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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To report this childminder?

232 replies

Happyyellowcar · 26/02/2015 21:22

Was at playgroup today with DD and DS1. A local childminder was also there with several small children in tow. I see her around a lot as she goes to many of the same groups as I do. One of her charges was maybe a year old and obviously just toddling. During snack time I was standing behind DS2, holding DD whilst chatting to a friend when suddenly the little toddler who happened to be sitting next to DS1, toppled head first off her chair and onto the wooden floor. She landed on her head and her neck actually crunched. I hadn't even noticed she was there until she fell off as I was trying to stop DS2 from pinching all the breadsticks. Another mum picked up the now screaming toddler and looked around for the childminder who was sitting quite far from the table, chatting yo her friend. She was actually turned away from the table and on the far side from where this toddler was sitting. She was passed the toddler and have her a cuddle but I'm sure didn't realise how serious her fall had been. I feel really incensed on behalf of the toddler's mother who must think that her child is in safe hands whilst she is at work. I've used a childminder myself with DS2 and the thought that this might have happened to him is sickening. No mother would have left their own child on a chair at such a young age without keeping a closer eye, surely? How else is she being neglectful? AIBU to want to report her?

OP posts:

Jackiebrambles · 27/02/2015 10:48

I don't think reporting it is very realistic to be honest op.

Although I do understand it was upsetting to witness.

I've seen something similar myself, a couple of childminders were sat with their charges at lunch (in a local cafe) and one of the littlest ones, probably around 1, was sat on an adult chair - she of course fell off and bashed herself on the floor. The other childminder said 'she didn't hit her face' to the mindees cm as she went to pick her up.

I just thought the care she gave wasn't that attentive. But it's just snapshot of the care she gives if you see what I mean.

Rjae · 27/02/2015 10:53

I agree you should find a way to alert the authorities. I have no idea why people would find it acceptable for someone paid to supervise a child is not doing their job. No one can prevent all bumps and falls, especially with a toddler but they can supervise for preventable accidents and falling off a chair is very preventable. DS2 fell off a chair yesterday. He was a couple of feet from me and I'd told him to sit and not stand. I took my eye off him for a minute, he stood and fell. Of course that is my fault as I should have put him on the floor rather than sit next to me. Toddlers are not safe on chairs without constant supervision. The CM was negligent and the child could have been seriously injured.

Not sure where you would report this to though, but as a parent I would not want my child looked after like this.

adsy · 27/02/2015 10:58

rjae are you saying that you were negligent?

dustarr73 · 27/02/2015 11:34

Op you are getting an awful hard time for something you could do nothing about.The childminder is not doing her job.I would report as it is serious.Afterall falling off and twisting their neck could have serious complications.Especially if the CM didnt tell the parents about it.

Its not as if the child climbd the chair and fell while cm was 2 steps behind,she was being ignored.The next time she ignores the child it could much more serious implications.

FlabbyMummy · 27/02/2015 11:34

I am with you on this, as a Mum I would want to know about this incident, can you make sure that this is reported in the accident book at the group and I would consider reporting her too.

I hope the little girl is ok and if you don't report the childminder I would recommend having a word with her and say that you were alarmed by the incident.

I have a friend who is a Nanny and when I employed a Nanny I introduced them and arranged for her to go to some local Child minder/Nanny groups with her. My nanny (who is now a friend) came back upset at the behaviour of the group, children were just ignored, fell over run riot etc they even slagged of the young children in front of the children. My nanny never met them again.

FlabbyMummy · 27/02/2015 11:43

I am shocked by people making light of a 1 year old falling head first off a chair onto a hard floor. Picture your child doing this?

Bread stick crunching/Neck vertebrae?

I wouldn't let a child of mine aged 1 climb onto a chair unsupervised, I would be horrified if someone else did and my child fell head first!

Rjae · 27/02/2015 11:50

Adsy. Of course it is negligence. The child was in the care of a childminder who is expected to exercise reasonable supervision of the children in her care. Sitting chatting while a toddler climbs on a chair and falls off is not supervision.

Comparing to what happened to this child with what happens in a home is an erroneous argument. The childminder is supposed to exercise a higher level of supervision than a mum at home. It's what the law says.

Rjae · 27/02/2015 11:53

. Misread that ...thought it said is the CM negligent.

But my answer stands, the care exercised by someone trained and paid to do a job is higher than someone (mother) who is not.

And no, I was not negligent but I could have been more vigilant.

adsy · 27/02/2015 11:57

I agree that she should have been keeping an eye on a 1 year old, but I take issue with you saying the law says a CM is supposed to exercise a higher level of supervision than a mum at home. Where on earth does it say that? Surely negligence is negligence? if a CM is negligent in letting a child fall off a chair then so is a mother .
Not being paid to look after a child doesn't mean you should be more lax with them

lillibeta · 27/02/2015 12:02

I think the point is, some accidents are preventable. Some are not. A child running along and falling flat on his face is usually not preventable. But a child falling off a chair usually is.

I would expect a better level of supervision from a childcare professional than from an amateur (i.e. me!)

In my job as a nurse, I don't sit around chatting. Some do, but I would consider them to be unprofessional. As a parent you can chat at toddler groups, because it's not your job, it's just your life. You're not accountable to anyone. As a childminder, of course you can talk to people, but your primary focus must be your charges. If you are serious about your job.

chocolatemademefat · 27/02/2015 12:16

The glee with which people rubbish childminders on this site is sickening. And the reason why a lot of us no longer attend toddler's groups and have our own meetings.

