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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Drinking in pregnancy. The message still isn't registering

335 replies

kissmethere · 03/03/2015 13:38

Just read an article about the effects of alcohol in pregnancy. Children left with lasting effects of their mothers drinking habits and the mothers are saying they had no idea this would happen. Seriously?
I drank Guinness during my first pregnancy 18 years ago, very small amount at the end, adhering to the old wives tale that it was full of iron and malt. I knew back then that there was no way spirits or beer or loads of Guinness or much more should be consumed as it was bad for the baby. That was 18 years ago! I knew a woman when I was growing up who's son had permanent bone and facial damage as his mum was an alcoholic and fell over when she was pregnant with him, they had to operate on him while in the womb.
My point is how is it that some women still think alcohol in pregnancy is ok or claim they didn't know what damage it can do to the baby. What help are they getting if they truly know they have an addiction?

OP posts:
RedToothBrush · 04/03/2015 11:19

1 in 50 women are in a crash whilst pregnant.

And actually sparechange we should ban men. They are more likely than pregnant women to crash!

Shameless Daily Mail link, complete with expert

Davsmum · 04/03/2015 11:25

sparechange I did not drive whilst pregnant because I did not have a car.If I had, and had to drive then I would.
Many people have to drive for work or other reasons. Driving itself is not dangerous. You can have an accident as you can doing any other daily activities. However, no one HAS to drink. There is nothing in your life that makes drinking necessary.( unless you admit to being addicted)
It is one risk you can totally eliminate.
That being the case, why would you choose to continue?

AggressiveBunting · 04/03/2015 11:29

Completely agree with the OP. It's just damn irresponsible. Also, what's with all these women over 35 having babies? Dont they know the risks of certain things increases with maternal age..........and also anyone who has a BMI of 25 or above - they shouldnt be breeding either...........and also poor people because there's a risk their kids might get bullied for not having the right trainers.........and also anyone with an IQ below 120 or who likes Per Una - that might be genetic!!!! Dont take the risk, people.

RedToothBrush · 04/03/2015 11:30

Because its pointless eliminating a really teeny tiny risk if you then get hit by a bus the next day and have spent your whole life living in fear and with anxiety.

Davsmum · 04/03/2015 11:30

Ha ha, comparing not having trainers with being damaged by alchohol,..priceless!

NancyRaygun · 04/03/2015 11:33

We are so very lucky as a nation, and as a group of literate lucky women, that we are able to have babies and give birth in a safe and secure environment. Millions of women do not have such a luxury. We are supported by peer reviewed scientific research and bleating about inflammatory anti women documentaries and using them as a stick to play the "I am a more committed mother than you" game is a very western privilege!

The NHS have given us guidelines. Those guidelines are based on the best research available. As I also have my brain available and I know that the NHS is giving advice to suit the NATIONAL interests, I feel confident taking responsibility for my own health and that of my baby. I have a glass or two of red wine every other day. I am 30 weeks pregnant.

A good friend (and Consultant obstetrician and member of the Royal College) always maintained the biggest risk to drinking too much was that you might fall over.

Opinions are so confused and that leads to trouble, I think the poor woman who considered a termination as she had had a drink has been mentioned. So may posts in the Pregnancy forum are from frightened women who have had a glass of wine and are now incredibly anxious.

So, follow the NHS guidelines.
And spare me the "I know the guidelines but why would I risk even one drink" as it raises my blood pressure with it's stupidity and complete inability to understand basic science: and raised blood pressure IS bad in pregnancy.

Shame on the judgemental idiots on this thread.

leedy · 04/03/2015 11:33

Yoghurt is actually mildly alcoholic, as is orange juice - should pregnant women avoid these as well, just to be sure?

(also DEAR GOD PEOPLE GIVE YOGHURT TO BABIES IT IS LIKE PUTTING JOHNNY WALKER IN THEIR SIPPY CUPS)

sparechange · 04/03/2015 11:37

I've got my head in my hands here…
Driving to see friends isn't essential. Driving to the supermarket isn't essential if you can get home delivery. LOADS of journeys aren't essential. But you would carry on making them even though there is a 1 in 50 chance of you being in an accident.
But despite all the evidence saying there is nothing close to a 1 in 50 chance of any negative consequences from having a glass or two of wine a week, you think that is an avoidable risk?

Do you realise how irrational that is?

HootyMcTooty · 04/03/2015 11:38

The only reason the NHS recommends no alcohol in pregnancy is because they don't know what level of alcohol causes FAS and they can't carry out studies as it would be seriously unethical. Also, one person's idea of drinking in moderation is excessive to another person. Anyone with a brain would know that one drink every now and again later on in pregnancy is not going to do any harm. The problem is, some people will find any justification for having a drink every day as a "special occasion". The NHS simply cannot rely on everyone exercising sensible judgment.

OrangeMochaFrappucino · 04/03/2015 11:40

And what about wearing make up? That's a totally avoidable risk. And it was advised that pregnant women don't do it BY EXPERTS. So do you subscribe to that one too, Davsmum, or will you wait until it's featured on ITV?

leedy · 04/03/2015 11:45

As I said above, the only way to avoid all risk in pregnancy is to never go out and possibly live in some kind of hermetically sealed bubble.

