To be surprised at how little STBX will have to pay

[Stardustnight]

STBX is on a very good salary indeed and his living costs are low.

Despite this, according to the CSA calculator he will only have to pay £800 a month for 3 children, which compared to the amount of money he actually has, isn't a lot - £200 a week.

Am I being unreasonable to be feeling mildly disgruntled and short changed? Or am I grabby and entitled ?

Just want to add my voice to those sticking up for the OP here. What a bloody awful thread - talk about kicking a woman when she's down! A woman who has clearly been subjected to years of domestic and sexual abuse. Some of you really need to have a word with yourselves. Bravo to Pag et al.

YANBU stardust, and my advice to you would be to get as good a lawyer as you can afford to hammer out the divorce settlement for you. A friend of mine got awarded spousal maintenance almost equal to the amount of the CM payments she was entitled to because she had given up work to look after the dc. Divorce courts generally recognise the sacrifice made by a sahp, and that this affects future earning potential too.

Wishing you the best stardust - and seriously try to ignore the twatty posts on here

You do look lovely together.

So reading the last few posts, it seems that we agreeing that it isn't fair or right that stbx gets to contribute less to his children lives than star does? That star isn't being grabby. That the rules currently in place (whilst maybe better than before) are still not fair?

Waves back at fellow cunt, Parsnip. And cracks on with the incredibly unfair deal life has thrown at her.

Thank you Pag- sweet of you.

Well of course the slightly odd thing is that you assume that when I used cunt I was referring to you?

Why is that?
It would of course be great if you were reflecting on your tone and had decided it was unecessarily harsh - if that is the case.

I'm going to start by saying that I'm sorry because I haven't read the whole thread.

However, stardustnight, I don't think you are being unreasonable at all. The CSA calculation that a child will 'cost' 15% of a parent's income, and that subsequent children will 'cost' less than that again is laughable. Even just starting with the basics, a child needs a room to sleep in, and a bed, and light and heat in that room. They also need food, clothes, school uniform, packed lunches, day trips etc. And that's before you even start on the stuff that really they should be doing, activities, clubs, days out to theme parks, art galleries and the things that while it might not be essential is still hardly Little Lord Fauntleroy territory like music lessons, tablet, internet provision etc. I certainly spend a fuck of a lot more than 15% of my income providing that for my son, and I'm sure that's the case for most people.

I think there is so much negative shit in the press about evil sponging single parents and how they are bleeding the poor men dry that we lose sight of the fact that there is an entire army of women out there, getting by on the bare minimum, looking after the kids, raising their families, holding things together while the shit hits the fan and the blokes swan off into the sunset and that that is the real scandal. 15% is a derisory amount when it comes to what it costs to raise a child.

So, you are completely right.

As for where you go from here, I'm sorry if I'm repeating what others have said because I can't read all 27 pages and it all got a bit bogged down, but a good lawyer is definitely a first step. Also, do a tax credit calculation here:

www.entitledto.co.uk

Go to your CAB - they have welfare benefits advisers there that can help you get whatever you should be claiming. They also could be of help in the future if you need something replacing urgently eg a washing machine - every area has charitable funds set up by benefactors where people can apply when in need - it might be if you live in a certain postcode etc you can avail yourself of charitable help. Find out about it and take it.

Contact your local authority about your son's music lessons - if he gets put onto free school meals after the split, some authorities run bursary schemes where they would pay for tuition within/after school.

But mostly, congratulate yourself that you are doing the right thing, but that it's also ok to feel pissed off and cheated that even though you've made this huge step things aren't sorted out immediately and to feel daunted by the battle ahead of you. But know that you can get through this, and your kids can get through this.

My situation was different when I left my abusive relationship. We weren't married, I only had one child who was 2, I owned my house and he didn't live with us. However, reading between the lines, I think the range/type of abuse was very similar. Like you I'd also say he was financially abusive (although a very way different to you) as although he would give me between ££0-100-200 in dribs and drabs per month while I was in a relationship with him, he was always threatening to withdraw it for any number of things (going to baby groups, not preparing the 'correct' meal etc etc) that I would get nothing if I left him etc etc. I had very little money at the time and was very dependent on it and therefore massively worried how we'd manage without it.
When we left I thought the hardest thing was the leaving. I had a non mol order and was moving two counties as that was the only way I thought I could get us away from the situation and keep DS safe. To stop me moving he actually registered a charge on my house between exchange and completion and the only way he would remove it was if I put the entire proceeds to one side. I was then a chain trying to buy the new house and needed the equity to be able to do it. It was horrific and it took me 8 months to get the money released, but I did it (long story) The other thing I was worried about when we first left was that DS would get no child support and that I wouldn't be able to provide for him properly.
I look back now and really the financial issue, although when I first left seemed so large, was actually the least of my worries. I thought my case for supervised contact was water tight as I had so much evidence of the abuse I'd suffered and as a consequence DS too. He ticked all the boxes that he was also likely to abuse DS... But he managed to continue his control through the family courts and without going into details I felt totally destroyed and also felt completely unable to protect DS.
We get no child support at all. The courts, despite a court order for him to pay £300pcm, have no interest/power in enforcing it.
But that ended up being the one thing he hasn't been able to control ...our money. There are no more threats to take it away, worries about how we'd manage if he did etc etc. This turned out to be freedom although I CERTAINLY DID NOT THINK THAT when we first left, so I totally understand where the OP is coming from. This is how the child support thing turned out for us and everyone will have a different story.....And it's so so wrong that the OPs husband will probably end up paying so little. That is a no brainer, no question. The way NRPs are not held accountable by society is the real problem.

