AIBU to think that my Dad is out of line and should back off on this?

[Marmiteandjamislush]

As background: It is Lent and we are very observant.

My Dad is here, as he is every day teaching the boys. I was setting the table for lunch and I put out a jug of water. DS2 (just 4) starts whinging that he doesn't want water, he wants juice. Now, to me he is just being a pain because we don't have juice with meals as a matter of course anyway, he has been very willful over the last few days anyway, because this is the first Lent that we have made him do 'properly' in that we have said no to anything sweet, fried or leaven at all and no red meat. I don't think this is a problem, his brother is just 6 and has done it from the same age. Anyway, so I serve the meal, veg broth and Matza. DS2 is still whining and refusing to eat, saying, 'I'm too thirsty, I'm too thirsty, Meenor!' His name for my Dad.

Dad then says to me 'How can you see your child suffer like this? I never denied you a drink as a child.'

I answered that I am not denying him anything, he is choosing not to drink the water and is only playing up to an audience.

A little later, [DS2still whining] I nip out to the loo, and come back to find DS2 has got a glass of squash!

AIBU to think that my Dad should have stuck to my rules in my own house?

FYI, kitchen has been cleaned for Lent, so he had to purposefully walk through to my office the garage to get the juice from the child inaccessible cupboard!

limegoldfinewine I agree.

OP I don't care about the reason, a glass of squash !!!

It's one thing for you to have some self imposed denial to support your deity- but don't inflict this upon your kids. You are influencing their developing minds.
What if you are wrong and there is no god?

Is it not better to allow them their own path in life rather than you tinkering with the hardwiring of their brains like this?

Hear hear Lime...I absolutely agree.

To the posters who think a glass of squash isn't a big deal, what if the grandfather had given pork to a 4-year-old child in a Muslim family? Or meat in a vegetarian family? Would you have told the OP to get over it?

(I think it is the same, BTW, but it seems that on Mumsnet only some religions / beliefs deserve respect).

I love the way MN/AIBU takes such extreme and inconsistent positions.

When DS1 had his first playdate I was absolutely crucified on here for considering giving someone else's child squash

"(I think it is the same, BTW, but it seems that on Mumsnet only some religions / beliefs deserve respect)."

Nope. I am happy to be equally disrespectful of all of them.

But I don't think think he should have given the child squash.

Remind. He shouldn't have given the child squash.

But this is not a no squash household. He would not have been introducing squash to an innocent, squash free child for the first time..............

If he repeatedly brought squash to a no-squash household, whatever the reason for the no-squash rule, i would think this was a different matter. I would think this was part of a pattern of disregard for the mothers rules and preferences.

But the idea that this one off incident of minor rule breaking in this context means the dad should "back off" makes it seem like mother feels her word is law and her judgement infallible. Did her dad not raise her? Is he not just as qualified to make this call about a child he is having a massive habd I'm raising? Sometimes my own dad does things I wouldn't, allows things I don't or forbids things that aren't even on my radar as a problem. In specifics not everything we think about parenting is identical bit on general we think the same stuff. I think the OP seems hysterical to think her father is perfectly capable of EDUCATING her children but his judgement on whether some rule breaky squash was okay in this one situation isn't to be trusted and he needs to "back off".

Oh this thread is long so probably moved on regardless of lent which imo is a persons
al thing for Christian families the op doesn't allow juice with meals her dad went searching for juice and undermined the op rules it would annoy me.

I'm Christian.

I rarely give up something for Lent, and certainly only discuss it with my DC if they want to. I prefer to use Lent as a time to be more generous or find time to think more about Jesus etc.

But would people be so negative to the OP if this was about Ramadan?

"I agree with this. It seems on MN, and IRL too, it is Christian and Christian based religions especially which are targetted in this way. Other religions can have very hard line views on things such as homosexuality, the role of women, modesty, music, dance and 'the outside world' plus restrictive eating and drinking requirements but very few people would scream abuse at a household that strictly observed those religions as many do."

Nobody has "screamed abuse"

I am happy to voice my issues with any and all religions. I am an equal opportunities anti religionist. But I do find Christians in this country claiming persecution and discrimination particularly outrageous.

"But would people be so negative to the OP if this was about Ramadan?"

Yes. But it wouldn't happen. Small children are not expected to fast.

Tbf 4 year olds dont normally fast for Ramadan but I do see your point

"Tbf 4 year olds dont normally fast for Ramadan but I do see your point"

As 4 year olds don't fast for Ramadan there is no point to see.

What I meant was christianity seems to be fair game on here other religions are not mocked as much. anyway I am non Christian I probably shouldn't have comented and I dont want to get into the rights or wrongs of Lent

I think Jesus would have given the kid squash. [runs]

Very interesting thread - although I've only skim read it as it gets quite heavy in parts!

To chip in my tuppence worth, and going back to he original OP, I think the OP's father probably shouldn't have given the DS squash. But equally, he is a grandparent - they do these things. It's annoying (my MIL once gave DS chocolate buttons for breakfast!), but not the end of the world.

Your house, your rules is totally correct. But rules get broken and life goes on. It was only a glass of squash after all.

"But a special anger seems to be directed at branches of Christian people who are very observant than say very strict Muslim families who would never allow alcohol or pork, who make their older daughters cover their hair and encourage their children not to mox socially with those of the opposite sex."

Really? Could you link to all the threads started by Muslim people about this?
Specifically the ones where 4 year olds are being expected to follow strict dietary rules for a specific period of time, not as a normal part of their lives?

Well plenty of 7 year olds do - fast for Ramadan.

The squash would annoy a lot of people.

And I think the forcing children to give up on such a wholesale basis - is probably going to back fire when they are older.

OP - Maybe your Dad is worried about how extremely you are taking your faith - there is balance. Maybe you should read Romans and think about what Paul meant about not living under the law, and the law being created by man not man for the law. Observing Lent is not mentioned in the bible. Fasting is, but usually as a personal response to God, personal repentance, or to plea with God on behalf of others. (it is also not about giving up a few arbitrary pleasures).

There is a big difference between "just 4" and 7.

The grandfather shouldn't have given the squash.