DecaffTastesWeird · 04/03/2015 11:45

Sparechange you make a really convincing argument and I agree with you.

Some people are so convinced they are right, or have prejudices that are so fixed, that they simply cannot listen to reason. I wouldn't waste your breath (or your typing fingers).

littlemslazybones · 04/03/2015 11:47

I hope that hermetically sealed bubble doesn't impair the pregnant woman's movement, thereby increasing the risk of obesity or of dvt.

NancyRaygun · 04/03/2015 11:48

Sparechange, I agree with you too: and yep. It is irrational, and scared. Two symptoms of not really understanding something and feeling out of control and anxious.

It is really sad that women feel so frightened by this.

SuggestmeaUsername · 04/03/2015 11:49

This topic already came up yesterday:-

AIBU?
if you think its ok to have a glass of wine a week in pregnancy is it ok to have a cigarette a week?

RedToothBrush · 04/03/2015 11:54

Well I don't smoke when not pregnant because I have assessed the risk to be one I am not comfortable in accepting, so why would I take it up when pregnant?

Besides which, it stinks.

Davsmum · 04/03/2015 11:55

JellyDinosaurs It is sensible to avoid any risks that are avoidable,..however, it does not have to be featured on ITV. Anyone who thinks ingesting a poison is anything but harmful,..however mildly, is in complete denial. We are talking about alcohol,..not comparing risks.

The question is - Is alcohol a poison, is it toxic? The answer is yes.
Another question is Do you physically need alcohol? The answer is No.

Therefore is is sensible to choose to drink the stuff when pregnant? The answer is No.
You don't have to be an expert to see that - A child of 10 could probably follow that logic.

LaurieMarlow · 04/03/2015 11:59

But Davsmum, exactly the same rhetorical question could be applied to lots of things that we don't get our knickers in a twist over …

The question is - Is alcohol a poison, is it toxic? The answer is yes.
Same goes for cheeseburgers, donuts, makeup, deodorant, cleaning chemicals ...

Another question is Do you physically need alcohol? The answer is No.
Same goes for all of the above

Yet where are the documentaries, hand wringing and 'experts' talking about those?

Davsmum · 04/03/2015 12:17

I don't think being mindful about drinking alcohol is getting knickers in a twist.
The items you list are not as directly toxic as alcohol - but even if they were, then avoiding them when pregnant would make sense.
Why would anyone be happy to take unnecessary risks?

I keep saying - this should not be about comparisons but about alcohol on its own.
I don't think there is anyone that argues smoking in pregnancy is ok these days. However, years ago - people were coming out with the same arguments you are about smoking.

DecaffTastesWeird · 04/03/2015 12:24

Sigh. I really didn't want to engage here; alcohol has been shown to have numerous health benefits if consumed in moderation. Smoking has not. There is "being mindful about drinking alcohol" and then describing wine as toxic. You are not "being mindful", you are scaremongering based on your apparently limited knowledge.

sparechange · 04/03/2015 12:26

Why should it be about alcohol on its own? Do you have massive issues with alcohol?

Surely this is about women potentially putting their babies at harm by indulging in risky behaviours. You've singled out alcohol as the worst and most easily avoidable risky behaviour.

Many others have pointed out that this isn't true and used Actual Science to back it up, but you are sticking to some dogmatic viewpoint that everything else in life is just everyday life and an acceptable thing to do, where as alcohol is the devil.

As an obstetrician which they see as a higher risk birth - a teetotal woman with a BMI of 35, or a woman who has drunk a couple of glasses of week for most of her pregnancy, and which of those women is more likely to end up with a baby in SCBU or problems in later life.

Now, where is your vitriol for pregnant fatties? Or does your ability to classify 'toxicity' only extend to things that give you a hangover?

LaurieMarlow · 04/03/2015 12:27

You aren't being 'mindful' about drinking alcohol though. Your whole position is based around the fact that it's 'poisonous' and 'toxic'. You're demonising it.

Being careful, watching your units, avoiding it at crucial times (i.e. first trimester) could also be described as being 'mindful'.

And how do you know that the items I mentioned are not 'as directly toxic' as alcohol in very small quantities (which, lest we forget, is what we are talking about here, not litre bottles of vodka).

sparechange · 04/03/2015 12:30

Sorry, that should have read
a teetotal woman with a BMI of 35, or a healthy weight woman who has drunk a couple of glasses of week for most of her pregnancy

NancyRaygun · 04/03/2015 12:41

The question is - Are apples a poison, is it toxic? The answer is yes.
Another question is Do you physically need apples? The answer is No.

The question is - Are Almonds a poison, is it toxic? The answer is yes.
Another question is Do you physically need almonds? The answer is No.

The question is - Are cherries a poison, is it toxic? The answer is yes.
Another question is Do you physically need cherries? The answer is No.

leedy · 04/03/2015 12:42

(also should somebody also suggest that we continue to think of the baaaaaaaybeeeeeeee when shamelessly drinking'n'breastfeeding like ADDICTS WHO CAN'T JUST STOP LIKE A GOOD MOTHER, the alcohol content of breastmilk after a couple of wines is, interestingly, about the same as the aforementioned yoghurt. Hic.)