to think you shouldn't always make children move for adults on a bus?

[RocketInMyPocket]

Was having a bit of a chit chat with some other mums this morning after dropping of ds.
We were talking about buses, and how people were inconsiderate on them etc.
It made me think of an incident that happened a year or so ago.
Ds was about 4, and dd was 2 and in her buggy.
We had been shopping in town all day, and got the bus home.
It was really packed, I was standing up with the buggy, and ds was sitting next to a lady on a chair near me. There were quite a few people standing.
A lady got on, and asked me if he was my son. I said yes, and she said 'Can you make him move up so I can sit down'.
Now she wasn't a small lady, and neither was the lady he was already sitting next to, he would've been crushed between them!!
I said, 'Well, not really, there isn't exactly room'.
Then she told me to make him move so she could sit down.
I told her no, he had been walking all day, his little legs were knackered and as the bus was so busy I didn't really want him standing, I thought it was much safer for him to be sitting down.
She started going mental about no respect these days blah blah blah.
She was only on the bus for 3 stops .
I have always made ds move on the bus for the elderly, or a pregnant woman etc, but do you think kids should always have to get up for adults on the bus?

This thread has made me feel very old.

And totally out of step with so many people.

I have a solid child (6), very unlikely to fall.

She has as much right to sit as everyone else. I will ask her to get up if someone who has difficulty standing is around (elderly, pregnant, young man with crutches).

it's not about age. It's about who has trouble standing.

Basically people on public transport are rude selfish shits who will do everything they can to hang onto that seat they're sitting on come hell or high water. In my years on MN there have been elderly, disabled, pregnant and young children all left seatless because able bodied adults think the fact they got to the seat first trumps all others' needs who get on after them.

I've been one of those pregnant women who has had to argue to actually get into my own booked seat and seen able bodied adults refuse to get up from elderly people's booked seats.

The general 'my needs are more important than others'' attitude which we often read reflected on MN makes me very very sad. Why wouldn't adults think keeping a child safe on a bus is more important than pulling rank by virtue of the fact they've been alive longer so they had more time to become hardened to other people's needs?

Basically people on public transport are rude selfish shits who will do everything they can to hang onto that seat they're sitting on come hell or high water.

i totally disagree. people always offer my tired looking 3 year old a seat.

No I don't think a child should give their seat to a healthy youngish adult. When on holiday in France, Spain and Italy adults often offered my children their seat which I thought was good as it isn't that safe for small children to stand on a crowded moving bus.

I have trouble standing. I have dodgy knees and frozen shoulders and neck issues so it hurts to hold on. You can't tell though. I look like one of these able bodied middle aged people someone mentioned.

I get up anyway although it hurts. You can't see all issues people have though.

It's just not safe for a small child to be standing on a bus. I agree that if you were both in seats, then your ds could have sat on your knee but that wasn't the case. You'd never find dcs standing in a car, so why is it ok on a bus?
Also, other than truly elderly people, the age argument is ridiculous. I'm 28 and DH is 36 so if there was only one seat, should he get it over me?

No wonder everyone hates public transport.

I don't know why they always pick on the kid OP. Well I do really - they assume that the kid is too young to tell them to bugger off/you're too nice to tell them to ask someone else.

I get funny looks and the occasional tut/sigh when I get on the tram with my kids in their double buggy and then have the temerity to a) sit down next to them and b) chat to them, raising the noise level by about 2 decibels. (NB we live somewhere where there are separate buggy and disabled spaces, so it's not that). OTOH the other day a man got on my tram at 8.20 in the morning with a big smelly dog, popped open a can of high-alcohol beer (think Special Brew) and then the dog barked loudly all the way until the guy started pouring the beer out for it onto the floor of the tram for it to lick up. The tut/sigh brigade were suddenly silent because they were too scared he would make a scene or be violent. As a mum of young children I think you basically get taken for a ride because people assume you're basically nice and polite (and won't cause a stushie in front of your kids) so they think they can just tell you what to do, bully your kids into giving them a seat etc.

We would all be doing ourselves a favour if we were a bit more antisocial on public transport! Imagine: "oh, it's one of those toddler mums, they're a bit unpredictable, I better not say anything"...

I think it is the height of bad manners to ask for a seat that is clearly taken unless you are willing to tell someone that you have a special requirement that makes it more important for you to sit down. We shouldn't have to guess this!

Manners aren't just about showing respect for your elders (although this one is obviously important), it's a whole moral code, including looking after vulnerable people like small children. I think she put you in an awkward and embarrassing position by asking. I feel a little bit cross every time my three year old is left to jolt around on a bus while grown adults sit there reading their phones. I think it just shows such a lack of empathy. To be fair, many times he has been offered a seat.

I always try to keep a look out for someone who needs the seat more than me, it is common courtesy.

About the manners thing, I accept I'm in the minority here, but I think it is the attitudes reflected on this thread that explain why many people behave rudely on public transport ie if you haven't been taught as a child to consider the needs of others when in public (ie offering your seat to a pregnant woman, and yes someone who is your senior, not pushing ahead, helping someone with a cumbersome pushchair, holding a door etc) then they won't see the need to do that when they reach adulthood will they, surely??

I get up anyway although it hurts. You can't see all issues people have though.

You are right, people can't tell. So you have to tell them.

I actually find people are really nice on transport. I once really hurt my back and was standing on a bus and just couldn't take it any more. As I am reasonably young and fit, I was embarrassed to ask someone, but I explained to the guy sitting in front of me that I recently hurt my back and would he be so kind and let me have his seat. The guy just got up and was totally fine with it.

of course they will. being polite and we'll mannered isn't just about elders is it.

I can tell you this much after years of working with the public. I've been sworn at threatened shouted at pushed past had sexual comments or off beside comments made by people of all ages.

being older doesn't exempt someone from being polite themselves. you may think kids are rude for not injuring themselvesstanding up when they are still really small. but assuming people will say "after you" then barge past before you've had a chance go take a single step back is just as bloody rude if not more so.

Surely it applies to everyone not jurist he down to small vulnerable kids to humor rude expectant older people?

excuse typos