What needs to change is how these cases are dealt with in court how these abusive types are allowed to continue their control and more importantly how society views these idiots that pay so little AND how victims of domestic abuse are dealt with in court.

OP you've just begun your journey to being properly free of this man, gather all your strength, get support wherever you can and please please please gather as much evidence as you can relating to the abuse you and the children have suffered. Don't worry about him manipulating the children with money, kids aren't silly xxxxxxxx

It is amusing that the same people defending their nasty comments with "well it's a public forum" are the first to be taken aback when it is them that's coming under scrutiny. The OP should meekly put up with being called a grabby cow but when they're called "mean" or "nasty" they suddenly play the victim and act like it's an affront to their freedom of speech.

This has to be one of the most frustrating threads I have ever been on.

I got a bit carried away there,..
I guess what I was trying to say is that the way the system and society is set up, means abusive men can continue their control through child support. Which in the end meant for us that I was actually glad we didn't get any... Not that I think these arseholes shouldn't have to pay xxx

Spot on socks.

Cruikshanks and babynamechanges posts are examples of supportive and helpful posts from people who've been through something similar.

Isn't it just pickled.

I agree, thank you for that ladies. :)

No, I'm not angry - I feel the situation is unfair without actually being angry; I am being too sick to be angry!

The main thing now is carving out a life for us and yes that will ABSOLUTELY include work. I hope, this time next year, to have an au pair for example - this will enable me to do a small amount of paid work without impacting too much on the children. However, even the most critical surely can see I can't now, pregnant and with a baby. I am not anti putting children in childcare but dc3 would just be too young this side of Christmas.

Luckily, I already have DD's baby things so don't need to buy anything, really. I hope it's another girl! Plus I can't think of any boy names I like!

My priorities in the next ten months are emotional rather than anything else. I need to try and re establish links and friendships and make new ones so I'm not going through childbirth and newborn stage completely alone but I will if I have to!

Um... Great attempt at a psychological evaluation of my 'assumption' there Pag. How clever of you to encourage such introspection.

When in fact the only assumption there is the one you have just made.

I was well aware it was parsnip you were delightfully labelling a cunt. But seeing as I share her views I thought I'd join the cunt corner.

I have reflected on my tone. I am happy with it and do not find it unnecessarily harsh. Unlike calling people with opposing views cunts.

Star just keep on doing what you're doing. It's not unreasonable to have a moan or rant on the unfairness of things, it's not unreasonable to worry about the future but kids aren't daft, they will figure it out. Not saying it will be easy, I've said some unforgivable things to my mum when I was still in the my dads my hero phase but I saw sense and she knows I didn't really mean it.

Take on board the good advice you've had and ignore the rest knowing you were never being unreasonable.

It is also very amusing when people who continually start posts with 'it is amusing when/ that/ how, accuse others of being patronising.

No .
I was saying that parsnip had read the thread and thought that the only problem was that people were not being fluffy enough.

I don't understand how she fails to see that several posters were being absolute twats.

So your assessment of what I posts was wrong. Your assumption I was calling parsnip a cunt was wrong
And as I was referring to several posters who wrote really nasty stuff it is odd that you assumed I meant you

It's not psychological evaluation.
It's English.

God it gets worse. Empathy is NOT saying "I have been in the same situation and therefore I have all the answers about what you should do and if you don't follow that you are wrong." That is not helpful support.

Again, different people have different coping mechanisms that are right for them at different stages of their process. what works for you doesn't necessarily work for others.

As for the race to the bottom on this thread where somehow fathers contributing nothing is acceptable, or even desirable, like some badge of martyrdom, words fail me.

Most of the time on Mumsnet I like the support and challenges that the (mostly women I assume) posters give each other. This thread makes me want to delete my account.

OP it sounds like you are doing amazingly one week into this, and your responses are spot on.

I haven't called anyone with an opposing view a cunt. I have called those posting nasty shit, cunts.

See? Different.

stardustnight, if you're thinking about paid work, don't forget that entitled to calculator - you can use it to play around with different figures and different scenarios to see what would work best for you and your kids - you might find, for example, that you are better off working part time if you have just the one income and high childcare costs.

That's maybe a job for another day though.

I agree that getting yourself back out there and talking to people is crucial. Maybe contact your local Gingerbread or other similar lone parent support group? Maybe even your local children's centre runs a group for lone parents? When you're dealing with so much, it's can be very beneficial to be around people who know where you're coming from because they have been there themselves, where you don't have to qualify everything you say with an explanation because they know the score.

demon I you're conveniently ignoring the fact that you've mainly been criticised for your lack of sensitivity and the unpleasant tone of your comments not the opinion you expressed. If you felt the OP was unreasonable or wanted to offer a helpful suggestion you could have simply explained that politely then left it at that. Rather than persistently sniping at her.

I'm rather pleased to see that Demon has the insight to realise who has behaved like a cunt. The self righteous three are tiresome. Why are they still posting? Oh, because it is all about their view being correct. Over and above what OPs children get from their father.

OP, well done for staying calm and rational under more attacks. I'm sure that your marriage has given you the training to deal with it.

You can be angry if you want to though, you can be anything you like. Fuckwit doesn't get a say in how you feel and neither does anyone on here. :)

Freelance am I right in presuming I am one of the self righteous three? Wow comparing the constructive posts the OP has received to her abusive marriage. Wow, just wow.
has

Constructive??????