I'm sure a lot of you are now imagining us lolling around drinking coffee and chatting while injured kids are lying in corners in varying states of distress.

If I didn't get so much amusement from your pompous opinions I'd happily never log on to this site again.

Thankfully there are still a lot of reasonable people who make my job a good one. I love the kids I look after and do it to the best of my ability. My own son's had accidents when they were younger. Perhaps I should have reported every bump on the head because what does it matter who was looking after them at the time - it still hurt when it happened.

Get over yourselves and show some common sense.

Rjae · 27/02/2015 12:16

Adsy. Look up the law on negligence.

Basically it's this

the defendant owed them a duty of care;

the defendant was in breach of that duty;

the breach of duty caused damage and;

the damage was not too remote.

I did gcse law and as a nurse know that as a trained professional offering a service my duty of care is set higher than that of the man in the street.

Rjae · 27/02/2015 12:18

Or the mother in the home.

Rjae · 27/02/2015 12:25

Chocolate. I am not rubbishing CMs I think most of them do a great job, if I didn't have other responsibilities I would love to do CMing.

I don't believe you would be condoning the lack of supervision in the OP any more than I do. If the CM had been within feet of this toddler and looked away at another child and in that minute the toddler had climbed on and fallen, then she wouldn't be negligent because she was using due diligence and accidents do happen. You can't prevent accidents but you should be on hand to deal with them, not be elsewhere.

Comparing it to a parent who has many other responsibilities is the wrong way to look at it. The only responsibility the CM has it to the children in her care. If she can't do this then she has too many children.

AndThenISaid · 27/02/2015 12:42

the most negligent person is the one who picked up a child who had a suspected serious neck injury!!

Heels99 · 27/02/2015 12:47

If I heard a child's neck crunch in any capacity I would call an ambulance.
Why didn't you? The cm wouldn't have heard it, but you did but took no action and didn't tell cm you heard the crunch, suggest or seek medical help?
The are two negligent people here and you are one of them.

insancerre · 27/02/2015 12:47

So, op if it was your child who had had the accident then you would be OK with a stranger reporting you?

adsy · 27/02/2015 12:59

ah right, you've got a GCSE. no wonder you are so learned.
your definition of negligence still doesn't differentiate between a mother and carer

guiltynetter · 27/02/2015 13:06

YANBU. she should have been keeping a closer eye on her.

insancerre · 27/02/2015 13:08

So if the cm was sat next to her could she have prevented it?
The op couldn't
Pmsl at the legal expert with aGCSE in law

TwoOddSocks · 27/02/2015 13:13

I don't know why people are getting so defensive about this. Whether this was a mum or a childminder it's pretty clearly a bit negligent. It's not at the level that SS would get heavily involved or the childminder would have her licence (or whatever you need to be a childminder) taken away but it is at the level that if I had my child in this woman's care I'd be very uneasy and would want to know about it.

And yes there is an obvious difference between how you can act as a mum and a childminder. It's like the difference between slipping and letting a baby fall down the stairs and just letting a baby play unsupervised on the stairs. The result may be the same (baby falls down stairs) one is negligence the other is an accident.

As a mum I can decide to just chuck the kids in front of the TV for 3 hours and stay in my PJs all day. As a childminder I wouldn't be able to, because I'm at work and the standards are different. There's also a big difference between chatting while scanning the room for kids in your care and turning your back to a young toddler in a room that isn't baby proofed.

TwoOddSocks · 27/02/2015 13:14

Oops garbled that that should read:

And yes there is an obvious difference between how you can act as a mum and a childminder.

AGirlCalledBoB · 27/02/2015 13:16

Hmm it's a bit tricky. Was she not watching the child the whole time or just took her eyes off for a second? Accidents do happen even if you are watching them. My son is 18 months and fell off his little chair yesterday. I was near him but it was so fast I could not catch him. Luckily he did not even cry. I was also watching my younger cousin once and he fell off a playground toy, banged his head and bled but again it was a accident.

I would maybe see how she is next week and decide from there. You would hope that the accident would encourage her to be around the child more and certainly not let him climb on a chair.

Original poster

Happyyellowcar · 27/02/2015 13:17

Heels99 - the child was picked up very quickly by another mum and passed along the line of carers to where the cm wa sitting. That was out of my control as I was holding a 3month old at the time. The child wasn't unconscious and seemed to be moving ok so not a 999 emergency. I was looking my two children - they are my primary responsibility, not another child although of course I try to help other children if they need it and I have a free hand. I didn't have a free hand in this case, just free eyes ! I did my best to communicate the seriousness of the fall at the end of the group, approx 30mins later. What more do you suggest I do when I have my own two to look after ? I certainly was not negligent although if I had noticed the child on the chair in the first place I probably would have alerted someone with a free hand who could maybe have prevented the fall. Not sure why I am getting so much stick for being genuinely concerned over a child who fell off a chair!

OP posts:

Original poster

Happyyellowcar · 27/02/2015 13:19

Insancerre - I will say it again for the 4th time - I couldn't have prevented it as I was holding DD and supervising DS2 at the table. The cm was sitting turned away and chatting. She should have been near to the child supervising her on the chair.

OP posts:

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