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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think that woman on the jubilee line is a plain racist

328 replies

casusally · 16/02/2015 21:52

Listening to LBC today and lots of people where saying she did nothing racist saying "you guys used to be slaves". I'm glad the police are taking this seriously. Warning offensive video

www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/woman-comes-forward-after-racist-rant-video-shot-on-jubilee-line-line-train-10049662.html

OP posts:

ExtraJudgeyPants · 17/02/2015 00:20

How can you tell for a fact what the woman is thinking and feeling Chessie?

As that is what we are debating about when considering the reason for her reaction.

Unless you are the woman in the vid

Hubb · 17/02/2015 00:33

I was going on the thread comments and have now watched it...think I jumped the gun on the not behaving as a human thing.... I def still think the slavery comment was racist. And if it wasn't for her accent and slightly bewildered tone she may have got a punch in the face from someone!

hmiwannaknow · 17/02/2015 06:49

Chip on the shoulder is used to silence black people. You are a racist Chessie00

hmiwannaknow · 17/02/2015 06:52

The man was plainly rude. The woman was racist. But according to MN, its being a racist is justifiable.

sashh · 17/02/2015 08:03

He seemed to be quite sexist, she seemed to be racist. I think his accent is west African.

I have had west African students tell Caribbean students their ancestors were stupid because they were caught and sold as slaves (no idea if this is a prevalent attitude or just some people) bu if it is then she said the thing that is going to really hurt him, whether she knew it or not.

CatThiefKeith · 17/02/2015 09:03

Being racist isn't confined to just British white people. I remember being utterly horrified when talking to an Eastern European farm worker when she said 'they expect us to work like blacks'. I assume it was a reference to slavery, but left her company too quickly to have her point clarified. Awful woman.

TheChandler · 17/02/2015 09:04

It was an offensive comment to make. I couldn't say whether its racist or not. I think she said it to justify a lack of racism on her part and the man's aggressive, chip on the shoulder attitude. I suspect she felt threatened and also tried to defend herself.

The man was very, very aggressive and looking for an argument. He seemed to be trying to provoke racist comments from her or others. Its this usual scenario of women being expected to put up with all sorts of offensive behaviour, while racist behaviour attracts immediate condemnation.

iklboo · 17/02/2015 09:16

Chip on the shoulder is used to people from all walks of life in the north here. Nothing to do with race. At all.

BakewellSlice · 17/02/2015 09:21

Not seen this however,

On the point of "chip on shoulder" it is a phrase I've occasionally used of aggressive people. When I think about it more would be men than women. I wouldn't use it to silence people more to explain to someone else why I can no longer be bothered to interact with someone (often because they have made assumptions about me) or why I no longer give their political opinions credence.

TheChandler · 17/02/2015 09:29

I think they both had chips on the shoulder possibly, resulting from racism/sexism they have experienced. But the man really was trying to provoke her. I think he instantly assumed racism from her initial action of telling him not to bump into her, and drew attention to it as a way of objecting. Whats wrong with apologising and sitting down and ignoring, or just giving her an icy glare and ignoring though?

I get where he is coming from - I think I've been subjected to racism when in a country I'm in a minority in - it can sometimes be very subtle and you can find yourself becoming a bit paranoid because the tendency is to view every marginally unpleasant thing that happens to you as being racist. But if I started ranting at everyone that I suspected of being slightly racist, I would come across as a lunatic. And I doubt he would have started on at a man in the same way. I found him a bit out of control and that kind of removed much of the sympathy I would have had towards him otherwise, I actually thought he was on the verge of violence at one point - if there had been no-one else around?

BoneyBackJefferson · 17/02/2015 09:49

Isn't the initial accusation of racism racist itself?

MaidOfStars · 17/02/2015 09:50

I've been accused of racism once (seriously, not Internet keyboard nonsense). It was completely unjustified, deeply upsetting and disturbed me for ages afterwards. Just so unfair and such a dreadful thing to accuse someone of (on a whim, obviously a reasonable accusation is not necessarily unfair or whimsical).

I have to say that I admire her relative calm. I wanted to commit violence, and I definitely shouted.

I think the 'slave' comment was completely unnecessary, and she hasn't helped herself at all. Before that, she was a victim, IMO. After that, people will apply the 'slave' comment and view the whole of the argument with the assumption she is racist. I do think her lack of fluency in English was a part of the issue. But I also think the guy was being desperately unfair to her.

Like my accuser, it's him that saw skin colour and made an assumption. There's an irony there.

MaidOfStars · 17/02/2015 09:52

Boney cross posted my final comment with you. I agree.

TheChandler · 17/02/2015 09:55

BoneyBack Isn't the initial accusation of racism racist itself?

Probably. Its a stereotyped assumption being applied to a particular race or person of a particular racial appearance.

But it will be ignored, because the slave comment is seen as more important than any of the events leading up to it.

Chessie00 · 17/02/2015 16:20

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

thornrose · 17/02/2015 16:36

I would say it is never appropriate to bring up slavery in an argument with a black person! Whether English is your first language or not!

FreudiansSlipper · 17/02/2015 16:40

I am very surprised that you are not aware that chip on your shoulder was used often and sometimes still is to silence black people

now you do perhaps maybe better to use a different term

ohbollocks2u · 17/02/2015 16:52

freudiansSlipper I agreed with all you had said but we in the south say people have a chip on their shoulder and I can assure you it's not a racist remark

funnyossity · 17/02/2015 16:54

I use it in the north of myself and fellow northerners. Offering your mate salt and vinegar to go with said chip(s) is quite normal too.

FreudiansSlipper · 17/02/2015 17:01

I live in the south

I live in London how can it be recognised here but not in the rest of the south

Chesntoots · 17/02/2015 17:18

I've used "chip on his/her/your shoulder" before. It could be about anything - "class", money, looks to name a few. I have never heard of it being racist. It may have been used in a racist manner, but the phrase itself isn't racist.

TheChandler · 17/02/2015 17:19

I have never heard that the phrase "chip on your shoulder" had racist connotations and was therefore banned.

Isn't it rather stereotyping and racist to assume that it refers to black people?

Chesntoots · 17/02/2015 17:19

MaidOfStars · 17/02/2015 17:32

I have never heard that the phrase "chip on your shoulder" had racist connotations and was therefore banned.

Me neither. Can anyone explain the etymology of the phrase? For us hard of thinking people....

FreudiansSlipper · 17/02/2015 17:36

it has never been banned as far as I am aware

but it has certainly been used to silence black people maybe only in London though I doubt it, so pointing this out is not stereotyping

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