get a doctorate compared to a first degree -I am clearly an academic snob .

Though as that consultancy is still around 25 years later, and the more laid back one I was working through went bust a couple of years later, maybe I shouldn't judge.

I don't see what is wrong with women choosing how they sign their correspondence or how they're addressed, it's their choice as a presumably intelligent educated woman to prefer Mrs as apposed to Ms.
Imposing one title for all women takes that choice away from those who obviously don't mind being called Mrs.

How is it different to a man signing off as "mr"?

I like "ms". My marital status is nobody else's business. Men are "mr" from the day they're born until they die. Why should I be "miss" then "mrs"?

MsLemonylemon

I can't wait for the day until miss & mrs fall out of usage.

Women who continue to use these terms are just reproducing patriarchal values to the next generation. It is another part of the maze of discrimination women face- we are judged for our marital status amongst so much else. Men aren't under this scrutiny.
It's small but it is another barrier to equality, emancipation and liberation.

Idontseeanydragons how about we just do away with titles altogether though?

When I send a work email, it really shouldn't matter to the person at the other end if I am male or female. If old-fashioned ideas of politeness didn't compel them to use a title to reply to me, they would not need to know my gender or marital status to interact with me professionally. In the same way that they don't need to know I have blonde hair or am a size 6 shoe.

The only people who need to know that I am female and married are my doctor and the government.

How on earth does using Mrs indicate you're an 'intelligent educated woman'?

Not that I think it rules it out - I know loads of intelligent educated Mrses (no idea what the plural should be). But surely it just means you're married and picked a title to show it?

I wrote that because I work with a woman who uses Ms instead of Mrs as she didn't like folk assuming she was married...She actually was married.

She's divorced now and kept her maiden name whilst she was married. She's still Ms D [maiden name]

Like I said weird! And her answer was what does it matter if I'm married or not? Well no it doesn't but why get all freaky about it if someone has the audacity to ask!!

And as a pp has said if you write in correspondence with your preferred title it should stop folk using an incorrect one.

I use Ms and used to have it on my email sign off - till on another recent thread it was pointed out that looked a bit odd. And I thought about it again and realised it probably did so removed it. But I am Ms and don't want to be addressed as Miss or Mrs (I'm married).

It is helpful when you are responding to someone you don't know to be able to put the title they prefer using, in my line of work it wouldn't generally be taken well to respond on first name terms to someone you've never corresponded with before.

I do agree that professional qualifications on an email address/ business card can be a bit try hard!

Oh, and my car insurer.

I wouldn't mind dispensing with Miss, Ms and Mrs - I like 'Mistress', it's very authoritative, I'd love that. If we have to have a title, that's the one I'd choose.

I don't really get why that's weird, Mrs.

But then, I did exactly the same as her.

DH (yes, he's now ex DH) would have found it extremely weird if I'd taken his name. Less so if I'd used Mrs, I think. I remember mentioning it to him and he burst out laughing.

He's now one of the very few people who writes to me as Dr, bless him, so I'm fairly sure he's not nursing secret rage at my unfeminine ways.